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Old 09-18-2013, 10:08 PM
 
10,238 posts, read 19,515,227 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DubbleT View Post
The industrial north indirectly benefited from that same slave labor, they also had their own version of cheap immigrant labor.
The KKK did start out as a social club for former confederate soldiers and rapidly spiraled into something sinister. It may have begun in the south but as you point out it had influence in many other ares of the country.
So why, when people talk about these things, is it always made to seem as this is something exclusive to the south? As if other areas of the country had absolutely no hand in any of this? The finger pointing and the tsk-tsking about the 'evil south' are hypocritical at best.
Exactly! Perhaps the reason is that those who do it have grown up on such revisionist history which makes it into a morality play where a righteous North was motivated by an altruistic desire to reform a horrid netherworld South! This blissful ignorance gives them the luxury of being able to ignore their own region's role in the history of slavery in the country...and the profits made off the slave-trade. The slave-trade was a purely northern commodity (not a single slave ship was ever chartered out of a Southern port).

I freely admit I get a certain gleeful pleasure in posting links such as the below, in order to poke holes into myths of history perpetuated by the type above:

Slavery in the North

Slavery Denial

Northern Profits from Slavery
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Old 09-18-2013, 10:43 PM
 
10,238 posts, read 19,515,227 times
Reputation: 5943
Quote:
=Mutiny77;31408707]I'm sure you do. I'm also sure that you're unaware of the huge implications that would have for the Union at large, which in all likelihood would not exist in its present form sans the South.
LOL Oh, don't waste your time defending the South against the likes of tfalcon. This person's pathological hatred for the South is a matter of record, and -- really -- who gives a damn what the character thinks, anyway?

*considering, though* I must admit the person does not limit the ranting and raving to only the South (although that is most of it). Actually, if one runs across and reads his posts on any subject, it seems s/he has a delusional superiority complex and disdains most people equally! LOL
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Old 09-19-2013, 07:34 PM
 
Location: Florida
861 posts, read 1,449,281 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeromeville View Post
So why then does everyone in the South ask what church you go to?
Oh, the horror.
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Old 09-20-2013, 09:56 AM
 
47 posts, read 91,188 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mutiny77 View Post
Born and raised in the South, still live here, and I've never been asked clear out of the blue where I go to church. Whenever I have, it was relevant to the conversation that was being had at the time. But then again, I'm Black--which leads me to this: I think it's also worth pointing out here that I think a lot of these stereotypes are mostly confined to White Southerners. Blacks in the South are just as religious, but you won't get asked clear out of the blue about your church. It's also very uncommon for Whites to ask Blacks about that since most churches on the whole are segregated, more or less.
FYI, I have even been asked by a black acquaintance to attend church with her. Yes, really. And I am white.
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Old 09-20-2013, 10:11 AM
 
47 posts, read 91,188 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hdwell View Post
Church along with sports is basically life in the south. Anyone claiming that they have never been asked, probably doesn't get out much.
Exactly. People ask. They just do. At least where I live (northwest Arkansas). Church is just a way of life for folks here. I don't usually get asked by other transplants, just the people born and raised around here. It is so ingrained in their way of life that they just want you to come join their bible study group (e.g. - "we have a great women's group", or, "our couples bible study group has lots of people your age.")

What is even worse is that my son (3rd grade) started getting asked last year to go to church or join in church activities. I've let him attend, and it only brings on more invites. So, enough of that. He joined boy scouts this year and low and behold, we got a package from his leader about HER church, with the polite comment from her to parents that it was "just in case" we hadn't found a church we like yet. We've been here a decade. If we wanted a church, we would go find one ourselves, thank you!

On another note, more related to the OP's question about conformity, a story my son told me made me very sad last year. Apparently there was a boy in his class who didn't believe in God. My son told me how other kids were ridiculing him and making fun of how "dumb" he was. WTF? A second grader being teased for not believing in God? Seriously?

So yes, pressure to conform is greater in the south. People may not treat me like a freak for not being a church-goer, but there are many people I am not as close with simply because their best friends are those who go to their church.
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Old 09-20-2013, 10:18 AM
 
47 posts, read 91,188 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hdwell View Post
By the way I certainly do "get around". So I can't say how it is you meet up with so many wanting to save your soul.
Your "King of the Road" subtitle leads me to believe you are male, yes? My husband is not asked nearly as often as am I. Indeed, he has only been asked when with me. He did have a church-going friend give him some literature (on creation science), but that is the extent of it. When we attended a family Christmas party whose hosting couple had a son our age, I predicted that (knowing they are Baptist), they may try to get at us through our son. He thought not. When we returned home from the party, our son showed us the pocket-sized version of the New Testament. Ha! So predictable.
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Old 09-20-2013, 10:29 AM
 
47 posts, read 91,188 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DubbleT View Post
The church thing is just one more overblown stereotype. I get a few comments and invitations whenever I move somewhere new, a few flyers in my mailbox or on my door. I also get solicitations from local lawyers, doctors, dentist, etc. I really don't see it as people trying to conform me as much as it is a question of 'do you need a recommendation' newbie type of thing. Once established in a new area it does NOT usually come up in random conversations.
I find this laughable. The part about how you get a few comments and invites and see it at doctors and dentists. Yes, even doctors and dentists here post bible quotes and their little agape love fish. I have gotten used to that, really. But if one is not Christian, it certainly can me one feel like a bit of an outsider.

I love where I live. I love the people. And politics (thankfully) only come up occasionally and most people seem to be respectful of others' points of view. And yes, when I politely turn down people, they usually stop with the church talk. But it isn't an overblown stereotype. I am thinking that perhaps if you are Christian, you don't notice it as much. But being secular, I notice it. And it is really bothering me that my son is now feeling the need to go to church. NOT because he really believes in Jesus, mind you, but because all his friends go. If that isn't conformity, I don't know what is.
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Old 09-20-2013, 11:07 AM
 
Location: Houston
1,473 posts, read 2,139,232 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MLLM123 View Post
I find this laughable. The part about how you get a few comments and invites and see it at doctors and dentists. Yes, even doctors and dentists here post bible quotes and their little agape love fish. I have gotten used to that, really. But if one is not Christian, it certainly can me one feel like a bit of an outsider.

I love where I live. I love the people. And politics (thankfully) only come up occasionally and most people seem to be respectful of others' points of view. And yes, when I politely turn down people, they usually stop with the church talk. But it isn't an overblown stereotype. I am thinking that perhaps if you are Christian, you don't notice it as much. But being secular, I notice it. And it is really bothering me that my son is now feeling the need to go to church. NOT because he really believes in Jesus, mind you, but because all his friends go. If that isn't conformity, I don't know what is.
what a asurd statement.. most people are conformist by nature it has nothing to do it where you are act.. people conform to a host of things... Sorry most people just do not like to be the outsider... if it not church it will be a sports team, or style of clothing, or how they talk.... Few people will break from the mode.. stop spreading this myth that someone from say NYC is least conformist than say someone from Texas.. The only diffrence is what they conform too...

Example I have friend from Nyc who actually likes Times square but does not go because he thinks that native NYC consider it uncool , tourist spots.. never mind that he likes it.. guess what he just did ..conformed
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Old 09-20-2013, 11:19 AM
 
Location: A Yankee in northeast TN
15,966 posts, read 20,923,733 times
Reputation: 43202
Quote:
Originally Posted by MLLM123 View Post
I find this laughable. The part about how you get a few comments and invites and see it at doctors and dentists. Yes, even doctors and dentists here post bible quotes and their little agape love fish. I have gotten used to that, really. But if one is not Christian, it certainly can me one feel like a bit of an outsider.

I love where I live. I love the people. And politics (thankfully) only come up occasionally and most people seem to be respectful of others' points of view. And yes, when I politely turn down people, they usually stop with the church talk. But it isn't an overblown stereotype. I am thinking that perhaps if you are Christian, you don't notice it as much. But being secular, I notice it. And it is really bothering me that my son is now feeling the need to go to church. NOT because he really believes in Jesus, mind you, but because all his friends go. If that isn't conformity, I don't know what is.
No, actually I'm atheist.
I'm not sure why you find it laughable. I have coffee cup or two, several pens and pencils, refrigerator magnets, bookmarks, etc with the names of various local business people on them, all received within the first few months of moving here. Along with a couple of religious tracts, one visit from the church around the corner and a handful of invites from people I've met through work, etc. Pretty much the same stuff I always get when moving somewhere new. I don't see how getting a bookmark from the church is all that different from getting a pen from the insurance guy, they both are advertising their 'business' and hoping you'll come to them for your needs. Generally a polite 'thanks, but I'm not interested' is all it takes.
Maybe I'm just an odd duck but for me that old tolerance thing goes both ways. When I have a co-worker (who knows I'm atheist) ask me to a church related gathering I don't jump to the conclusion that they want to indoctrinate me to their beliefs, sometimes it's just a social invitation. "Hey, we are going to do something fun, would you like to join us?" and when I turn those down it's not a big deal, nobody looks down on me or thinks less of me because of it.
So yeah, I do see it as an overblown stereotype when people talk as if you can't have a social life without going to church, or that religion intrudes into conversations at every turn. This former yankee has lived all over the south and that has just never been my experience.
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Old 09-20-2013, 11:57 AM
 
47 posts, read 91,188 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DubbleT View Post
this former yankee has lived all over the south and that has just never been my experience.
Good for you. I mean that. My experience just has not been the same. Are you also a man? I am a woman, and I am not sure if it is that, or just where I live. I do know that I complained to a like-minded friend who moved here from Alabama and she assured me it is much worse where she is from. But another poster from Alabama says this has never happened to her. Go figure.
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