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Old 11-02-2009, 01:37 PM
 
7,848 posts, read 18,280,512 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by J'aimeDesVilles View Post
Yeah, I thought afterwards I could have explained this better.

For starters, while the Gulf coast and the Great Lakes are coastal they are still secondary in economic and cultural importance to the Atlantic and Pacific coasts. Trade to and from the wealthier parts of the world, Asia and Europe, is going to be via the Pacific and the Atlantic.

Secondly, much of the South (land and population) is far removed from the coast(s) whereas most of the Northeast is within close proximity to the coast (I am not really going by states as much as regions). Much of the West's land is indeed a great distance from the coast. It's population however is not.

Hopefully this explains my take on the subject a bit better.
Houston and New Orleans, two Gulf Coast ports, are the two largest ports in the U.S. Two others, Tampa and Mobile, are in the top 15.

A huge portion of the population in the states of VA, NC, SC, GA, and FL live within a 2 hour drive of the coast. Some of the South's major cities are coastal...Miami, Norfolk, Virginia Beach, Charleston, Savannah, Jacksonville. Others are an hour away from the coast...Raleigh, Richmond, Columbia. Charlotte is 3 hours away, Atlanta is 4 hours away.
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Old 11-02-2009, 02:48 PM
 
Location: MichOhioigan
1,546 posts, read 2,538,438 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DeaconJ View Post
Houston and New Orleans, two Gulf Coast ports, are the two largest ports in the U.S. Two others, Tampa and Mobile, are in the top 15.

A huge portion of the population in the states of VA, NC, SC, GA, and FL live within a 2 hour drive of the coast. Some of the South's major cities are coastal...Miami, Norfolk, Virginia Beach, Charleston, Savannah, Jacksonville. Others are an hour away from the coast...Raleigh, Richmond, Columbia. Charlotte is 3 hours away, Atlanta is 4 hours away.
All regions contain major cities near the coast. With the exception of Houston and Miami none of these southern cities are that large. And Charleston and Savannah can hardly be considered "major" in any way. Nowhere in the country compares with the Bos-Wash corridor of the Northeast.

On the link below is a pie-chart (pg.7) showing the coastal population by regions. Even combining the Southeast with the Gulf Coast would still give that region only 22% compared to the Pacific's 26% and the Northeast 34%. I admit I was surprised to see the South and the West that close.
http://oceanservice.noaa.gov/program...s_complete.pdf

"Coastal is generally considered to be 50 miles, or sometimes 100 kilometers (62 miles) from the coast. It is pushing it to say one hour away is coastal but not out of bounds. But 3 or 4 hours away? Come on! That is like saying Columbus, Ohio is mountainous or that San Diego is in the desert!
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Old 11-02-2009, 02:51 PM
 
1,201 posts, read 1,989,908 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DinsdalePirahna View Post
The midwest does not attract the creative talent and investment capital that New York and California do.

The ingrained attitudes such as the unwillingness to make bold moves, and the lack of proactivity that will keep the midwest bland. Chicago is the exception.

On the Automotive industry: I would go with kicking out the unions (Bold/proactive move which is just not going to happen in the midwest) and then paying workers fair, competitive wages. The Japanese, Koreans (and its only a matter of time before India and China) are building plants in the South.

In the meantime all these dormant plants are rusting in the midwest. Chrysler recently shut down a plant in the Saint Louis Area. I believe the Ford plant was shut down a few years ago.

If you really want to see the difference, compare Detroit to Southern California (more specifically, Orange County) The top talent migrates to SoCal for the schools and stays for the jobs. This top talent refuses to live in Detroit. Automotive companies understand that by building their main or top level design studios in Southern California.

well, you might as well give the whole ball of wax to new york city, as it is the only city in america that contributed $1.3 trillion gdp. no other city came near a trillion dollars.
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Old 11-02-2009, 02:55 PM
 
Location: Boston
1,432 posts, read 3,350,318 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nickolaseposter View Post
Cleveland. Indianapolis. Dayton. St. Louis. Cincinnati. Grand Rapids. Columbus. Pittsburgh. Toledo. Fort Wayne. Kansas City. Memphis. Chicago. Nashville. Louisville. Peoria. Des Moines. Minneapolis. Detroit. (I'm probably forgetting a few other ones.)
The midwest definitly has an interesting array of cities. But what is going to make it boom the most???

I don't think that we'll have to worry much about competition between the West Coast (California's population is, for the first time in eighty years, seeing a decline) or the East Coast (NY is not growing as much, and the only REALLY fastly growing city is D.C.). The real competition will be between the midwest (north) and the southern states. Cities like Atlanta, Miami, Tampa, Dallas, Houston, Austin, New Orleans. Thats the competition. The midwest has gotta get smart and outwit the southern states. And the BEST way to do that. THE WAY WE'RE GONNA GROW, is by mere affordability. The recession isn't over yet, but when it ends, the markets will rise in a direction where people want to spend their money in a way that they can get more BANG for their BUCK. So what should the midwest do? Not lower their standards, but provide strong middle class housing that is diverse and offers plenty of ammentities. Wanna grow our downtowns? Offer middle class housing downtown or near it. Clean up old houses with character and clean up dirty neighborhoods. It's all about making things look nice, having at least okay schools, and having an affordable, realistic setting. That is whats gonna draw people to your city in the 2010 and even into the 2020's.

Nashville's not in the midwest and it's already booming with a near 20% jump in population since 2000.
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Old 11-02-2009, 03:03 PM
 
7,848 posts, read 18,280,512 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by J'aimeDesVilles View Post
All regions contain major cities near the coast. With the exception of Houston and Miami none of these southern cities are that large. And Charleston and Savannah can hardly be considered "major" in any way. Nowhere in the country compares with the Bos-Wash corridor of the Northeast.

On the link below is a pie-chart (pg.7) showing the coastal population by regions. Even combining the Southeast with the Gulf Coast would still give that region only 22% compared to the Pacific's 26% and the Northeast 34%. I admit I was surprised to see the South and the West that close.
http://oceanservice.noaa.gov/program...s_complete.pdf

"Coastal is generally considered to be 50 miles, or sometimes 100 kilometers (62 miles) from the coast. It is pushing it to say one hour away is coastal but not out of bounds. But 3 or 4 hours away? Come on! That is like saying Columbus, Ohio is mountainous or that San Diego is in the desert!
I agree, 22%/26%/34% are not all that different numbers. So each of those three regions is 1/3 to 1/4 coastal.

I was only listing Atlantic coast cities...and, just to clarify, 62 miles is about a one hour drive. I didn't say that cities 3-4 hours away were "coastal"...just that several southern cities are not THAT far from the coast.

I'm not sure what you're arguing here - I'm not even sure we disagree.
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Old 11-02-2009, 03:09 PM
 
1,247 posts, read 3,431,922 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John Shaft View Post
Not to mention those fantastic winters with -20 temps and feet of snow. That'll bring the gentrificationers (which, actually, you would probably be just as happy not to have, since those are the ones responsible for 600K condos that are made of duct tape and sticks).
Food for thought: Snow is made of WATER!!!!!
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Old 11-02-2009, 03:50 PM
 
1,012 posts, read 2,247,195 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DinsdalePirahna View Post
The midwest does not attract the creative talent and investment capital that New York and California do.

The ingrained attitudes such as the unwillingness to make bold moves, and the lack of proactivity that will keep the midwest bland. Chicago is the exception.

If you really want to see the difference, compare Detroit to Southern California (more specifically, Orange County) The top talent migrates to SoCal for the schools and stays for the jobs. This top talent refuse to live in Detroit.
Bull. Bull. Bull. The Midwest has just as many educated, talented, qualified and creative people as anywhere else. The problem is that the Midwest doesnt have jobs and economic activity that college grads want in today's workforce. The Midwets needs to invest in future economic activities so their grads would stay. If that happens, the grass-is-greener philosophy will be die.
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Old 11-02-2009, 04:15 PM
 
7,848 posts, read 18,280,512 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by krock1dk View Post
Bull. Bull. Bull. The Midwest has just as many educated, talented, qualified and creative people as anywhere else. The problem is that the Midwest doesnt have jobs and economic activity that college grads want in today's workforce. The Midwets needs to invest in future economic activities so their grads would stay. If that happens, the grass-is-greener philosophy will be die.
I agree...but the grass is ALWAYS greener, so that philosophy will probably never die.
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Old 11-03-2009, 02:31 PM
 
389 posts, read 910,882 times
Reputation: 154
Wink Wow this person has no idea what they're talking about

Quote:
Originally Posted by DinsdalePirahna View Post
The midwest does not attract the creative talent and investment capital that New York and California do.

The ingrained attitudes such as the unwillingness to make bold moves, and the lack of proactivity that will keep the midwest bland. Chicago is the exception.
I would just like to say that if anything is boring it is Los Angeles. That is the largest suburb in the world, seriously. Lacking architecture. Lacking innovation. The only thing that made California even boom was a gold rush, pretty beaches, and the movies. Besides that the people themselves didn't make it that unique THEMSELVES. You wanna talk about being boring, look at California, really. Outside of New York City, New York is pretty much a lacking state as well.

Let me inform you that most of the history(underground railroad), art (Jazz music, hip hop), transformational American themes (we're talking big names like Michael Jackson), food (bubble gum, potato chips, hamburger) and pure ingenous (airplane, cash register, computer, modern internet, skyscraper) came from the midwest. Thats a very small list, too. More patents for inventions have come from the midwest than any other part of the country. The midwest has grown naturally, not because of other government afiliiated elements. People are happy here despite tough times and people stick to there VALUES. Just because you lack any idea of the midwest actually is doesn't mean you can spout your mouth off. So, go ahead. Enjoy the increasing cost of living and high taxes of California and New York. But New York and California have not truly defined what America is like the midwest has.
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Old 11-03-2009, 07:48 PM
 
11,177 posts, read 22,391,357 times
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There are plenty of cities that have been doing fine, and will most likely do just fine in the future. I think people pigeon-hole the Midwest into being this area that's all the same with the same people and the same economy and the same jobs.

What about all the medium size metros that are kickin along just fine?? Many areas aren't all manufacturing or depressed - never were.

1980 metro Population:

Madison : 323,545
Des Moines : 367,561
Omaha : 585,122
Sioux Falls : 109,435
Iowa City/Cedar Rapids : 315,683

Total: 1,701,346

1980 metro Population:

Madison : 561,505
Des Moines : 556,230
Omaha : 837,925
Sioux Falls : 232,930
Iowa City/Cedar Rapids : 404,889

Total: 2,593,479

That's a good 50% growth since 1980. It might not be EXPLOSIVE like some areas of the country - but I'm pretty sure most people living in these areas are perfectly fine with not having uncontrolled growth.
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