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I agree with your statements. And ironically, us Virginians don't consider Houstoun, Texas, the South . I think that dressing casually is relative though. In the South, actually many people are very formally dressed- or at least they used to be. But the clothing choices are slightly different. Southern Gentlemen wear lighter suits- grey, navy, white, etc, never pinned stripped or black. Thats considered too New York-ish. Overcoats are rare. Southern ladies often wear hats, pearls, and dresses and lots of perfume .
This does not shock me. You have North Carolinians who also say Texas is not the south. But you have Texans and Louisianians that say North Carolina and Virginia is not really Southern. It's regional. The only states out of the four I just named that are truly southern to the core are North Carolina and Louisiana. Texas and Virginia are Southern but you feel the southern vibe getting less and less as you enter Northern Virginia and when you enter the San Antonio/Austin areas. I've lived in both Texas and Virginia both have southern traits but are transition states. You can easily say Texas is Southern as well as Western and you easily say Virginia is Southern as well as Northern.
Do not speak for all Virginians. Speak for yourself. My family in Virginia look at us, here in Houston and Georgia, as the southern half of the family, and the northern half of the family is in Virginia, Jersey, and Brooklyn. It snows probably every year in Virginia, it hardly snows in Georgia. Also, you should keep in mind that Virginia is not even in the Sunbelt.
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It snows all the time in the mountains of Virginia. North Carolina also receives snow every year as does Kentucky. It rarely snows in the Hampton Roads towards Richmond. NOVA does receive a good bit of snow. But not as much like Chicago or Philadelphia or New York.
This does not shock me. You have North Carolinians who also say Texas is not the south. But you have Texans and Louisianians that say North Carolina and Virginia is not really Southern. It's regional. The only states out of the four I just named that are truly southern to the core are North Carolina and Louisiana. Texas and Virginia are Southern but you feel the southern vibe getting less and less as you enter Northern Virginia and when you enter the San Antonio/Austin areas. I've lived in both Texas and Virginia both have southern traits but are transition states. You can easily say Texas is Southern as well as Western and you easily say Virginia is Southern as well as Northern.
Virginia is definitely NOT in the north. If you want to classify Northern Virginia as being something other than southern, please at least call it Mid-Atlantic. It's a total disregard for history to say an area (NOVA) with streets named Lee Highway and Rebel Run, and schools such as Stonewall Jackson, is northern. The transplants around MD/DC/VA made the area a cultural mixing bowl, but the history of the area, and the FEW longtime residents of Northern Virginia still hold onto those slight, but definite, southern traits.
I do agree, however, that Virginia is likely the "least southern" of the southern states. Many accents, with the exception of Southwestern Virginia's and the southern Shenandoah Valley's, are not that "southern sounding." Many residents of areas in central, southeastern, and northern Virginia do not have southern accents of any sort, unless they are from someplace farther south. However, accents are not everything, and like I said earlier, I believe history should take precedence over everything.
If you want to go into history. Then you have to add Maryland and Delware to the mix as well. And the key word you used was few. Yes, "few" in NOVA still hold onto the southern traits. But the southern feel of the area no matter the history of NOVA is disappearing because of so many New Yorkers, Philadelphians, Bostonians, and people overseas moving into the area. I wasn't around here 20 years ago. But I assume this place was much different than it was at that time.
But there is no doubt in my mind that NOVA is the transition area to the south or to the north in whatever way you are going.
Do not speak for all Virginians. Speak for yourself. My family in Virginia look at us, here in Houston and Georgia, as the southern half of the family, and the northern half of the family is in Virginia, Jersey, and Brooklyn. It snows probably every year in Virginia, it hardly snows in Georgia. Also, you should keep in mind that Virginia is not even in the Sunbelt.
What I don't understand is how if I'm all the way down here, I'm less qualified to say what's the south then you, who's all the way up there. The only way anybody could not consider the eastern half of Texas southern is because they have not really been there.
Well that doesn't speak for most Virginians. Inform your family that your southern roots are Virginia and Georgia. Your Western roots are Texas and your yankee roots are Brooklyn and New Jersey. And yes, Virginia IS in the sunbelt. In fact all the Northern Virginia suburbs started in the late 60s and early 1970s because of the new people coming in because of air conditioning. It was part of the sun belt movement when businesses started moving to Virginia and points south.
All the way up there? I'm much more east of you than north of you. I am only an hour or so from the North Carolina line.
How you can put Virginia in the same category as New Jersey or Brooklyn is absurd to me. I have more in common with people from China than I do New Jersey or Brooklyn. My belief is more relative to the state because I grew up here. You didn't grow up in Virginia.
Virginia is part of The Old South , I have an idea about what southern is. Texas is hardly the Old South. Its the Western frontier.
Virginia is definitely NOT in the north. If you want to classify Northern Virginia as being something other than southern, please at least call it Mid-Atlantic. It's a total disregard for history to say an area (NOVA) with streets named Lee Highway and Rebel Run, and schools such as Stonewall Jackson, is northern. The transplants around MD/DC/VA made the area a cultural mixing bowl, but the history of the area, and the FEW longtime residents of Northern Virginia still hold onto those slight, but definite, southern traits.
I do agree, however, that Virginia is likely the "least southern" of the southern states. Many accents, with the exception of Southwestern Virginia's and the southern Shenandoah Valley's, are not that "southern sounding." Many residents of areas in central, southeastern, and northern Virginia do not have southern accents of any sort, unless they are from someplace farther south. However, accents are not everything, and like I said earlier, I believe history should take precedence over everything.
But visit any Southern state- and the "accents" are dissapearing. I met a gal from Voldosta, Georgia, - born and raised and she sounds like she could be from Orange County, California !
Other than the low educational attainment, I can't think of any way DC is like a southern city.
FROM CITY-DATA.COM
For population 25 years and over in Washington
High school or higher: 77.8%
Bachelor's degree or higher: 39.1%
Graduate or professional degree: 21.0%
While the high school or higher % is lower than the national average (80%), its college educated population is among the highest in the nation. In fact, some of the most educated counties in the United States are in the Washington, DC metro area.
Well that doesn't speak for most Virginians. Inform your family that your southern roots are Virginia and Georgia. Your Western roots are Texas and your yankee roots are Brooklyn and New Jersey. And yes, Virginia IS in the sunbelt. In fact all the Northern Virginia suburbs started in the late 60s and early 1970s because of the new people coming in because of air conditioning. It was part of the sun belt movement when businesses started moving to Virginia and points south.
All the way up there? I'm much more east of you than north of you. I am only an hour or so from the North Carolina line.
How you can put Virginia in the same category as New Jersey or Brooklyn is absurd to me. I have more in common with people from China than I do New Jersey or Brooklyn. My belief is more relative to the state because I grew up here. You didn't grow up in Virginia.
Virginia is part of The Old South , I have an idea about what southern is. Texas is hardly the Old South. Its the Western frontier.
Vasinger, maybe you think the South is so wonderful that you're dying to be a part of it, but you should get over it. Put it anyway you want...you're not in the South. You might be country, but neither Virginia or D.C. are the South. You're welcome to visit this state anytime so I can show you what the South is.
^^^Well where is Virginia than. It is not a Northern State whatsoever. If you must put it in a region, it is in the mid-atlantic. But that's just a term that's been only used for probably the past 20-30 years. There's only 4 regions. North, South, East, and West. So which one is Virginia?
Because south of NOVA, I don't see how anyone could mistaken Virginia to be nothing else than a Southern State and this is coming from a Texan. And yes, like I said, you have people from the Carolinas down to North Florida who thinks Texas is too far west to be a southern state.
I will disagree with you on one thing vasinger. True, Texas is not an old south state. But I didn't think of VA as one either. I thought the old deep southern states including Arkansas and Louisiana were known as the old south.
I said that Virginia is mid-Atlantic. Just like Texas is South Central. Only difference is that I feel that Texas is a transitional state. To me, North Carolina is the transitional state in a way. It has its southern qualities, but it's just not deep down, to the gut southern.
Still, what's annoying me is how Vasinger has the nerve to claim that Texas is not the South as if it's officially set in stone that Virginia is a southern state, when many people consider it to mid-Atlantic and northern. On the other hand, not a single person who has truly been to East Texas can deny that it is the South. There's no way around it. I don't know what world he is living in.
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No part of Virginia is in the North
