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If that's what it takes to keep the economy looking better than the rest of the state (and also keeping the Unions away) then I hope you're right.
Conservatism has absolutely no link to either economic success or failure, nor does liberalism share this link. Proof can be seen in economies all across America, although if I had to make a "tally" I would say that liberal areas (think west and east coast) are doing significantly better economically than well known conservative portions of the Midwest and south.
Also, your assumption that unions and liberalism share a link is also false. Michigan, probably one of the most conservative states in the Midwest, and the bedrock for union history has had one constant in the last 50 years...the lack of change, and resistance against it.
What is your basis for declaring that "west Michigan" has a more successful economy, can you provide and viable information? If you are rooting your claim purely on unemployment rates, then your claim is very false. The "idea" that "west Michigan" has a superior economy to the rest of Michigan is a idea that lives in the minds of media pundits.
I suggest you dig up some research regarding economic indicators, places like moody's, Forbes, or bls.gov, and to your amazement , you will find other cities in Michigan (yes, even on the dreaded "south east" portion of the state) that have much higher projected future job growth, as well as population growth.
Conservatism has absolutely no link to either economic success or failure, nor does liberalism share this link. Proof can be seen in economies all across America, although if I had to make a "tally" I would say that liberal areas (think west and east coast) are doing significantly better economically than well known conservative portions of the Midwest and south.
Also, your assumption that unions and liberalism share a link is also false. Michigan, probably one of the most conservative states in the Midwest, and the bedrock for union history has had one constant in the last 50 years...the lack of change, and resistance against it.
What is your basis for declaring that "west Michigan" has a more successful economy, can you provide and viable information? If you are rooting your claim purely on unemployment rates, then your claim is very false. The "idea" that "west Michigan" has a superior economy to the rest of Michigan is a idea that lives in the minds of media pundits.
I suggest you dig up some research regarding economic indicators, places like moody's, Forbes, or bls.gov, and to your amazement , you will find other cities in Michigan (yes, even on the dreaded "south east" portion of the state) that have much higher projected future job growth, as well as population growth.
While I agree with you on the fact that liberalism or conservatism has nothing to do with economic stability in an area, Grand Rapids does indeed have a better economy than just about anywhere else in Michigan currently.
While there may be some small individual areas of the state that have some better economic indicators, as a metro area as a whole Grand Rapids is better. Having worked for a small Detroit based company I can say that our Grand Rapids branch is the only thing that kept us alive over the past two years. I'm not using this as any proof of Grand Rapids having a superior economy, just simply stating what our business observed.
You seem to be reacting pretty harshly the idea that Grand Rapids is actually doing better than most of the state, which it is.
This isn't media bias, or "pundits" moving a story, it's actually what is happening all over Grand Rapids and I've witnessed it firsthand for the past 7 years and it's why Grand Rapids is going to continue to climb in terms of quality of life available compared to places like Flint, Detroit, Pontiac, Lansing etc.
While I agree with you on the fact that liberalism or conservatism has nothing to do with economic stability in an area, Grand Rapids does indeed have a better economy than just about anywhere else in Michigan currently.
While there may be some small individual areas of the state that have some better economic indicators, as a metro area as a whole Grand Rapids is better. Having worked for a small Detroit based company I can say that our Grand Rapids branch is the only thing that kept us alive over the past two years. I'm not using this as any proof of Grand Rapids having a superior economy, just simply stating what our business observed.
You seem to be reacting pretty harshly the idea that Grand Rapids is actually doing better than most of the state, which it is.
This isn't media bias, or "pundits" moving a story, it's actually what is happening all over Grand Rapids and I've witnessed it firsthand for the past 7 years and it's why Grand Rapids is going to continue to climb in terms of quality of life available compared to places like Flint, Detroit, Pontiac, Lansing etc.
Once again, here we have claims of "rebirth", but yet as a whole GR still has high unemployment, shrinking population, and a housing market that hasn't even begun to show signs of recovery. So we must take your word as an employee of a small (Detroit) based business as the shining evidence for "success" of a city? How difficult is it really to be compared to places like Flint or Detroit? Is that really an accomplishment to be seen better than some of the worst places to live in the country?
Again I ask for vital proof in your theory of GR doing much better, more than "my company sees it". Rebirth? Or perhaps just the luck of having a billionaire family reside in town and aid in the illusion of putting cranes in the sky and erecting several buildings?
My point is, and you merely proved that again with your inclusion of the "rebirth" article is that many people are quick to dismiss any other positive economic happenings in Michigan if it is outside of "west Michigan", simply because Detroit gets somehow magically lumped with places like Ann Arbor, Troy, Brighton and other thriving markets.
Clearly what happens in GR gets magnified by a thousand by the media. Its no big news when Google continues to expand in A2, or when someone donates 10 million to UM or starts up a software firm that apple is considering buying, but when you add 10 jobs at XYZ hospital in GR, the press is notified and that alone is proof of "a superior economy".
Once again, here we have claims of "rebirth", but yet as a whole GR still has high unemployment, shrinking population, and a housing market that hasn't even begun to show signs of recovery. So we must take your word as an employee of a small (Detroit) based business as the shining evidence for "success" of a city? How difficult is it really to be compared to places like Flint or Detroit? Is that really an accomplishment to be seen better than some of the worst places to live in the country?
Again I ask for vital proof in your theory of GR doing much better, more than "my company sees it". Rebirth? Or perhaps just the luck of having a billionaire family reside in town and aid in the illusion of putting cranes in the sky and erecting several buildings?
My point is, and you merely proved that again with your inclusion of the "rebirth" article is that many people are quick to dismiss any other positive economic happenings in Michigan if it is outside of "west Michigan", simply because Detroit gets somehow magically lumped with places like Ann Arbor, Troy, Brighton and other thriving markets.
Clearly what happens in GR gets magnified by a thousand by the media. Its no big news when Google continues to expand in A2, or when someone donates 10 million to UM or starts up a software firm that apple is considering buying, but when you add 10 jobs at XYZ hospital in GR, the press is notified and that alone is proof of "a superior economy".
Wow, I totally have to disagree with this. When Google opened (what is basically an advertising sales office), it was all over the media around the state.
And no one writes about the hospitals adding jobs in Grand Rapids, except maybe a small blurb in the Business Journal once in a while about a new specialty surgeon or something. Or maybe Van Andel Institute, but not the healthcare systems.
I honestly have to say you have it backwards. The little bit of good news coming out of West Michigan is way overshadowed by gloom-n-doom out of SE Michigan. Blame it on the Freep I guess.
Oh, and I agree that just being better than "****" is not really saying much, but I do have to correct you in that Grand Rapids' population is not shrinking. In fact, it's growing according to the most recent census estimates (albeit small). Unemployment is definitely too high though.
Wow, I totally have to disagree with this. When Google opened (what is basically an advertising sales office), it was all over the media around the state.
And no one writes about the hospitals adding jobs in Grand Rapids, except maybe a small blurb in the Business Journal once in a while about a new specialty surgeon or something. Or maybe Van Andel Institute, but not the healthcare systems.
I honestly have to say you have it backwards. The little bit of good news coming out of West Michigan is way overshadowed by gloom-n-doom out of SE Michigan. Blame it on the Freep I guess.
Oh, and I agree that just being better than "****" is not really saying much, but I do have to correct you in that Grand Rapids' population is not shrinking. In fact, it's growing according to the most recent census estimates (albeit small). Unemployment is definitely too high though.
I think all good news for Michigan is good news, don't get me wrong, but the fact that Detroit somehow has leaped over its territory and now encompasses in the minds of most people, any land east of Lansing, we have a problem. This I believe is directly linked to the media and the continual separation of "west michigan" vs. "south east" Michigan.
I don't have any issue with GR, I think its a great city, although I am still firm in my belief that the media has played a great deal in spotlighting GR and attempting to somehow make it "separate" from the rest of Michigan when in fact all of this state suffers from the same poor leadership and cyclic problems of shrinking population and tax revenues.
You sound more jaded/bitter than anything. Yes economic indicators in Grand Rapids are still bad yet there is still growth and development. A shrinking population has nothing to do with quality of life or expansion. At least not here. And I never claimed that my 30million a year company as proof of why GR is having a rebirth. I used it as an example of how GR is much better off than Detroit.
As someone who lived in Grand Rapids for 7 years I've seen these changes firsthand. New restaurants open all the time downtown, there are massive hospital expansions, new condo/lofts going up everywhere. There is a new luxury hotel, a new art museum, the list goes on. These things don't solve all the problems tied to the former manufacturing economy or the recession. What they do prove however is that it is changing. Cranes aren't an illusion buddy, they are a cold hard fact and visible proof of investment.
And yes, it is luck that a few billionares live here. And GR is fortunate that these people are helping develope the area. You can be as cynical and ignorant as you want, but you don't live in Grand Rapids and you really have no clue. You're making broad assumptions, and really you're just mad that the press ignores some of the east side? Get over it. There is a reason GR gets press now. It's not some big conspiracy against the east side, but if that's what helps you rationalize and live with what is going on in Michigan more power to you.
This has gotten completely off topic.
What does economic success have to do with diversity?
MittenDweller, the difference between Metro-Detroit and Grand Rapids is one of attitude, in my opinion.
People are generally excited about the future of West Michigan. Are we thriving? Hardly. Are we certain that we're headed in the right direction? Perhaps.
I think what you have in Metro Detroit (and I lived there 20 years) is a belief that things happen TO the economy. In West Michigan, the prevailing opinion I encounter is the opposite. I think people here expect to make the change they wish to see and genuinely believe they have the power to do that.
We have raised our kids at Glenwood Elementary and Valleywood Middle School in Kentwood and they provided an excellent education in every way. We wanted to send our kids to private Christian schools but couldn't come up with the money since we live on one income. Now I am grateful for how it has worked out because our kids are used to being in a highly diverse group and accepting other people for who they are, not what they look like. There is a low-income population that struggles to raise their kids, and sometimes those kids are disruptive in school, but they operate with a zero tolerance policy and my husband and I agree the schools could not handle it better. It is safe and respectful. There are also plenty of high-income families. Kentwood Community Church represents the diverse community with an African American lead pastor and worship leader but a mix of races in the church that approximates the community. Many mixed marriages in the church.
Last edited by dennisjmi; 01-14-2012 at 03:18 PM..
Reason: Concerned about too many details about my kids on the public internet.
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