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Old 08-27-2018, 03:30 PM
 
Location: Wonderland
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Quote:
Originally Posted by germaine2626 View Post
Hmmm, that is interesting. I certainly hope that your daughter is not angry at her husband and their children, or discriminate against them, if they do not completely, 100% identify as being black and uphold her view of the world (I'm still a little confused what your daughter is upset about).

Frankly, it makes me even more concerned about how she is treating her family considering that her children do not have contact with other children at school or church or with neighbors or friends. Hopefully, everything is fine, and if it is not fine, her husband is able to realize it and get help for his family.
Right - my biggest concern is for the grandkids' - this isolation not only from extended family but from ANYONE else is disturbing.

I would hope her husband does something but he's very, very passive and he intentionally chose a job that takes him away from home 6 days in a row and then 3 days home.

 
Old 08-27-2018, 05:32 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KathrynAragon View Post
I get what you're saying.

It won't do my daughter a bit of good to start sniffing around - I've already put the word out via her siblings (so I'm sure someone's told her) that the STUFF has already been distributed and the only heirs named in my mother's will are my two brothers and me and that's the way it's going to go. At mine and my dad's bequest, my mom already divvied up her fine jewelry. Her paintings will go to the three siblings. Just about everything else is gone as far as material things. That ship has sailed, and my daughter sailed off with a U Haul trailer full of stuff already. Never to be seen or heard from again.

Honestly, I don't know how she lives in that house surrounded by all the things that not only my mother, but also my husband and I have given her family. I am talking about nearly all their furniture, dishes, etc. And it wasn't crap stuff either - as their luck would have it, we moved from one completely different style of home to another right as they were setting up house, so we gave them three full rooms of furniture that was good stuff, and just replaced it in our own home. I'm talking about leather furniture, expensive chairs and ottomans, bedroom furniture, dining room furniture, everything. My grandmother's Fiesta Ware for pete's sake, from the 1930s! Oh my gosh.

I have been thinking about how to handle her if she pops back up during my mom's illness or funeral. I think what I'll do if she shows up at the hospital (she didn't show up this last time my mom was in the hospital for three days) I will just say, "Well, I'll give you some time with your grandmother, " but I just will be very reserved (not hateful) myself. If she wants to talk, we can schedule a time away from the hospital or funeral home or whatever, maybe in a coffee shop, at a later date and that's what I'll tell her - that way the door is open but I am not on the spot during an emotional time.

Yes, thinking that through already makes me feel more relaxed. Thank you.
I’ve been following from the beginning of this thread and something that struck me: you are constantly stating all the things you do for others. Or how you’re the person in charge of things. Do you remind your children what you do/have done for them?

Speaking as a daughter of generous, emotionally and materially, parents they never, ever “remind” me of support they offer or the things they give. Are you being altruistic or playing “hero” by swooping in and “fixing “ things with subtle and blatant statements about all of it?

I’m not being rude or snarky- just an observation from a long time CD member.
 
Old 08-28-2018, 07:46 AM
 
Location: Wonderland
40,904 posts, read 32,658,014 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by charmed hour View Post
I’ve been following from the beginning of this thread and something that struck me: you are constantly stating all the things you do for others. Or how you’re the person in charge of things. Do you remind your children what you do/have done for them?

Speaking as a daughter of generous, emotionally and materially, parents they never, ever “remind” me of support they offer or the things they give. Are you being altruistic or playing “hero” by swooping in and “fixing “ things with subtle and blatant statements about all of it?

I’m not being rude or snarky- just an observation from a long time CD member.
Nope, I don't EVER "remind my children of what I've done for them." The only reason I keep stating it in this thread is because she should be able to clearly see what my husband and I have done FOR HER (as well as what my mom has done for her) and I would think that would at least get her attention. I mean, she's surrounded every day by reminders of the very people she has cut out of her life. Lots of people she has cut completely out of her life have done all sorts of things for her - not just me. You'd think she'd remember this.

Another reason that I brought up "what I've done" on this thread is because my daughter seems to be very angry at the way I've handled, for instance, my dad's estate and my mother's care (though she has been only a beneficiary of any estate stuff, and hasn't been involved in the slightest in the care of my mother). If she wasn't so bent out of shape and accusatory of what I've had to do (had to do - not really "wanted to do" or even been "inclined to do") I wouldn't even bring it up here.

But I've had a huge load - which I've sometimes really gotten tired of carrying - over the past four years. A little empathy, a little help now and then, from a daughter who lives near by and one that has benefited from the love as well as material gifts from several people involved - well, I would have really appreciated this. Instead, she's added more stress to my life - not by her family's needs, but by her accusations and then by removing me from my grandchildrens' lives, which has been absolutely the most painful thing I've ever dealt with emotionally, even worse than losing my dad, which was rough.

In fact, while she was still speaking to me and we were getting together on a regular basis, I would often exclaim, "Oh my gosh it's so great to be around young, healthy, vibrant people!" I have become sick to death of being surrounded by the increasing needs of sick, elderly parents. I'm no saint. I had a full enough life before all this hit me.

But the thing that gets me the most, the absolute most, is when my sick, hurting mother with dementia, is laying in her bed literally crying to see my daughter and those great grandchildren and I have to tell her over and over again, "Mom, I'm sorry - we just have to move past this. I don't think she's going to come see you. I'm sorry." It breaks my heart.
 
Old 08-28-2018, 07:54 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KathrynAragon View Post
Nope, I don't EVER "remind my children of what I've done for them." The only reason I keep stating it in this thread is because she should be able to clearly see what my husband and I have done FOR HER (as well as what my mom has done for her) and I would think that would at least get her attention. I mean, she's surrounded every day by reminders of the very people she has cut out of her life. Lots of people she has cut completely out of her life have done all sorts of things for her - not just me. You'd think she'd remember this.

Another reason that I brought up "what I've done" on this thread is because my daughter seems to be very angry at the way I've handled, for instance, my dad's estate and my mother's care (though she has been only a beneficiary of any estate stuff, and hasn't been involved in the slightest in the care of my mother). If she wasn't so bent out of shape and accusatory of what I've had to do (had to do - not really "wanted to do" or even been "inclined to do") I wouldn't even bring it up here.

But I've had a huge load - which I've sometimes really gotten tired of carrying - over the past four years. A little empathy, a little help now and then, from a daughter who lives near by and one that has benefited from the love as well as material gifts from several people involved - well, I would have really appreciated this. Instead, she's added more stress to my life - not by her family's needs, but by her accusations and then by removing me from my grandchildrens' lives, which has been absolutely the most painful thing I've ever dealt with emotionally, even worse than losing my dad, which was rough.

In fact, while she was still speaking to me and we were getting together on a regular basis, I would often exclaim, "Oh my gosh it's so great to be around young, healthy, vibrant people!" I have become sick to death of being surrounded by the increasing needs of sick, elderly parents. I'm no saint. I had a full enough life before all this hit me.

I actually noticed it's a recurring theme in many of your threads, you list all the things you do for others in explicit detail. Definitely great information for backstory/explanation in threads to keep folks reading up to speed.


My biggest concern was if you were expressing to your children these things. Honestly, I'm sure your children are cognizant of all the stress you're under and the burdens you carry. (if not you have either pretty selfish children or you don't level with them adult to adult enough)

Have you ever directly asked them for some help? I mean, we're having a hard time with my mother's mother being demented. My mom lives 5 hours away from her, me 2.5, my sister 7. My sister and I didn't need my mom to ask for our help-- we immediately said, "This is what we want to do/can do to help. You let us know of anything else you need us for." and she has, especially for things outside her wheelhouse (medical and legal issues).
 
Old 08-28-2018, 09:17 AM
 
Location: Wonderland
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Quote:
Originally Posted by charmed hour View Post
I actually noticed it's a recurring theme in many of your threads, you list all the things you do for others in explicit detail. Definitely great information for backstory/explanation in threads to keep folks reading up to speed.


My biggest concern was if you were expressing to your children these things. Honestly, I'm sure your children are cognizant of all the stress you're under and the burdens you carry. (if not you have either pretty selfish children or you don't level with them adult to adult enough)

Have you ever directly asked them for some help? I mean, we're having a hard time with my mother's mother being demented. My mom lives 5 hours away from her, me 2.5, my sister 7. My sister and I didn't need my mom to ask for our help-- we immediately said, "This is what we want to do/can do to help. You let us know of anything else you need us for." and she has, especially for things outside her wheelhouse (medical and legal issues).
I'm sure you're right about it being a recurring litany on many threads - for instance the caregiving section and this one - because absolutely - I've been very stressed out by all the huge demands on me over the past four years.

I am no saint, like I said. In fact, I've been burdened to the extreme over the past few years and I haven't always handled it well. I actually had to go get some professional counseling to try to get a grip on all of it. It's been horrible. I'm not naturally much of a nurturer - I'm more of an "action plan" sort of person, which sometimes comes in handy but sometimes I could do better on the empathetic side of things.

I have one brother who is mentally ill and can barely take care of himself - he has always been more drag than lift and so no, I haven't asked him for help ever since I asked him to help with my dad and he actually added significantly to my work load instead of helping. My other brother lives many states away and has been battling cancer for the past year, but until he got pancreatic cancer he was doing what he could between working full time, caring for his wife's elderly dad, etc. He has been a help emotionally but hasn't been able to help much since he was diagnosed with cancer - understandably.

I have a son who lives in Guam - he just can't be much help, though he does call regularly which is great. I have one who lives five hours away and works full time. I haven't asked him for much help. I have a daughter who lives in the same state as my brother (the one with cancer) - she also calls and checks in and offers whatever help she can, but between homeschooling four kids and living so far away, there's just not much she can do.

My husband works out of state two weeks out of every month. When he's home, he's a huge help, and his income is always a huge help, but for two weeks out of every month, I'm pretty much on my own.

And then I have my daughter who lives less than an hour away - she's the one who COULD help - I wouldn't expect much but like I said, just seeing her and spending healthy, happy time with her kids would be the biggest help emotionally for me - something positive and happy and carefree - and I think that's one reason why it's so painful. She's so close to me, out of all the family - but we're estranged.

Yep, no saint here. I've been overloaded. I freely admit it and it's really stressed me out sometimes over the past few years! I just don't know who else could have done anything more to help, other than this particular daughter.
 
Old 08-28-2018, 09:38 AM
 
1,470 posts, read 1,386,390 times
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Not being snarky-- but see? You did it again.
 
Old 08-28-2018, 11:13 AM
 
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Kathryn

I know you said you have put out info re your Mom via your estranged daughter's siblings, but it wasn't clear to me if you have directly informed her of the latest turn of events re your Mom.

Have you actually sent her a message/email/letter telling her your Mom fell, injured herself, unable to undergo any surgical treatment, under hospice care and presumably doctors thinking her time may be short?

Also, that her grandmother is asking for her/her kids and wants to see them?

If not, I think I would do so and also tell her you hope that the two of you can put your differences aside temporarily to deal with your mother/her grandmother.

Of course, there's a fine line in a letter like that being sincere vs manipulative so I would have someone who knows you very well and will be totally honest with you review it before sending.

She may ignore it or reject your overture, but you also never know when someone just needs a path back with a way to save face.
 
Old 08-28-2018, 11:31 AM
 
Location: Wonderland
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Quote:
Originally Posted by charmed hour View Post
Not being snarky-- but see? You did it again.
Sigh. I'm explaining why no one else has been able to help me with a huge and very emotional workload over the past few years. Period. And yes, in case anyone was wondering, I AM angry with my one adult child who lives nearby promising to help - just by visiting my mother once in awhile (actually she said once a week but I thought that was unrealistic, though once a month wouldn't be) so that not everything falls on my shoulders.

I'm sure it's depressing for my mother to basically only see me throughout the weeks and months...she does have some visitors about once every three months other than me but otherwise, I'm it. I'm sure she's tired of it being just me. And so am I.

Last edited by KathrynAragon; 08-28-2018 at 11:51 AM..
 
Old 08-28-2018, 11:51 AM
 
Location: Wonderland
40,904 posts, read 32,658,014 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blondy View Post
Kathryn

I know you said you have put out info re your Mom via your estranged daughter's siblings, but it wasn't clear to me if you have directly informed her of the latest turn of events re your Mom.

Have you actually sent her a message/email/letter telling her your Mom fell, injured herself, unable to undergo any surgical treatment, under hospice care and presumably doctors thinking her time may be short?

Also, that her grandmother is asking for her/her kids and wants to see them?

If not, I think I would do so and also tell her you hope that the two of you can put your differences aside temporarily to deal with your mother/her grandmother.

Of course, there's a fine line in a letter like that being sincere vs manipulative so I would have someone who knows you very well and will be totally honest with you review it before sending.

She may ignore it or reject your overture, but you also never know when someone just needs a path back with a way to save face.
No, I haven't told her directly about this latest fall but I'm sure at least one other sibling has.

I haven't told her because she's expressed zero interest or concern for my mother over the year and a half. Not a single phone call, visit, card, nothing. Nor has she answered a single one of my texts or letters or emails.

When I have written her kids, I'm sure she's read those letters - whether she's given them to the kids or not. I have included updates on my mom's condition, which has steadily worsened over the past year especially. I've described in detail in each letter Mom's situation, how to reach her, how she misses them, etc. Nothing.

She knows my mom's time on this earth is short. Mom already fell and broke her hip a couple of years ago, and my daughter knows that recently I had to move her to a memory care facility. She knows she has dementia. She knows my mother is literally yearning for her to visit with those kids. I have described in each letter how much my Mom says she'd love to see them and how wonderful it would be for them to come, and how short and unpredictable life can be.

Meanwhile, she was getting and cashing a check from my mom every month. Not even one thank you card or call! Not one! For going on two years now! Honestly, it's unbelievable to me.

If those things aren't enough to spur her on to visit and bring the kids, I don't know what to say. I do know this - when my dad was dying in the hospital, she did finally come see him - and she brought the kids and they camped out for days in the waiting room and in his room, and she sat there crying and saying "Why did I ignore him all these months? I hate myself for not spending time with him!" And I tried to make her feel better and even said, "Don't worry about all that - he knows you've never stopped loving him. He knows you're here. Just think about all this when we're dealing with your grandmother - I know you won't want to feel this regret again." And she tearfully said, "I'll never cut anyone off like this again!" and then BAM - what did she do? She did it again. I just don't get it!

Also, it's hard to describe but it's like this - when she suddenly quit ignoring my dad and came rushing to his deathbed, it was still more about her feelings than his. It was more about her regret than it was about bringing him any peace at the end, or actually helping anyone (she didn't lift a finger to even get him a drink of water for instance - but she did sit by his bedside crying). And it was stressful - because even in the midst of all that drama, she was still hanging onto anger at other people. To give credit where credit is due, she did put together a beautiful video for his funeral which I really did appreciate.

I mean, to me she's shown her true colors in all these months leading up to my mom's current illness and situation.

One thing that's hard to learn in life, but it's one of those bitter life lessons that just has to be learned is this - sometimes it really is too late to mend bridges, to reconnect, to include someone in your life again. Sometimes it is simply just TOO LATE.

I may be wrong in not sending her another letter or text or whatever regarding my mom, but she does know the situation and honestly, I don't feel like everything is up to me all the time. She knows my mom is sick.
 
Old 08-28-2018, 12:08 PM
 
1,470 posts, read 1,386,390 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KathrynAragon View Post
Sigh. I'm explaining why no one else has been able to help me with a huge and very emotional workload over the past few years. Period. And yes, in case anyone was wondering, I AM angry with my one adult child who lives nearby promising to help - just by visiting my mother once in awhile (actually she said once a week but I thought that was unrealistic, though once a month wouldn't be) so that not everything falls on my shoulders.

I'm sure it's depressing for my mother to basically only see me throughout the weeks and months...she does have some visitors about once every three months other than me but otherwise, I'm it. I'm sure she's tired of it being just me. And so am I.
You've explained it several times just in this thread. I'm making a leap but imagine you tell the same things over and over to kids, etc.



Frankly, if my mom told me about the one million things she does for everyone else over and over my reaction would, "Mom, you've already told me this and more than once. Are you venting? Are using asking my opinion? For advice or for help?"

I have no specific advice regarding the situation with your daughter, unfortunately. I'm also not intentionally trying to be an argumentative jerk. Being a 3rd party reading for many years the hard row you've had to hoe, I am sorry for your situation. But I do think how we sound to others isn't always how we intend to sound to others. Maybe just some food for thought in how you communicate with family and friends?
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