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Old 06-10-2007, 08:29 PM
 
609 posts, read 2,721,293 times
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Houston Proper is bigger
Dallas MSA (as recognized by the US Census Bureau) is larger than Houston's MSA.

The Census recognizes the DFW area as one metro area with two PMSA's within the one MSA.
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Old 06-10-2007, 09:26 PM
 
Location: Texas
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Dallas MSA? You must been Dallas-Fort Worth MSA? Isn't Dallas' MSA called Dallas-Irving-Plano?
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Old 06-11-2007, 09:03 AM
 
Location: In God
3,073 posts, read 10,767,418 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Guerilla View Post
Dallas MSA? You must been Dallas-Fort Worth MSA? Isn't Dallas' MSA called Dallas-Irving-Plano?
Exactly. People always dispute my argument about how North Texas counts its people. Dallas-Fort Worth against Houston. You pairing two major cities against one. Of course that MSA is going to be bigger. But, Dallas and Fort Worth are two different cities...two different cities that if separated in count, would not have a MSA larger than Houston.
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Old 06-11-2007, 05:03 PM
 
609 posts, read 2,721,293 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mpope409 View Post
Exactly. People always dispute my argument about how North Texas counts its people. Dallas-Fort Worth against Houston. You pairing two major cities against one. Of course that MSA is going to be bigger. But, Dallas and Fort Worth are two different cities...two different cities that if separated in count, would not have a MSA larger than Houston.
This why they are called PMSA's.

Dallas and Ft. worth are two PMSA's that make up a MSA.

But North Texas is considered a single region...just like Minneapolis/St. Paul. St. Paul is a city in its own right, but people think regionally now in urban studies...not just by the proper population as I have illustrated many times...ie Atlanta, GA having only 483,000 people when other cities like INdianapolis or Milwaukee have more.
ANother example is Kansas City. Kansas City, KS is a city in its own right.

So is Oakland, CA,
So is San Jose.
But they talk a/b the Bay Area, not just the individual cities that make up the Bay Area b/c it is a region...

If we just talk proper populations only, then we can start talking a/b San Antonio, Louisville, KT, etc as being major cities, but they're not. THe MSA is more reflective of the area. As in the example of Atlanta or St. Louis.
NO one will ever think of Omaha as being bigger than St. Louis...though Omaha Proper is bigger than St. Louis.

No one will think of Arlington, TX, which has 359,000 people as bigger or more major than St. Louis, it's viewed as a suburb in the DFW area.

So, yes, Houston proper is bigger. But then again, to most urban economist...that's fine, but it's not completely reflective.

the DFW is a MSA that is recognized by the US Census Bureau as being one metropolitan area, there is the Dallas PMSA, and the Ft. Worth-Arlington PMSA that make up the MSA. That's how it's calculated.

So yes there are two cities, but most people think regionally now b/c it's more reflective of the area in which you live...ie Atlanta, St. Louis, Bay Area.

If you just look at SF, it's really not that big...and there are plenty of cities larger than it, but let's face it, SF is big, it's major, it's the principle city in what they call the Bay Area...and Oakland, despite being its own city in its own right, is part of the Bay area...and when people think of how big SF is...they're including the surrounding population.

B/c it's just a matter of boundaries, where one city begins and another ends. Houston has a large population, but it's square area is huge...so if they move the boundaries by one half, then all of a sudden the houston surrounding area has even more people and houston proper only has 1 million, but it's still the same...5.5 million people live in the Houston area and call it home.

But this can be debated over and over again on several different threads now...it will still be the same basic argument: The regionalists vs. the city proper people...but it all boils down to what statistic can be marketed in that particular person's favor...in Houston's case...it's the city proper...in DFW's, it's the MSA stat.

But let's not get confused here...DFW is a single MSA, not two different MSA's. It's two PMSA's added together to make one big MSA...just like San Francisco/Oakland, or KC/KC, or Minneapolis/St. Paul, or Seattle/Tacoma.

All these examples have a smaller secondary principle city embedded in the region..but overall, the region acts as a unit.
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Old 06-11-2007, 05:11 PM
 
Location: Texas
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Oh okay. The Dallas-Irving-Plano PMSA, and the Fort Worth-Arlington PMSA. Despite Houston's large size, the density is VERY close to Dallas'.
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Old 06-11-2007, 05:19 PM
 
Location: Chicago
53 posts, read 327,215 times
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Houston is disgustingly humid as it's right by the Gulf of Mexico. Think you can handle that?
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Old 06-11-2007, 06:01 PM
 
Location: In God
3,073 posts, read 10,767,418 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AngryTypingGuy View Post
Houston is disgustingly humid as it's right by the Gulf of Mexico. Think you can handle that?
The heat is not as oppressive as many people will lead you to believe. It's a lot worse in the rest of Texas. There are many many days throughout the year where Houston is a little cooler and windy. Thanks to the overcasts.
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Old 06-11-2007, 06:03 PM
 
Location: Katy-zuela
4,852 posts, read 8,991,752 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mpope409 View Post
The heat is not as oppressive as many people will lead you to believe. It's a lot worse in the rest of Texas. There are many many days throughout the year where Houston is a little cooler and windy. Thanks to the overcasts.
No wonder I fainted in San Antonio. Houston and San Antonio are like Los Angeles and Las Vegas respectively. Las Vegas is way too hot. I wanted to go to L.A. so bad after arriving in L.V. It was too hot and too DRY. I thought that L.A.'s location near the sea was going to make it more humid than Las Vegas.
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Old 06-11-2007, 06:06 PM
 
Location: In God
3,073 posts, read 10,767,418 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by metroplex2003 View Post
This why they are called PMSA's.

Dallas and Ft. worth are two PMSA's that make up a MSA.

But North Texas is considered a single region...just like Minneapolis/St. Paul.
No one will think of Arlington, TX, which has 359,000 people as bigger or more major than St. Louis, it's viewed as a suburb in the DFW area.

So, yes, Houston proper is bigger. But then again, to most urban economist...that's fine, but it's not completely reflective.

the DFW is a MSA that is recognized by the US Census Bureau as being one metropolitan area, there is the Dallas PMSA, and the Ft. Worth-Arlington PMSA that make up the MSA. That's how it's calculated.

So yes there are two cities, but most people think regionally now b/c it's more reflective of the area in which you live...ie Atlanta, St. Louis, Bay Area.


B/c it's just a matter of boundaries, where one city begins and another ends. Houston has a large population, but it's square area is huge...so if they move the boundaries by one half, then all of a sudden the houston surrounding area has even more people and houston proper only has 1 million, but it's still the same...5.5 million people live in the Houston area and call it home.

But this can be debated over and over again on several different threads now...it will still be the same basic argument: The regionalists vs. the city proper people...but it all boils down to what statistic can be marketed in that particular person's favor...in Houston's case...it's the city proper...in DFW's, it's the MSA stat.

But let's not get confused here...DFW is a single MSA, not two different MSA's. It's two PMSA's added together to make one big MSA...just like San Francisco/Oakland, or KC/KC, or Minneapolis/St. Paul, or Seattle/Tacoma.

All these examples have a smaller secondary principle city embedded in the region..but overall, the region acts as a unit.

All of this is fine as long as no one ever makes the mistake of saying that Dallas is bigger than Houston because they will be incorrect. No matter how you spin it. They may be "equal" in importance, but Houston is bigger than Dallas through and through. Nobody that lives on the Fort Worth side of the Metroplex is going to say that they live in Dallas.
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Old 06-11-2007, 06:12 PM
 
1,008 posts, read 3,731,099 times
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I would agree that people, in my opinion, are inflating the whole weather issue. If it was that humid and foul then how do 2+ million people survive?
I'm sure that there are people who don't have or can't afford air conditioning and regardless you can't have air conditioning round the clock. Sooner or later you will have to go to the store, park your car and WALK to shop.

Speaking of Chicago: I suggest all Texans experience this wonderful city at least once. Take your family on a vacation for 2 weeks and see what Chi-Town is all about. People for the most part are very friendly and the city has that "city/feel." Downtown is good for sightseeing but if you want culture get in to the smaller neighborhoods. Sports, food, a nice movie and a stroll down lake Michigan....While you're at it check out the Cubs at Wrigley Field
What can I say, I LOVE to travel.
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