Do statistics indicate that Public Assistance actually helps the receipient - Great Debates - Page 2 - City-Data Forum

Freedom123 · 04-21-2011, 01:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NewYorkBorn

I agree with you but....I am not suggesting keeping them on welfare and pay them the same wages as city employees.

Just like there is a time limit to receive welfare benefits there should be a time limit for how long they are required to work for less than minimum wage. In other words while they are doing the same jobs as city employees in exchange for their benefits they should be trained to do those jobs permanently....then when the city of New York is looking to hire more city workers instead of filling the positions through exams and then a waiting list to be called for the jobs... hire people directly from the welfare rolls for those jobs. If they would make hiring directly from the welfare rolls a part of the program then and only then will welfare provide a bridge from dependence on the system to upward mobility. Currently the city of New York uses exams and then a waiting list to fill city jobs.....the only benefit someone receiving welfare gets is that they are allowed to take those exams for free.

Here is another example of why the welfare system is a joke when people really look below the surface: Part of the benefits received go towards paying apartment rent.....in one of the worlds most expensive cities all they pay is $215 a month! Working for less than minimum wage, receiving $215 a month to pay your rent with no direct link to permanent city employment leaves people permanently dependent on the system and in most cases living in dangerous public housing projects which is the only places in NYC where rents are $215 a month. Then people believe that people on welfare want to stay on the system forever because they are lazy and don't want to work. Not saying that there are not some lazy people who are abusing the system....just saying that they are a very small segment of the welfare recipients.

You would have to be a really crazy, unmotivated lazy person to want to spend your life living in public housing, dodging bullets, living around drugs and crime just to keep from having to work!

Good afternoon,

I agree with you completely on the welfare subject, I believe it's smart to give first shot to entry level jobs to welfare recipients, I don't believe in paying them less than minimum wage, and they should be trained for permanent jobs. Actually I would prefer all public jobs in general, except the hard to "learn on the job" skilled positions, to be stepping stones for the poor to better, permanent jobs we train them for. I'm also for a time limit so no one rides the system for life.

In regards to the housing for the poor, I do not believe anyone has the right to live in expensive cities like New York if they cannot afford it. If I were poor and living in NYC, I would move and commute to the city by train or car, or move and live/work in my new area. I don't think we should subsidize people's living choices if they are able bodied enough to work and make enough to pay rent elsewhere in a safe yet less expensive area.

I'm saying this as someone who grew up in the type of projects you are referring to. I will say that a large number did not want to leave and loved the projects as their home. Many (not all) see the bullets and other things as just part of daily life. Eventually things become normal when you see it every day and you know who's shooting at who. I felt like an outsider, especially when voicing my opinion of wanting to finish school and move out.

Even the ones who "make it out" would come by and hang out often because they liked it there. Outsiders see it as a horrible place, but to them it's home since that's where friends and family are. It's not everyone in the project's opinion and I won't say it's the majority, but look at the numbers in protest when tearing down projects in New Orleans among other cities.

NewYorkBorn · 04-21-2011, 02:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Freedom123

Good afternoon,

I agree with you completely on the welfare subject, I believe it's smart to give first shot to entry level jobs to welfare recipients, I don't believe in paying them less than minimum wage, and they should be trained for permanent jobs. Actually I would prefer all public jobs in general, except the hard to "learn on the job" skilled positions, to be stepping stones for the poor to better, permanent jobs we train them for. I'm also for a time limit so no one rides the system for life.

In regards to the housing for the poor, I do not believe anyone has the right to live in expensive cities like New York if they cannot afford it. If I were poor and living in NYC, I would move and commute to the city by train or car, or move and live/work in my new area. I don't think we should subsidize people's living choices if they are able bodied enough to work and make enough to pay rent elsewhere in a safe yet less expensive area.

I'm saying this as someone who grew up in the type of projects you are referring to. I will say that a large number did not want to leave and loved the projects as their home. Many (not all) see the bullets and other things as just part of daily life. Eventually things become normal when you see it every day and you know who's shooting at who. I felt like an outsider, especially when voicing my opinion of wanting to finish school and move out.

Even the ones who "make it out" would come by and hang out often because they liked it there. Outsiders see it as a horrible place, but to them it's home since that's where friends and family are. It's not everyone in the project's opinion and I won't say it's the majority, but look at the numbers in protest when tearing down projects in New Orleans among other cities.

Then we have something in common. I grew up in Fort Greene (downtown Brooklyn) but came from a good home. My mother worked, put me and my brother through private school so that we would not have to deal with the horrors of the neighborhood public school system. This is why I know from first hand experience that not everyone who is on welfare does so because they enjoy living that way. My mother believed that just because you come from the ghetto does not mean you should be stuck there and cannot rise above it. Growing up I saw all of the social ills associated with the welfare system first hand.

Regarding living in expensive NYC....I agree with you to the extent that if you cannot afford NYC then you should not live here...but after moving from NYC to live in South Carolina for a few years I can understand why people who are barely scrapping by choose to stay here. Nobody offers the types of opportunities that NYC offers as far as employment. This is the reason this city is swelled with over 8 million residents....there is a demand to live here because good paying jobs can be found here. Thus the contradiction with welfare in NYC....people being used as cheap labor in one of the worlds most expensive cities when they should be hired as permanent employees so that they can get off of welfare. Definitely with you there.....they should give welfare recipients the city jobs before anyone else...doing this will turn a negative situation into a positive one and save the city a lot of money in the process.

Freedom123 · 04-21-2011, 02:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NewYorkBorn

Then we have something in common. I grew up in Fort Greene (downtown Brooklyn) but came from a good home. My mother worked, put me and my brother through private school so that we would not have to deal with the horrors of the neighborhood public school system. This is why I know from first hand experience that not everyone who is on welfare does so because they enjoy living that way. My mother believed that just because you come from the ghetto does not mean you should be stuck there and cannot rise above it. Growing up I saw all of the social ills associated with the welfare system first hand.

Regarding living in expensive NYC....I agree with you to the extent that if you cannot afford NYC then you should not live here...but after moving from NYC to live in South Carolina for a few years I can understand why people who are barely scrapping by choose to stay here. Nobody offers the types of opportunities that NYC offers as far as employment. This is the reason this city is swelled with over 8 million residents....there is a demand to live here because good paying jobs can be found here. Thus the contradiction with welfare in NYC....people being used as cheap labor in one of the worlds most expensive cities when they should be hired as permanent employees so that they can get off of welfare. Definitely with you there.....they should give welfare recipients the city jobs before anyone else...doing this will turn a negative situation into a positive one and save the city a lot of money in the process.

Good afternoon,

I don't have anything to add since I agree with everything you said, but I wanted to acknowledge that I read your post and appreciate you sharing your story and your opinion.