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Old 11-09-2009, 03:05 PM
 
Location: yeah
5,716 posts, read 14,566,105 times
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If my feelings were hurt, I would have lashed out at you with very mean words. I'm simply pointing out why your argument does not hold up all that well. Little clusters of office buildings around another city are not very comparable.

As for the topic at hand, distance is very relevant. Trekking an hour to San Francisco (without traffic) is not in people's regular schedules. Baltimore and Washington are viewed as very distinct because people generally stick to their own territory, yet those two cities are ten miles closer to each other than San Francisco and San Jose.
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Old 11-10-2009, 01:18 PM
 
12,825 posts, read 20,126,238 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kcee510 View Post
As a life long Bay Area resident I can assure you it is ONE metro. San Jose might be more important when it comes to the tech industry but have you ever been there? It's one giant suburb. It doesn't even come close to matching SF on a cultural level. San Jose struggles just to get tourists to come stay in the city.
I know this rubs fellow Bay Area folk the wrong way, but in the sense of the overall metro, from a bird's eye view, we really are "Los Angeles Del Norte" (albeit with some distinct Victorian and Georgian period accents in places). Without the Eastern half of SF and parts of the Berkeley - Oakland complex, it would be tough to tell us apart from LA.
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Old 11-10-2009, 01:23 PM
 
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Originally Posted by grapico View Post
Ummm the bay area is one metro area, you have a bay, then complete development all the way around it... how is it not? Where should they build, on the water? Or possibly in the mountains going upwards of 4000 feet. There are already 5 giant bridges going over it...
Los Angeles ... Del Norte!
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Old 11-10-2009, 01:26 PM
 
Location: Houston
2,026 posts, read 3,674,141 times
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What about the LA and the Inland Empire? I've heard a lot of people on these boards consider those areas to be in the same metro area. I would think LA and the Inland Empire would closer to being in the same metro than LA and San Diego.
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Old 11-10-2009, 01:27 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aceplace View Post
The rationale behind a MSA is travel and commute patterns. If people do not travel between two areas in sufficient numbers, then those two areas are not part of the same MSA, even if there is a continuous belt of suburban development between them. In that concept, a MSA is equivalent to our general concept of "city".

In the case of SF and San Jose, the local people are not willing to travel between them to the extent required, and that splits them into two independent regions. And they are, in fact, economically and socially independent. Both San Jose and SF-Oakland could survive if they were split and seperated.

The same thing seems to apply to both Washington and Baltimore. They are independent in terms of travel/commute, and have independent economies.

In the case of Dallas-Fort Worth, FW is integrated into the Dallas metro. WE know that because 30% of the local county commutes to jobs in Dallas county. Obviously, the local people believe that it is feasible to travel between Dallas county and and Tarrant county (Fort Worth) for entertainment and jobs. If Tarrant county (Fort Worth) were to be seperated from DFW metro and moved to another part of the state, its economy would collapse. 30% of its workforce would be unemployed.
SJ and Santa Clara County in general have almost no media market. Their "market" is a handful of stations, fitting of some po dunk place with about 100 or 150K people. Why is that? Because most people there listen / watch SF stations. Way, way different from the DC - Baltimore case. Oh, and no major league teams other than the Sharks.

Conversely, if you forget the stupid Federal designation and look at reality, the Bay Area metro has the "correct" number of overall media outlets and sports teams for the overall metro.
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Old 11-10-2009, 01:31 PM
 
12,825 posts, read 20,126,238 times
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Originally Posted by UrbanLover View Post
It makes PERFECT sense to me as to why San JOse is not included in the MSA.
It makes no sense to me.

I've lived in San Francisco, San Mateo, Santa Clara, Alameda and Contra Costa Counties.

I've worked in San Mateo, Santa Clara and Alameda Counties.

The permutations were many.
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Old 11-10-2009, 01:32 PM
 
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Somehow the MSA studies done by the Feds miss lots of folks who commute from CoCo and Alameda Counties to Santa Clara County. I am confident of this.
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Old 11-10-2009, 01:34 PM
 
12,825 posts, read 20,126,238 times
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Originally Posted by gogetta View Post
It is funny how people from outside the Bay Area try to tell us from the Bay Area what actually is the Bay Area lol.
Well them, plus, Krudmonk, the lone orchardist hold out down in the South Bay - "danged city slickers, they ain't gonna include MY ORCHARD in their danged MSA!"
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Old 11-10-2009, 01:41 PM
 
12,825 posts, read 20,126,238 times
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Originally Posted by frsno1 View Post
Sigh....do I really have to be that specific. I meant there is no vacant land that can be developed that is neither protected, the bay, or a mountain between San Francisco and San Jose. I mean this in a general sense. Hell, there are vacant lots in all cities.

Again I was talking about the urban corridor between the two cities. I can see the argument that they both can function independent from each other as far as jobs and what not, but now it's getting ridiculous to say that the the Bay Area is not solidly urbanized between SF and SJ.
My question on this one has always been, where to draw the line? Lawrence Expwy? 85? Woodside Road? 92? Etc?

It's not like there is some convenient cut off. Certain, the Santa Clara - San Mateo County Line is meaningless. I should know, I can practically see it out my window, sitting here in an office in EPA.
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Old 11-10-2009, 01:52 PM
 
Location: Atlanta
7,732 posts, read 12,146,101 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wpmeads View Post
What about the LA and the Inland Empire? I've heard a lot of people on these boards consider those areas to be in the same metro area. I would think LA and the Inland Empire would closer to being in the same metro than LA and San Diego.
They most certainly are the same metro. Perhaps the Census doesn't consider them to be, but they definately are.

L.A. & San Diego, not for a long time.
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