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Old 12-18-2009, 08:28 PM
 
Location: Arkansas
38 posts, read 96,211 times
Reputation: 40

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danielj72: Don't forget the biggest "bad decision maker" of them all for the South...Jeff Davis. He kept that list of fools in positions where they could do their damage.

I can picture how much better it would have been for the Army of TN if my favorite Forrest, or perhaps Cleburne, or even if Longstreet was finally given command of an Army as he wished. Longstreet was picky and wanted things his way, but when he got motivated and had support from his staff, he hit like a ton of bricks. See Chickamauga for an example and that was with the fool Bragg in the picture too! He did a ncie job of saving Stonewall's tail at 2nd Manassas in 62 as well.

Sorry for getting off topic, just had to respond.
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Old 12-18-2009, 08:58 PM
 
Location: Somewhere below Mason/Dixon
6,509 posts, read 7,456,802 times
Reputation: 10908
Quote:
Originally Posted by ty1969 View Post
danielj72: Don't forget the biggest "bad decision maker" of them all for the South...Jeff Davis. He kept that list of fools in positions where they could do their damage.

I can picture how much better it would have been for the Army of TN if my favorite Forrest, or perhaps Cleburne, or even if Longstreet was finally given command of an Army as he wished. Longstreet was picky and wanted things his way, but when he got motivated and had support from his staff, he hit like a ton of bricks. See Chickamauga for an example and that was with the fool Bragg in the picture too! He did a ncie job of saving Stonewall's tail at 2nd Manassas in 62 as well.

Sorry for getting off topic, just had to respond.

Your right Jeff Davis appointed too many political generals that turned out to be clowns. I also agree with you regarding Longstreet. He would have been a great choice to command in the west. Forrest was a great cavalry general, a huge asset to the confederacy but im not sure he would have been right for such a major command. Longstreet did prove himself at chickamauga as you mentioned, he proved himself in the east countless times. Had Lee listened to him at Gettysburg things may have turned out different there as well. Longstreets resume would have beat most others had Davis properly selected his top commanders.
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Old 12-20-2009, 11:03 AM
 
10,167 posts, read 17,110,365 times
Reputation: 5741
Quote:
Originally Posted by danielj72 View Post
General Hood, ya he ranks right up there with the worst of the generals fighting for dixie. He was in good company with Bragg and pemberton ( and his boss, "no show Joe"). These fellas lost the war for the confederacy..

LOL I just GOTTA quibble a bit with this one about Gen. Hood!

But then again, to be honest with myself, you are pretty much right.

There is an old axiom of the day that goes along the lines of, that, everyone rises to their own level of incompetence! Hood was proof of it.

As a brigade and division commander, he was the best of the best (the "Texas Brigade" was the best fighting outfit in the Confederacy and has been consistently ranked by military historians as such). However, when he commanded a full army, he was a disaster for the South.

He was just too aggressive. It worked well when under the command of higher-ranking generals who could see the larger picture. But when he became "the man", he just lacked that overall vision and temperment to grasp what was happening. He went on the offensive against a much larger and better equipped army...and lost every battle he fought...

*rueful grin* In fact, that old classic of early America? The Yellow Rose of Texas? It was a a favorite marching song of the Confederate armies. After Hood lost the war in the "Western Theatre"...some wag penned the verse:

Now I'm going southward, for my heart if full of woe
I'm going back to Georgia, to see my Uncle Joe...
You may talk about your Beauregard and sing of General Lee
But the gallant Hood of Texas, played hell in Tennesse....
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Old 12-20-2009, 01:39 PM
 
Location: Arkansas
38 posts, read 96,211 times
Reputation: 40
TexasReb:

I'm not a huge fan of Hood, but I would be remiss if I did not bring up these points. You are 100% correct about his brigade & divisional command capabilities. I know Robert E. Lee thought much of him at those levels, but wasn't so hot on him as Commander of an entire Army; especially after his horrible injuries. I also feel Hood's injuries / amputation; and from what I have read; his seeming addiction to opium and other painkillers common in that time, caused him to be a very bad commander. I am a strong beleiver Forrest or Longstreet, with Patrick Cleburne as 2nd in command would have made the Army of TN into a western version of the Army of NVA, but more focused on defensive than Lee. Anotehr topic totally, but Lee was too offensive minded for the inferior numbers he had. He knew defensive and was superb at it (see Cold Harbor and Fredericksburg!), but he almost always wanted to attack. If he'd had the North's number and some better industry production / number of artillery behind him...God help the opposition, because Lee would have been nearly impossible to defeat! He was pretty tough already...

After Gettysburg, Hood was a shell of the man he'd been physically. When in command of the Army of TN, its common to read about aids having to strap Hood onto his horse because he was so bombed on opiates to control his pain, he'd fall off the horse without being stapped in.

ty1969
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Old 12-20-2009, 01:45 PM
 
Location: Denver
6,628 posts, read 12,504,196 times
Reputation: 4054
I'd say Charleston, SC and Columbia, SC. I went to the Low Country Oyster Roast in Charleston a few years ago. It was at the plantation which Forest Gump was filmed...absolutely gorgeous. You entered the Roast by driving down the road where the famous "Run Forest! Run!" scene was filmed.

It was beautiful, classic South. Columbia hasn't progressed out of the era of the Civil War, so it's also a good place to check out how the South was back in the mid-1800s. (Sorry Columbia-lovers, I'm a Clemson guy so I have to hate on Columbia )
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Old 12-20-2009, 02:06 PM
 
1,645 posts, read 3,191,107 times
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This is a great thread!

I'm planning to stop at a few Southern locations on the way northward after my stay in New Orleans, next week: I'm planning to visit St. Francisville, LA; Breaux Bridge, LA; Natchez, MS; Vicksburg, MS; Oxford, MS; Memphis, TN; and Nashville, TN.

I think there is a lot of great cultural history in Alabama and Georgia as well. The Deep South = America's most unappreciated gem.
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Old 12-20-2009, 03:39 PM
 
11,874 posts, read 32,904,313 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ReluctantGardenStater View Post
This is a great thread!

I'm planning to stop at a few Southern locations on the way northward after my stay in New Orleans, next week: I'm planning to visit St. Francisville, LA; Breaux Bridge, LA; Natchez, MS; Vicksburg, MS; Oxford, MS; Memphis, TN; and Nashville, TN.

I think there is a lot of great cultural history in Alabama and Georgia as well. The Deep South = America's most unappreciated gem.
What a wonderful trip!! You're hitting some of my favorite places: New Orleans, Natchez, Vicksburg, Oxford, Memphis, and Nashville. It sounds like you're going to experience quite a bit of the Old South and then end your trip in a great New South city (Nashville).

Last edited by JMT; 12-20-2009 at 04:14 PM.. Reason: Had to capitalize New Orleans.
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Old 12-20-2009, 04:13 PM
 
1,645 posts, read 3,191,107 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JMT View Post
What a wonderful trip!! You're hitting some of my favorite places: new Orleans, Natchez, Vicksburg, Oxford, Memphis, and Nashville. It sounds like you're going to experience quite a bit of the Old South and then end your trip in a great New South city (Nashville).
I am quite excited indeed as I have been planning this since I got back from Tennessee in late August and wanted to see more of the beautiful South. East Tennessee is one of the prettiest places in the U.S. with some of the nicest people I've met anywhere, and beautiful Southern girls as well . I was quite impressed with Knoxville and the surrounding countryside around the Great Smoky Mountains, though did not get a chance to see Chattanooga.

So this trip I will get a chance to explore two states I haven't yet had a chance to see, Louisiana and Mississippi, as well as some more of beautiful Tennessee (definately one of my favorite states I've been to).
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Old 12-20-2009, 07:29 PM
 
Location: Floribama
14,962 posts, read 31,357,878 times
Reputation: 13766
Quote:
Originally Posted by ReluctantGardenStater View Post
I am quite excited indeed as I have been planning this since I got back from Tennessee in late August and wanted to see more of the beautiful South. East Tennessee is one of the prettiest places in the U.S. with some of the nicest people I've met anywhere, and beautiful Southern girls as well . I was quite impressed with Knoxville and the surrounding countryside around the Great Smoky Mountains, though did not get a chance to see Chattanooga.

So this trip I will get a chance to explore two states I haven't yet had a chance to see, Louisiana and Mississippi, as well as some more of beautiful Tennessee (definately one of my favorite states I've been to).
Don't expect Memphis to be anything like eastern TN, I've been there plenty of times and it's certainly not my cup of tea.

If you really want to experience the deep south in Mississippi, go to some of the smaller towns along the gulf coast like Lucedale or Wiggins. If you come to Alabama you could cruise around the towns of Bayou La Batre and Coden (south of Mobile), you'll feel like you're in Forrest Gump. Stop by Mary's Place and get some seafood, you won't find any fresher.

And don't rule out the Florida panhandle either, it's very much still part of the deep south, unlike South Florida.
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Old 12-20-2009, 08:04 PM
 
3,644 posts, read 8,998,915 times
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Memphis has really nice areas. You can go miles and miles in the city limits and not be in the ghetto. Some of the nicest houses I've ever seen are in Memphis.
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