Are you happy to live in Grand Rapids? (Detroit, Holland: insurance, house)

[windfarmer]

Maybe this thread has been done before, but I haven't found it.

Can anyone tell me please if you are satisfied living in GR and why, or if you aren't happy, please give a reason.

The reason I'm asking, is because as a metro-detroiter, I am pretty sick and tired of SE Michigan. It's got some good areas and a few things to do, but overall I don't like the busy and impersonal aspect of the big city nor the crime.

I have only been to GR three or four times, but here's what I like:

(not in any special order)
1) proximity to Lake Michigan
2) Holland/Saugatuck are so close
3) Chicago is an hour or so closer
4) Overall very polite and friendly residents
5) Good balance of conservatives/liberals (i like both so I'm not opposed to living around either)
6) Not terribly expensive housing
7) Residents of the city seem to have a VERY healthy attitude towards business, growth, progression and development
8) MEIJER!!!!!!!!!!
9) Don't have to go far to be around farms
10) Waaaay nicer downtown than Detroit
11) The ice skating rink downtown is awesome
12) Nice river right through the city - feels a little like Toledo (Maumee), only more quaint.
13) Heritage Hill (an absolute GEM.. rather reminds me of a smaller Boston-Edison district except without the 'hood nearby)

I'm sure I can think of more things, but this is pretty much all of the top of my head. Anyone else?

[burgler09]

I think Grand Rapids is a nice place because it is a pretty big city with a small town feel. I have grown up on the west side of GR.. in the elmridge area.. it has been pretty nice. I think the biggest complaint I have about GR is what most people love about it, it is not busy and big enough (I am moving to Miami in August)

Grand Rapids is soooo much nicer than detroit it is not funny, when walking through downtown GR you don't have people starring you down from every corner and you don't feel nervous in any way. The shops and stores are open later and everything isn't shut down after 5.

My biggest complaint about the ice skating rink is a few years back me and my buddies used to play hockey on it after it closed.. but now the cops come and don't let us play anymore :P

The farms are boring.

Meijers sucks, a wal-mart supercenter just opened on Alpine.. I can't wait to be able to go!!

[scottmi]

I'm going to address your list and then add some comments of my own:

I have only been to GR three or four times, but here's what I like:

(not in any special order)
1) proximity to Lake Michigan
It's not that close...in fact if you're a fan of water stuff GR is not the place to live at all.
2) Holland/Saugatuck are so close
What's in Holland besides the Tulip Festival?
3) Chicago is an hour or so closer
Chicago is STILL like 4-5 hours away (depending on where you're heading in Chicago)
4) Overall very polite and friendly residents
Yeah - but I work with a lot of liberal people even though I always hear GR is super conservative overall (cause of the # of churches)...I don't find it any friendlier than any other place I've been.
5) Good balance of conservatives/liberals (i like both so I'm not opposed to living around either)
I've only run into liberals so far in my months of being in the area...and while I'm not a big fan of super-"Christian"-like conservative people all the time, I'm even less of a fan of liberals. There's a lot of young people here which may account for the liberal mindset.6) Not terribly expensive housing
I don't know about you...but you couldn't PAY ME to buy a house anywhere in Michigan right now. No way.
7) Residents of the city seem to have a VERY healthy attitude towards business, growth, progression and development
But not paying employees fair wages. From what I can tell in my searching of the job markets - employees are paid $5-$10k less annually than they probably should be compared to cities that aren't in Michigan.
8) MEIJER!!!!!!!!!!
They're okay - but Target has better non-food items, selection and prices.
9) Don't have to go far to be around farms
For cow-tipping?
10) Waaaay nicer downtown than Detroit
Yeah...it's okay. I used to be amazed at it while in college...but then I moved to Chicago and after that GR is pretty unimpressive in size and variety of things to do. It's not bad (at least Van Andel occasionally attracts national acts & events) but not spectacular or anything.
11) The ice skating rink downtown is awesome
Never been there.
12) Nice river right through the city - feels a little like Toledo (Maumee), only more quaint.
I like that it's there...it makes GR more geographically interesting...but given that Michigan is snowed/iced over 3/4 of the year it's sorta useless beyond visuals.
13) Heritage Hill (an absolute GEM.. rather reminds me of a smaller Boston-Edison district except without the 'hood nearby)
Have no clue what this is.

I like GR - I'm working in the area right now and it's okay...although I can say easily that I would never want to live here for the rest of my life. I can name the big "things to do" in GR on one hand: 1) Van Andel Arena, 2) Museum Downtown, 3) Rivertown Mall, 4) Yesterdog, & 5) Frederick Meijer Garden.

Michigan's unstable/dwindling job market gives me the most fear. After graduating in '04 I worked in northern Michigan in my field for about 6 months before moving to Chicago for a year and a half. I returned to MI 'cause I wasn't content in Chicago then and since Dec. '06 I have nothing but trouble finding work here. Took me nearly a year or hunting state-wide to find a job in my field that offered decent pay and benefits. Even then I was making the SAME amount I was making at my first job in Michigan right after graduating...ALMOST 3 years EARLIER! I'm sorry, but low-job opportunities + stagnate wages while the value of the US dollar is falling does not make me happy.


As for things I like about GR:

1) It's safe... (compared to parts of Chicago)
2) Pretty easy to drive around (the expressway and major roads never seem to be too congested or covered in road construction)
3) Right on 131 (allowing easy access to state-to-state travel)
4) Got a fairly large airport that will take you many places w/o layovers
5) Clean looking downtown (not messy at all and building looks very new DT)
6) Shopping is simple and closeby (Meijer, Walmart, Target all easy to get to)
7) GR is considered Michigan's one "brightspot" economy-wise...so I guess that's good.
8) If you're in college, you have Kendall, GVSU, FSU, Cooley, UoPhoenix and GRCC in town.
9) Lots of movie theaters and an Imax theater
10) Lots of restaurants everywhere


Now here's my gripes with GR:

1) Wages/Job Opportunities are crap. Look at MLive, Monster and Craigslist...they confirm this.
2) No Mass Transit System. Those 2-3 buses they shuttle around GR don't count. GR needs to have a huge network of buses that run in 15-minute increments that can shuttle people all over the town from any corner. Even nearby cities should be setup this way since many people live in GR but live in it and vice-versa. With gas so high (and rising) this is gonna be the deal-breaker for many people who HAVE used Mass Transit before.
3) GR is very much a "Driving City" in that foot-travel is unecessary except for certain parts of downtown. This means that a car is absolutely necessary to experience 95% of GR and there is no alternative. This is sorta lumped in with the MT reason above but it just bothers the heck outta me that anytime I want to do something I gotta get in my car, drive a mile, get out. Go somewhere else? Get back in car, drive two miles, get back in. Uggghhh....annoying!
4) Nightlife and young people hangouts seriously lacking. Maybe I'm just unaware of the super cool & hip place in GR but I can think of The BOB downtown and...um...BARS. That's it. Where else can people go? Where are all the comedy clubs? (The BOB Comedy club is super $$$ and pretty underwhelming) Where are all the year-round indoor mini-golf / paintball / laser-tag / arcade etc. places? Where's the big flea-markets and artsy-indie areas (like I said, I run into liberals left and right but I can't seem to find where they hang out!)? There's more to list..but you get the point.
5) No big national draw for GR. There's nothing in GR that draws any nationa attention. Detroit has the Tigers, Red Wings, Pistons and Lions. Can't we have ONE of those!?! Geez! "Detroit" has been synonymous with "Crap" for decades now, yet they get all the big name sport teams (which draw tourists and national coverage). Gr gets...the "Whitecaps"? Geez - that seems fair.
6) Furniture & Healthcare industry overload. We get it...GR makes a lot of furniture. But can't GR expand it's national appeal to something other than furniture and medical corportations? The tech industry is completely dead in Michigan and no one is even attempting to bring that here. Even tourism seems laughable here as an industry for reasons mentioned above (what's to see?). It sorta sucks that GR's whole future relies on chair makers and insurance-suckers.
7) It's never going to get treated better than (or even like) Detroit. No matter what people think, despite how good GR does in this recession compared to other US cities, GR will always be treated like Runner Up in big cities of Michigan. Crime- and pollution-filled Detroit will always be in the spotlight, getting all the attention and the majority of tax dollars. No matter what you think, GR will never be any bigger than it is now. It's sorta reached its cap and if anything, the most GR people can hope for is that residents don't do a mass-exodus out of the area. GR is proof that Michigan is screwy in the head.
8) Class differences in GR. I have spotted a distinct split in classes in GR, much like I did in Chicago (although the split in Chicago was more race-based than money-based...you couldn't always tell who was rich in Chicago). In GR people seem to "let you know" if they are living the good life, as if they have something to be oh-so-proud-of. It's irritating to say the least and will no doubt be an issue if you ever have to deal with these people on issues of money (the people who run/own GR have money...and will unlikely ever do much to help the little guy who is the true backbone of any city). I don't know...I just feel like there's a difference between groups of people.
9) There's no reason to STAY in GR, honestly. What does GR offer that you cannot find anywhere else? Really, what is there? Geographically it's like many places in the US...job wise it's probably the same as most cities with 250,000 people. Culturally it has nothing significant. Why stay here? There's just no real argument for why (much like most of Michigan).
10) Weather sucks. Even though GR is halfway down Michigan's lower half it still is craptastic weather-wise for a good 8 months of the year. This year's mid-April & May seems to be a bit better than last year's but for anyone who hates cold, snow, or gloomy days, AVOID GR. In fact, just avoid Michigan overall. I bet this is a big reason why companies avoid moving to MI...no one likes to deal with horrible weather 75% of the year. people may love skiing and snowmobiling...but that doesn't mean they want to live in Anarctica. GR could alleviate this by having more year-round indoor things for people to do but they don't. They're like every other Michigan city and don't even attempt to do anything different.

So there you have it....

[windfarmer]

Good answer scottmi. :-) Very detailed. Thank you.

I am of the the school that contentment should be reached no matter the difficulty. Therefore I don't "feel" the same as you do, but perhaps if I lived in GR I'd get to that point eventually.

I am not a fan of big city living, so GR is the perfect size for me. I would in fact, prefer to live in Holland if I could. Big cities just don't do it for me.. I've lived in many big cities and while I appreciate the activities, I don't like the traffic or overall hustle and bustle of fast-paced living.

I like living near farms because sometimes i enjoy a good drive in the countryside. It's extremely refreshing and I'm a pretty simple person who enjoys such things. I do appreciate culture, the arts, etc, but I'd still rather live in a smaller town/city than a big metropolis.

I just want to know who is spending all this money in downtown GR? I see cranes everywhere, buildings being renovated, etc.. and why are they doing this? Are they expecting growth or good opportunities down the road? I would think that people with millions of dollars to invest do an awful lot of thinking before their decision making comes to fruition.

That sucks about the weather. I don't love the cold nor snow. I also hate how the gas bill is so high in the winter time. I keep the thermostat on 67º but I still get a very high bill... It sucks.

[magellan]

Originally Posted by windfarmer

Good answer scottmi. :-) Very detailed. Thank you.

I am of the the school that contentment should be reached no matter the difficulty. Therefore I don't "feel" the same as you do, but perhaps if I lived in GR I'd get to that point eventually.

I am not a fan of big city living, so GR is the perfect size for me. I would in fact, prefer to live in Holland if I could. Big cities just don't do it for me.. I've lived in many big cities and while I appreciate the activities, I don't like the traffic or overall hustle and bustle of fast-paced living.

I like living near farms because sometimes i enjoy a good drive in the countryside. It's extremely refreshing and I'm a pretty simple person who enjoys such things. I do appreciate culture, the arts, etc, but I'd still rather live in a smaller town/city than a big metropolis.

I just want to know who is spending all this money in downtown GR? I see cranes everywhere, buildings being renovated, etc.. and why are they doing this? Are they expecting growth or good opportunities down the road? I would think that people with millions of dollars to invest do an awful lot of thinking before their decision making comes to fruition.

That sucks about the weather. I don't love the cold nor snow. I also hate how the gas bill is so high in the winter time. I keep the thermostat on 67º but I still get a very high bill... It sucks.

Can't argue much with scottmi's post. GR does seem to lack some of those amenities that just come inherently in a "step-up-tier" city, such as Indianapolis, Columbus, or Nashville. We don't have any pro-sports teams, which is where a lot of national attention goes toward those individual mid-sized cities.

But there is something to be said for GR's size, especially if you have a family. Knocking an hour off of your commute time every day does give you more time to spend with the family and doing after-work activities. I can even squeeze in 9 holes of golf with my daughter after work once a week because I can be home in 15 - 20 minutes. And even though GR is very "car-based" (I too wish the transit system from burbs to downtown was more robust and faster), you really aren't that far from the conveniences that you need like groceries and clothing in most areas of GR. And you're never more than 2 miles from a Meijer.

Most of the developments downtown windfarmer are what I call "legacy developments". The major family benefactors of the city (Devos, Van Andel, Meijer, Wege, Secchia, Cook, Tassell, Frey, just to name a few.) are reaching their "zenith", and are trying to put in place a "new economy" for Grand Rapids centered around making GR a health-science and visitor/convention destination. It's pretty noble. Plus, downtown Grand Rapids is run by a very well organized department called the Downtown Development Authority, which through several channels keeps downtown spit-shined and overflowing with flowers, trees and planters in the Spring/Summer/Fall. Downtown needs more retail though in a bad way.

[kimba01]

GR can have the Lions. Maybe they can make them ROAR!

[burgler09]

Originally Posted by kimba01

GR can have the Lions. Maybe they can make them ROAR!

when the dumbass fords are gone

[kimba01]

Yeah and since Ford is moving all their companies down south, maybe they will stink up a football team there!

[windfarmer]

when the dumbass fords are gone

kimba01 Yeah and since Ford is moving all their companies down south, maybe they will stink up a football team there!

hahah no kidding!

[windfarmer]

Originally Posted by magellan

Most of the developments downtown windfarmer are what I call "legacy developments". The major family benefactors of the city (Devos, Van Andel, Meijer, Wege, Secchia, Cook, Tassell, Frey, just to name a few.) are reaching their "zenith", and are trying to put in place a "new economy" for Grand Rapids centered around making GR a health-science and visitor/convention destination. It's pretty noble. Plus, downtown Grand Rapids is run by a very well organized department called the Downtown Development Authority, which through several channels keeps downtown spit-shined and overflowing with flowers, trees and planters in the Spring/Summer/Fall. Downtown needs more retail though in a bad way.

Yeah I think the downtown is something to be very proud of. I've lived in a few cities in my life that didn't put half the pride and care into their central business district as GR appears to. As a big proponent of public transit, I too would like to see trolleys or buses bridge the surrounding neighborhoods with each other via downtown.

Does it seem that home prices are increasing across the city due to the new construction downtown? I understand that there is a new medical school from one of the major state universities?