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Old 08-31-2018, 09:57 AM
 
6,499 posts, read 3,082,388 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JerseyGirl415 View Post
If this isn't radical, idk what is. Geez, all this back and forth on my choice of word ("radicalized"). Others used "radical" way before I added "ized" to it and now suddenly we have the words "terrorism" and "terrorist" mentioned. Context people.

Having an alleged strong dislike/hatred towards white people is RADICAL. Her daughter has politically and socially EXTREME views. She HAS radicalized, assuming what KA says about her is true. Something has made her this way. Which is why I asked KA if she knows what or who has made her this way, or if anyone her daughter knows may know. Either way, her daughter is free have those beliefs, and KA is free to be hurt over those beliefs.

*this is not a political post I just had to comment on the apparent debate/issue over my using "radicalized" when "radical" has been used since late July (yes I did a search because I thought that I couldn't possibly be the first one to use such a word to describe what's being alleged here)
Exactly. Sort of sad this has to be spelled out.

Anyway, its not uncommon for people the age of KA's daughter to adopt extreme views that are radically different from the ones they were raised with as they sort out who they are and what they believe.

Perhaps this daughter is a little old to just be at this point, but maybe being in the military delayed that process for her.

I am thinking if anything, that perhaps KA is just taking her way too seriously. Daughter's views are mostly extreme and irrational and as such they probably wont serve her well for long.

If she is as smart as KA says, she will eventually figure that out.

The one thing these views give her is a vehicle to carry the anger/rage she has. My guess is that rage is about being abused by her father and since she apparently doesn't express that to him it has to go somewhere.

When she runs out of places to misdirect this anger, she will probably/hopefully get counseling.

 
Old 08-31-2018, 10:38 AM
 
Location: Wonderland
44,922 posts, read 36,220,301 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by historyfan View Post
Is your daughter also not speaking to her siblings?
She was initially speaking regularly with two of the three, especially right before and after she cut everything off with me, but I do not believe she has spoken with them recently. By "recently" I mean within the past six months.

Prior to this change in her, she was calling and responding in a loving, friendly way to all her siblings and her grandparents and great grandparents (including me). I'm telling you, there was a marked and deliberate and very shocking change in her within just a few months (like three months or so) and she began severing relationships - first with my parents and then with my husband and me and one of her siblings - all within a few months.
 
Old 08-31-2018, 10:48 AM
 
Location: Wonderland
44,922 posts, read 36,220,301 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lkb0714 View Post
No there is not a huge difference. She has different political views than you. I guarantee you she does not thing she is spewing anything let alone "divisive racial diatribe". Those are your opinions of her views, and yet again you are using wildly dismissive language. If anything the way you speak of her views is diatribe. Of course she can't dialogue with you, look at the sort of disdainful language you use to categorize her views!

I guarantee I am much more liberal than anyone you know, yet I have conservative friends and we would never speak of each others views with the contempt you do of your daughters.



Dismissing your daughter as a racist. Definitely not supportive.



Dismissing you daughter as unloving.



Dismissing your daughter as rude.

Based on what YOU are saying, it is clear your think your daughter is a racist, unloving, rude, all around horrible person. Why would she want to spend time with someone who thinks that about her?



But she is a horrible person according to you. Why would she want to spend time with someone who thinks such horrible things about her?



So now she isn't just racist, unloving, rude, but she is also angry and distant? So clearly you are better off without her. I wouldn't want to be around anyone who constantly classifies me as those things. So either she really is a horrible person and you are better off without her in your life, or maybe you are taking individual moments and using them to unfairly classify her. Either way I get why she does not want to talk to you.

My daughter has many years of life experience with and without me (like I said, she was in the military and moved quite a bit in her twenties) and there is no way I would dismiss all of her personality, her accomplishments, her talents, her artistic beauty, her intelligence, her mothering skills, her marriage and career and all of that as part of being a "horrible person." This is a fairly recent behavioral shift and yes, I do think that many of her current behaviors are pretty horrible. I do think she is behaving in a racist manner - NOW. Not all her life. I do think she has behaved rudely and in a hurtful manner recently, within the past several years. It's a SHIFT from her former self and it's been extremely hurtful, destructive to our family unit, etc.

But I am not dismissing her - I am grieving over this change in her demeanor and it's consequences. I want my daughter and my grandchildren back in my life - that's pretty much the opposite of "dismissing her" or thinking "I'm better off without her in my life."

I have explained her "divisive speech" several times and if you can't understand what I find divisive about "I have to stick with MY PEOPLE," and "Typical white people garbage," and that sort of statement, then you may understand why I don't want to talk with you anymore.
 
Old 08-31-2018, 10:49 AM
 
Location: Wonderland
44,922 posts, read 36,220,301 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blondy View Post
Exactly. Sort of sad this has to be spelled out.

Anyway, its not uncommon for people the age of KA's daughter to adopt extreme views that are radically different from the ones they were raised with as they sort out who they are and what they believe.

Perhaps this daughter is a little old to just be at this point, but maybe being in the military delayed that process for her.

I am thinking if anything, that perhaps KA is just taking her way too seriously. Daughter's views are mostly extreme and irrational and as such they probably wont serve her well for long.

If she is as smart as KA says, she will eventually figure that out.

The one thing these views give her is a vehicle to carry the anger/rage she has. My guess is that rage is about being abused by her father and since she apparently doesn't express that to him it has to go somewhere.

When she runs out of places to misdirect this anger, she will probably/hopefully get counseling.
God in heaven, I hope so. All of this.
 
Old 08-31-2018, 10:55 AM
 
Location: planet earth
4,831 posts, read 1,847,687 times
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The discussion of racism, military, et al IS "political," but I understand that PARTICULAR political issues cannot be discussed in this thread, so I will not bring up the specific topic again.

OP: If you want to heal this relationship, I would suggest working on yourself - i.e., prayer/meditation/forgiveness, etc.

I don't know if you can find a social worker or therapist who might be able to assist you in understanding your daughter's point-of-view (which would help heal all of your anger towards her).

There is a particular psychology called Process Oriented Psychology (Process Work) that could be very useful to you. It helps you to step into the role of the other person, and gives you great perspective.

I don't think your solutions are going to be on the physical/material plane - I think the healing will be done on the emotional and spiritual levels - so anything you can do to send your daughter love - to send the grandkids love (energetically) will be most helpful.
 
Old 08-31-2018, 10:56 AM
 
1,193 posts, read 1,426,447 times
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Good for you, KA.
 
Old 08-31-2018, 11:08 AM
 
Location: Wisconsin
17,060 posts, read 17,376,569 times
Reputation: 41514
Quote:
Originally Posted by KathrynAragon View Post
(snip)

I have explained her "divisive speech" several times and if you can't understand what I find divisive about
"I have to stick with MY PEOPLE," and "Typical white people garbage," and that sort of statement, then you may understand why I don't want to talk with you anymore.
Have you heard your daughter say those type of comments in front of her non-black spouse and her 3/4 non black children? If yes, how did they react to her comments?
 
Old 08-31-2018, 11:16 AM
 
Location: Wonderland
44,922 posts, read 36,220,301 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nobodysbusiness View Post
The discussion of racism, military, et al IS "political," but I understand that PARTICULAR political issues cannot be discussed in this thread, so I will not bring up the specific topic again.

OP: If you want to heal this relationship, I would suggest working on yourself - i.e., prayer/meditation/forgiveness, etc.

I don't know if you can find a social worker or therapist who might be able to assist you in understanding your daughter's point-of-view (which would help heal all of your anger towards her).

There is a particular psychology called Process Oriented Psychology (Process Work) that could be very useful to you. It helps you to step into the role of the other person, and gives you great perspective.

I don't think your solutions are going to be on the physical/material plane - I think the healing will be done on the emotional and spiritual levels - so anything you can do to send your daughter love - to send the grandkids love (energetically) will be most helpful.
Thank you - I had not heard of Process Oriented Psychology so I will definitely look into this concept.

I do agree - I can't change anyone but myself, so you're absolutely right - I can only really work on myself, my own prayers, meditation, forgiveness, etc. I do pray about this situation quite a bit. Lately I've just been praying that my daughter and her family are happy and healthy.
 
Old 08-31-2018, 11:17 AM
 
Location: Wonderland
44,922 posts, read 36,220,301 times
Reputation: 63576
Quote:
Originally Posted by germaine2626 View Post
Have you heard your daughter say those type of comments in front of her non-black spouse and her 3/4 non black children? If yes, how did they react to her comments?
I had to think about this for awhile but no, now that you mention it, I have never heard her say these sorts of race oriented things in front of her kids or husband.

She has told me some truly horrible things about her husband in the past, and I was initially very concerned, but now that she's told so many people so many totally untrue and horrible things about me, I have doubted that all that stuff about her husband was even true. If I was a spiteful person I would ask him about all those things but I'm not wired together vindictively.
 
Old 08-31-2018, 12:16 PM
 
1,193 posts, read 1,426,447 times
Reputation: 2471
Physical isolation is overtly abusive. An equally dangerous, yet covert, form of abuse is to separate emotionally/socially those who are in a position to compare notes and fight for accountability. Your daughter is definitely counting on you, the husband, and those kids to not betray her confidences and secrets.

She knows you're not a spiteful/vindictive person. She knows you don't want to give her one more reason to mistreat you. She knows her husband is passive and absent. And she knows her kids are, well, kids. She's perfectly positioned to carry out her abusive behavior.

I would most definitely tell him what she's said about him. This situation really can't get any worse. I mean it can, but you know. If he's guilty of the horrible things she's said about him, he needs to be held accountable. If he's innocent of those accusations, he needs to know he's being slandered so he can protect himself and his children. Together you two may be able to get somewhere. Divide and conquer is an effective control mechanism.

Just thought I'd throw that out there. Abusers count on everyone else playing by the rules. It's a kink in the civilized armor they take advantage of. Sometimes we have to toughen up and do what needs to be done.

I understand and respect your position either way, KA.
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