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Old 07-22-2018, 07:35 PM
 
Location: Wonderland
40,888 posts, read 32,658,014 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by historyfan View Post
I have no advice regarding your daughter.



I do have this idea for your grandchildren. I worked with a lady one time who was estranged from one set of her grandchildren. The ex-daughterinlaw would send back mail addressed to the grandchildren and her own son was a unresponsible guy.



What she did was to set up savings accounts for each kid & deposit what she spent on her other grandkids for birthdays, holidays, & Christmas...and she wrote letters & cards to each (just as she did all her grands) & kept the estranged ones in her safe deposit box. Her plan was to give each their account when they turned 18 with the letters& cards.



And she had all this in her will also, so in case she passed they would get the letters & cards & accounts and know she loved them all the while.
What a good idea! I've done something like this already and will continue to do so. I do know that when I die, my grandkids will know that I never stopped loving them or yearning for them and that I don't hold them responsible for the estrangement.

 
Old 07-22-2018, 07:38 PM
 
Location: Wonderland
40,888 posts, read 32,658,014 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ginge McFantaPants View Post
But did you talk to her about the “all lives matter” incident, and acknowledge that you weren’t aware of the connotations when you said it? Because the phrase is purposefully used by whites to marginalize the BLM movement, and attempt to shut down discussion; I believe that wasn’t your intention, but it did just that.

I think I did - honestly it was so long ago I didn't dwell on it, because I do NOT mean it as a phrase to shut down someone else, and I also rarely even used that phrase. I have tried to be very consistent throughout my entire life in regard to an even handed, inquisitive response to racial matters. My parents raised me that way - they did not tolerate racism and I don't either, to my knowledge. I have been so consistent in this that I am truly baffled by my daughter's take on it.

This wasn't a catch phrase that I used often at all. It's like she just zeroed in on it and put her own opinions on top of it and expounded on what I meant when I randomly said it once or twice several years ago.
 
Old 07-22-2018, 07:38 PM
 
11,612 posts, read 5,457,812 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by germaine2626 View Post
That is a good idea about putting money that you would normally spend on gifts into a saving account. And, I would think using some type of ledger for each grandchildren would be especially nice. So, instead of a grandchild just receiving a check for (let's say) $2,000 or $5,000 or whatever on their 18 th birthday, they get a ledger, too, listing some of the times that you were thinking about them. Or all the cards and letters that you would have normally sent.

July 22, 2018, Darling Mary, Happy 10th birthday. This is in place of a gift and gigantic birthday cake with ten candles. Deposit $35
October 31, 2018, Mary, I saw some scary books in a book store that I thought that you would enjoy. Happy Halloween! Deposit $25
December 25, 2018. Merry Christmas to my wonderful granddaughter Mary! I love you! Deposit $100
etc. etc.
I like all the detail you put in this. As they go through them, they will know how specifically they were thought of on each event.
 
Old 07-22-2018, 07:38 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jencam View Post
OK, so back to you and your needs and wants. I am in no way disregarding all that you have been through, but you want to lean on your daughter who can barely handle herself. This is not reasonable in her circumstances. I am unclear what you want within the realm of what is possible.
This is a totally unfair characterization of what Kathryn said.

She didn't say she wanted to LEAN on her daughter, and I'm sure that's not what she meant or expected from her daughter.

Sharing some pleasant family time with a child/grandchildren is not LEANING on them. Its simply a respite from everything else going on.

Until whatever happened that caused this estrangement, they apparently had that kind of relationship or some semblance of it.
 
Old 07-22-2018, 07:42 PM
 
Location: Wonderland
40,888 posts, read 32,658,014 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RamenAddict View Post
THe OP also fails to take into account that many of these people mentioned were/are also her daughter’s family members, so she undoubtedly felt much of the stress of this prior to stopping speaking to the OP. In fact, if the daughter has her own issues and the OP is trying to lean on the daughter or got annoyed with her daughter for trying to discover her cultural heritage, this could very well have been part of the reason for the estrangement two years ago. My guess is that all this drama is just too much for her and she just wants some peace and quiet in her life to get some distance from everything, which has turned out to be physical distance in addition to distancing herself in other ways.
I wasn't trying to lean on my daughter - I was just hoping that we could lean on each other, if that makes sense - not a one way street, not me taking and her giving. Grief can bring people together. I have also found that it can tear people apart.

Thank God that the rest of my family didn't react the way she did. By the way, she didn't even know my inlaws, and she couldn't care less about my husband and his health issues, so really the only stress she felt was her grandparents, but she had already stopped talking to them or responding to their calls or emails months before they got so sick - this is actually something she seemed to regret when my dad lay dying in the hospital but then as soon as he died, she was back to completely ignoring my mother and me shortly thereafter.

Just for some clarification.

I do agree with you that part of her estrangement probably has to do with wanting to get away from all the "drama." Yeah, me too, but I didn't have that luxury.
 
Old 07-22-2018, 07:44 PM
 
11,612 posts, read 5,457,812 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blondy View Post
This is a totally unfair characterization of what Kathryn said.

She didn't say she wanted to LEAN on her daughter, and I'm sure that's not what she meant or expected from her daughter.

Sharing some pleasant family time with a child/grandchildren is not LEANING on them. Its simply a respite from everything else going on.

Until whatever happened that caused this estrangement, they apparently had that kind of relationship or some semblance of it.
She said she wanted more empathy from her daughter for all she went through. I'm saying the daughter can't even deal with her own feelings, and doesn't seem to have a lot of mental and emotional energy left over.

She is a 'taker' in that regard, that was made really clear in the other thread and KA wanted her to get her ish together. She isn't made that way. She and her mother are basically opposites in almost all regards KA is a trooper, this girl is more fragile.
 
Old 07-22-2018, 07:45 PM
 
Location: Wonderland
40,888 posts, read 32,658,014 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Frostnip View Post
I don't think it's at all surprising that the daughter would identify primarily as black and identify with African-American people, despite being mixed. Heck, almost all African-American people have white genes. But when most people see African features they put you in the box labeled "Black" and most of them also make a lot of assumptions along with it. She's black in the eyes of US society and it sounds like she had limited opportunity to explore that heritage as a young person (and that her white family was well-intentioned but rather tone-deaf about it) so it's not a big surprise to me that she'd double-down on it as an adult. That's a pretty common dynamic with lots of aspects of identity...heritage, interests, religion, etc.
Thank goodness my other three biracial kids don't feel the need to identify solely as one race or the other, but proudly and happily self identify as biracial.

Lots and lots of people are biracial and multiracial.

The odd thing is, that until recently this particular daughter DID self identify as biracial. This whole "I'm black and I renounce white people and white privilege" is a new tune from her. Can't much say that I care for it.
 
Old 07-22-2018, 07:46 PM
 
Location: Wonderland
40,888 posts, read 32,658,014 times
Reputation: 57020
Quote:
Originally Posted by germaine2626 View Post
That is a good idea about putting money that you would normally spend on gifts into a saving account. And, I would think using some type of ledger for each grandchildren would be especially nice. So, instead of a grandchild just receiving a check for (let's say) $2,000 or $5,000 or whatever on their 18 th birthday, they get a ledger, too, listing some of the times that you were thinking about them. Or all the cards and letters that you would have normally sent.

July 22, 2018, Darling Mary, Happy 10th birthday. This is in place of a gift and gigantic birthday cake with ten candles. Deposit $35
October 31, 2018, Mary, I saw some scary books in a book store that I thought that you would enjoy. Happy Halloween! Deposit $25
December 25, 2018. Merry Christmas to my wonderful granddaughter Mary! I love you! Deposit $100
etc. etc.
I really do love this idea.

What I've been doing is sending cards and letters and making copies of them and putting them in a file. I also included my grandchildren specifically in my will.

One day they will know how much I love them.
 
Old 07-22-2018, 07:58 PM
 
Location: planet earth
2,894 posts, read 1,017,878 times
Reputation: 6563
I think the "Black Lives Matter" issue is a real issue.

People who can't grasp the concept are considered racist.

Have you done any reading on why "Black Lives Matter" is a mantra?

Saying "all lives matter" indicates you don't "get it." And that could be very offensive to someone who identifies with BLM.

Have you made a list of all of the great traits of your daughter? I think that would help a lot. If you could muster some affection for her, I think it could be healing.

Last edited by nobodysbusiness; 07-22-2018 at 08:07 PM..
 
Old 07-22-2018, 08:00 PM
 
11,612 posts, read 5,457,812 times
Reputation: 10981
Quote:
Originally Posted by KathrynAragon View Post
Thank goodness my other three biracial kids don't feel the need to identify solely as one race or the other, but proudly and happily self identify as biracial.

Lots and lots of people are biracial and multiracial.

The odd thing is, that until recently this particular daughter DID self identify as biracial. This whole "I'm black and I renounce white people and white privilege" is a new tune from her. Can't much say that I care for it.
OK, well this rejection thing is going both ways. You can't take her for who she is. This isn't as one-sided as you make it seem.
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