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Cumberland, Perimeter/Dunwoody (the largest office district in the state), and north Fulton are all outside of I-285 as well. You can even throw in the bulk of Gwinnett, the state's second-largest county.
Fulton, Dekalb, Cobb, and Gwinnett. All of those are much larger than Richmond, Columbia, Chatham, Muscogee, etc. The largest second-tier county in the state is Chatham, which is a little bigger than Clayton County--and it's not too hard to beat that county in anything.
Dekalb, Cobb and Gwinnett are larger because of Atlanta/Fulton County.
That's obvious; you didn't need to state that. But you implied that the gap between Atlanta and those states' largest cities would be just as big as it is between Atlanta and Augusta, Columbus, Savannah, etc. That sentiment can't even be taken seriously in any form whatsoever, which is why you conveniently dismissed the bulk of my post.
An enormous chasm exists between Atlanta and Georgia's second-tier cities. None of their respective counties even come close to being as large as metro Atlanta's four major core counties, while Mecklenburg (Charlotte) and Wake (Raleigh) counties are as populous as Fulton County itself. Davidson County (Nashville) is just a bit smaller than DeKalb and Cobb. Fairfax County (NoVA) is larger than Fulton County. This is why a lot of people who look to relocate outside of Atlanta frequently look at those cities as possible destinations. The only in-state option they might consider is Savannah, and that would be more for leisure. Otherwise, none of the second-tier cities are on their radar AT ALL.
I'm sorry, but this is getting a bit asinine.
Once again! I think you are clearly misunderstanding what I said...I said that Atlanta is years ahead of every metro in those other states as well as the ones in GA. You took it even farther to say that the gap between metro Atlanta and 2nd tier metros in GA is much more larger than gaps in the other states in which I agreed. I don't know how you figured I said the gaps were the same....Wrong poster....
I don't have time to look up all the stats. I do know metro Augusta, Columbus, and Savannah grew faster compared to metro Chattanooga between 2010-2012.
The number of building permits in Augusta is much larger compared to Chattanooga in 2013. The 2012 metro population of Augusta was almost 40k larger compared to Chattanooga.
I maybe wrong but the new CSA of Chattanooga is under 1 million.
I tend to look at longer-term growth trends, particularly in 10 year spans, because it gives a much more accurate picture when it comes to growth. Yearly estimates can be and have been off.
Building permits tend to happen in spurts also. You have to keep in mind that Chattanooga has had a successful revitalization of its downtown and major economic developments occur within the past couple years (new BCBS campus, VW plant). Augusta is playing catch-up in the development department in comparison.
True, Augusta's MSA is larger but with the latest MSA/CSA revisions, Chattanooga's CSA is now knocking on the door of 1 million at 936,142 (up from 696,197 in 2010).
Quote:
Originally Posted by Columbuskidd92
You're just hand picking now.
What do you mean? I listed areas outside of the Perimeter since you said that "those areas outside of I-285 doesn't look much different from any other major city in Georgia." I'm sorry, but no one is going to mistake Perimeter for Augusta or Cumberland for Columbus or Alpharetta for Macon.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Columbuskidd92
Dekalb, Cobb and Gwinnett are larger because of Atlanta/Fulton County.
That has nothing to do with the statement I was responding to, which was in response to River_Dawg's who stated, "Outside of Fulton and Maybe DeKalb County, Richmond, Columbia, Muscogee and Chatham County can complete with anyone."
Quote:
Originally Posted by cdw1084
Once again! I think you are clearly misunderstanding what I said...I said that Atlanta is years ahead of every metro in those other states as well as the ones in GA. You took it even farther to say that the gap between metro Atlanta and 2nd tier metros in GA is much more larger than gaps in the other states in which I agreed. I don't know how you figured I said the gaps were the same....Wrong poster....
Note that you were piggybacking off my statement, "It's just so extremely far ahead of everything else in Georgia," in an attempt to apply this to the largest cities in certain other Southeastern states. My statement had context to it with regard to Georgia's second-tier cities in that they won't ever be categorically mentioned along with Atlanta for the foreseeable future (except Savannah in a leisure/tourist sense). However, Charlotte, Raleigh, Nashville, and NoVA already are in terms of business climate, being "New South" destination cities, high-tech economies, Fortune 500 companies, having big city metropolitan amenities, etc. So to co-opt my statement while disregarding the context in which I made it implied that it was meant in the same exact way as applied to those cities which is simply not true.
I tend to look at longer-term growth trends, particularly in 10 year spans, because it gives a much more accurate picture when it comes to growth. Yearly estimates can be and have been off.
Building permits tend to happen in spurts also. You have to keep in mind that Chattanooga has had a successful revitalization of its downtown and major economic developments occur within the past couple years (new BCBS campus, VW plant). Augusta is playing catch-up in the development department in comparison.
True, Augusta's MSA is larger but with the latest MSA/CSA revisions, Chattanooga's CSA is now knocking on the door of 1 million at 936,142 (up from 696,197 in 2010).
What do you mean? I listed areas outside of the Perimeter since you said that "those areas outside of I-285 doesn't look much different from any other major city in Georgia." I'm sorry, but no one is going to mistake Perimeter for Augusta or Cumberland for Columbus or Alpharetta for Macon.
That has nothing to do with the statement I was responding to, which was in response to River_Dawg's who stated, "Outside of Fulton and Maybe DeKalb County, Richmond, Columbia, Muscogee and Chatham County can complete with anyone."
Note that you were piggybacking off my statement, "It's just so extremely far ahead of everything else in Georgia," in an attempt to apply this to the largest cities in certain other Southeastern states. My statement had context to it with regard to Georgia's second-tier cities in that they won't ever be categorically mentioned along with Atlanta for the foreseeable future (except Savannah in a leisure/tourist sense). However, Charlotte, Raleigh, Nashville, and NoVA already are in terms of business climate, being "New South" destination cities, high-tech economies, Fortune 500 companies, having big city metropolitan amenities, etc. So to co-opt my statement while disregarding the context in which I made it implied that it was meant in the same exact way as applied to those cities which is simply not true.
I didn't even see the bold print and I probably would have ignored it because there are at least 6 other counties in metro Atlanta that could give those counties a run.
And we aren't getting anywhere so let's call a ceasefire...LOL!!!
I didn't even see the bold print and I probably would have ignored it because there are at least 6 other counties in metro Atlanta that could give those counties a run.
Sure, the more suburban/exurban counties (Cherokee, Rockdale, Henry, Newton, Fayette, Forsyth, Douglas, etc.) and Clayton (and who CAN'T give Clayton a run?)...not the four major core counties.
Location: Augusta, GA ''The fastest rising city in the southeast''
7,508 posts, read 15,101,643 times
Reputation: 955
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mutiny77
I tend to look at longer-term growth trends, particularly in 10 year spans, because it gives a much more accurate picture when it comes to growth. Yearly estimates can be and have been off.
Building permits tend to happen in spurts also. You have to keep in mind that Chattanooga has had a successful revitalization of its downtown and major economic developments occur within the past couple years (new BCBS campus, VW plant). Augusta is playing catch-up in the development department in comparison.
True, Augusta's MSA is larger but with the latest MSA/CSA revisions, Chattanooga's CSA is now knocking on the door of 1 million at 936,142 (up from 696,197 in 2010).
Augusta has revitalize the majority of it's downtown, and landed the NSA/major growth in the Medical District(much more impressive than the BCBS). Even the recent changes in the Medical District(last 4-5 years) are well over $300 million.
Here are the 2000-2010 growth rates.
2000-2010(Numerical)
Augusta 57,193
Savannah 54,611
Chattanooga 51,612
2000-2010(Percentage)
Savannah 18.6%
Augusta 11.4%
Chattanooga 10.8%
Last edited by nortonguy; 08-22-2013 at 08:21 PM..
Augusta has revitalize the majority of it's downtown, and landed the NSA/major growth in the Medical District(much more impressive than the BCBS). Even the recent changes in the Medical District(last 4-5 years) are well over $300 million.
Here are the 2000-2010 growth rates.
2000-2010(Numerical)
Augusta 57,193
Savannah 54,611
Chattanooga 51,612
2000-2010(Percentage)
Savannah 18.6%
Augusta 11.4%
Chattanooga 10.8%
Oh come now. I like downtown Augusta and think it has loads of potential, but if it has revitalized "the majority of its downtown," then why are the largest development projects downtown of the public works variety (library, courthouse, convention center)? Where is all of the new private investment--the new midrise condos and apartments, mixed-use development, office towers, hotels, cultural facilities, etc.? Compared to downtown Chattanooga, Augusta hasn't experienced much of a downtown revitalization at all. The telltale sign of this is that other cities send delegations to Chattanooga all the time to get ideas on revitalizing their own downtowns. What cities have sent delegations to Augusta?
Location: Augusta, GA ''The fastest rising city in the southeast''
7,508 posts, read 15,101,643 times
Reputation: 955
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mutiny77
Oh come now. I like downtown Augusta and think it has loads of potential, but if it has revitalized "the majority of its downtown," then why are the largest development projects downtown of the public works variety (library, courthouse, convention center)? Where is all of the new private investment--the new midrise condos and apartments, mixed-use development, office towers, hotels, cultural facilities, etc.? Compared to downtown Chattanooga, Augusta hasn't experienced much of a downtown revitalization at all. The telltale sign of this is that other cities send delegations to Chattanooga all the time to get ideas on revitalizing their own downtowns. What cities have sent delegations to Augusta?
Nobody is denying Chattanooga is much further along on its downtown revitalization. The original debate was centered around growth rates. I don't have the exact numbers, but the Whites Building and Enterprise Mill were large mixed use projects. The Enterprise mill was probably originally $15-$20 million.
The Watermark called for two 12 story condos, two Hilton hotels, and four story mid rise office building. The $100 million project was killed by the recession, and even included the renovation of the train depot into retail. http://www.augustatomorrow.org/Resources/763.pdf
The proposed Hyatt hotel is $25-30 million which is more than the library, and comparable to the convention center. Two different developers have purchased the old Fort Discovery building, and the large building at 901 James Brown Boulevard. Those are definitely going to become million dollar projects. The renovation of the Miller Theater is moving along, and the Holiday Inn Express is under construction.
Nobody is denying Chattanooga is much further along on its downtown revitalization. The original debate was centered around growth rates. I don't have the exact numbers, but the Whites Building and Enterprise Mill were large mixed use projects. The Enterprise mill was probably originally $15-$20 million.
The Watermark called for two 12 story condos, two Hilton hotels, and four story mid rise office building. The $100 million project was killed by the recession, and even included the renovation of the train depot into retail. http://www.augustatomorrow.org/Resources/763.pdf
The proposed Hyatt hotel is $25-30 million which is more than the library, and comparable to the convention center. Two different developers have purchased the old Fort Discovery building, and the large building at 901 James Brown Boulevard. Those are definitely going to become million dollar projects. The renovation of the Miller Theater is moving along, and the Holiday Inn Express is under construction.
Chattanooga was first mentioned, along with a few others, as a city whose heels are being nipped at by Columbus, Augusta, Savannah, Macon, etc. Growth is just one factor in that equation, and by most other measures, this really has little basis in fact. I then mentioned Chattanooga's expanding economic reach via its new CSA designation (knocking at the door of 1 million) as evidence of that.
The other cities mentioned are clearly out of the question--especially Raleigh. No second-tier city in Georgia is anywhere close to nipping at Raleigh's heels. I almost fell out of my chair when I saw Raleigh mentioned in that way.
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