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Old 03-31-2012, 11:21 AM
 
Location: :~)
1,483 posts, read 1,475,323 times
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American culture is not going down. Media coverage is the difference. Movie stars, politicians, athletes cannot roam the country with free rein to do whatever. The reality is that the lack of strong media coverage helped those dated eras. I wonder if the media coverage was as strong in 1900s if we would look back at those era's with such respect, I seriously doubt it. Those era's have countless skeletons in their closet.

Of course, the next generation are concerning with the style of dress, lack of respect towards sex and drug use, but those concerns touch all generations in their youth. Besides that, this generation are far smarter and reared than other eras. I see nothing but improvement. I honestly believe that we have improved with each generation.

The problem is that the older generations always look at the present generation with animosity because they are jealous. They had their time to shine and now its time for our kids to have the limelight.
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Old 03-31-2012, 02:16 PM
 
Location: Europe
5,994 posts, read 5,049,390 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jbub22 View Post
...The problem is that the older generations always look at the present generation with animosity because they are jealous. They had their time to shine and now its time for our kids to have the limelight.
This strikes me as a generalization needing some very serious revision. Most older people that I know - including myself, would be "jealous" of the better health and physical condition of the young. Period.

Unless, your sense of your self, your worth, your value has been based in something transient, such as your looks, athletic ability, being the most popular guy who hung out at the local gas station, manager of the office, whatever, I don't think there is anything remotely like animosity toward the younger generation. Perhaps you value this thing you have called "the limelight" as the prize in life, and when you are no longer in it you will be diminished as person by that lack.

All of our accomplishments will change and diminish over the course of the years. Deny that, and there will reach a point where you become a walking dead man....and most certainly you will look at even the most callow young person with animosity and envy.

My life is far richer and more enjoyable in my seventies than it was in my twenties or thirties. Because it takes a life to have a life, and without aging you cannot have it.

Today I sat in cafe, reading a book, looking at the sea and talking to the family I know who run the place. There were three young American men in their early twenties there having a conversation, and later they were joined by four or five more. They were physically vital, and seemingly massively empty between the ears for college students. The former will change without a doubt, and perhaps the latter as well.

But there was certainly nothing, other than their evident good health, to rouse the slightest bit of envy. I don't personally know one single person who would want to be twenty now or even thirty. The richness of life is in the living of it, and learning from it and that reward continues to accumulate until senescence or death ends it.

And if it does not, it is because you decided to look back in longing and regret, and have ended up like Lot's wife.
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Old 03-31-2012, 02:40 PM
 
1,071 posts, read 678,661 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rathagos View Post
Talking with some coworkers this Monday morning, and the subject topic came up. Surprisingly (or maybe not so suprisingly) every one of us believe that American culture and society is on a downslide and has been for several decades. What we can't agree on is when it started.

Some of them say when America picked politics (tongue in cheek) as it's favorite pasttime (about the 1930s). That once politics really took off, it became commonplace for lying, cheating, backstabbing, etc. And since people of that generation generally respected politicians (or at least the profession was respected), that the behaviors that had been adopted were seen as acceptable, and the decline started at that point.

Others say when women entered the workforce during/just after World War II. This is NOT a woman-bashing, or male chauvinistic reasoning. What the argument is (and some of the co-workers are female who agree with this premise) is that women realized they could do the jobs of men (including more of the strenuous physical labor-type); and, thus started the opening of the floodgates of women into the workforce. The fallout was two-fold: first, families started seeing the results of both parents working (there were far fewer single-parent households back then) - resulting in families not establishing what were generally common morals and acceptable behaviors to the children, leaving that up to the younger (and generally less life-experienced) day care centers/babysitters; and, secondly, that we effectively doubled the workforce without creating a proportionate amount of jobs. The latter issue would start the ever-increasing unemployment numbers that still exist today. This, then, was the opening for government subsidy programs, which some argue contribute greatly to the decline of society.

Yet others would say it was the "sex, drugs, and rock-and-roll" of the 60's, where "if it feels good, do it!" was the motto for the day. What that effectively did was start the "turning the head" for immoral behaviors to not only find a foothold, but actually propogate throughout the country as "normal" behaviors. Everything from TV shows to songs on the radio started playing whatever they could for shock value (and sales), but what it also did was lay the underlying notion that there was not a "baseline acceptable" behavior for society. Without that - and forced acceptance of "abnormal behaviors" that followed (by definition, behaviors that were not practiced by the majority of society at that time), society started down the moral/cultural decline that exists today. Now, people are so used to "turning the other cheek" that it's too late to put the proverbial cat back in the bag, and society wouldn't be able to create any sort of "normal" culture or society because bucking the system has become fashionable, even in (or because of) the judiciary system.

Others still have random thoughts of the "me" generation yuppies of the 90's, to the San Francisco hippie/gay rights movements, to drama shows on TV today.

So, are we (as a nation) on a cultural and/or moral downslide that we can't recover from, or are there just a bunch of uptight "old fashioned" people who want to stand in the way of progress? If we are on that downslide, when did it start and can it be stopped (or do we even want it to)?
I remember the Tom Brokaw era as being the best, he even wrote a book about it..............I was taught good moral values, which I passed on to my children.

I would say the 1960's was the beginning point, when HOLLYWOOD began to zero in on it. Now, Hollywood has created a CESSPOOL. There are no moral values whatsoever. Most of Hollywood is on drugs, and it means nothing to publicized it. Get rid of Hollywood, and there is a possibility of a come-back.
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Old 03-31-2012, 06:30 PM
 
Location: :~)
1,483 posts, read 1,475,323 times
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Default Yeah right!

Quote:
Originally Posted by kevxu View Post
This strikes me as a generalization needing some very serious revision. Most older people that I know - including myself, would be "jealous" of the better health and physical condition of the young. Period.

Unless, your sense of your self, your worth, your value has been based in something transient, such as your looks, athletic ability, being the most popular guy who hung out at the local gas station, manager of the office, whatever, I don't think there is anything remotely like animosity toward the younger generation. Perhaps you value this thing you have called "the limelight" as the prize in life, and when you are no longer in it you will be diminished as person by that lack.

All of our accomplishments will change and diminish over the course of the years. Deny that, and there will reach a point where you become a walking dead man....and most certainly you will look at even the most callow young person with animosity and envy.

My life is far richer and more enjoyable in my seventies than it was in my twenties or thirties. Because it takes a life to have a life, and without aging you cannot have it.

Today I sat in cafe, reading a book, looking at the sea and talking to the family I know who run the place. There were three young American men in their early twenties there having a conversation, and later they were joined by four or five more. They were physically vital, and seemingly massively empty between the ears for college students. The former will change without a doubt, and perhaps the latter as well.

But there was certainly nothing, other than their evident good health, to rouse the slightest bit of envy. I don't personally know one single person who would want to be twenty now or even thirty. The richness of life is in the living of it, and learning from it and that reward continues to accumulate until senescence or death ends it.

And if it does not, it is because you decided to look back in longing and regret, and have ended up like Lot's wife.
Those comments sound envies.

Accomplishments are documented in History books. That's not enough, elders must jump to the forefront and lead the youth. Senseless critiquing stymies growth.

Physicality was addressed a few times in the prior communication which does lead one to consider that there is much envy. I think this generation is doing fine but they need their elder statesmen, like you, to guide them versus looking at them with animosity.
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Old 04-01-2012, 11:31 PM
 
Location: Old Town Alexandria
14,401 posts, read 15,218,054 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brightdoglover View Post
People say that certain points in television were the decline, I'd say television itself. I mean, radio was great- people who lived all over could be informed and entertained with only audio commercials. Visuals are absorbed in a very different way in the brain, and now we have 24-hour-a-day many many multiple media points to get images beamed in (Facebook, advertising *everywhere*). So I'd say that "culture" took a downward dive with the spread of TV.
"Family disintegration" isn't what I think of as "culture," but no question that with more freedom, more people (women) with more choices, could choose not to marry/stay home/raise children. I think that is great for individuals, and I'm one of them. I do agree with the poster who suggested we are meant to live (hard-wired, that is) in a tribal or clan or village-sized group. Note that most tribal people get up to some degree of number of people, and then parts start to branch off, although there might be some kind of federation among the parts (didn't the Iraquious (SP) teach the 13 first states about that?
That said, Pandora's box is opened. Such communities rarely exist in modern U.S. society and most people (myself included) wouldn't know how to be in one or start one.
I think you could call that a decline in a major aspect of U.S. life (community) but not culture.
There is less sense of community in American society than years ago. In the 1950's and 60's people lived in a neighborhood, there was a sense of belonging. Alienation and emptiness is more common today in a materialistic society in which, people spend and spend, but come up empty.

TV and mass media has morphed into "info-tainment" and cheaply produced reality trash that sadly reflects declining values and education.

People are social animals and require interaction, but todays society isn't amenable to this. Yes, there is a decline for certain, all you have to do is turn on the news or whatever dreck that passes for "entertainment" (MTV, trash reality shows) and it has really sunk to the bottom.
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Old 04-16-2012, 02:36 PM
 
41,246 posts, read 43,989,368 times
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Siciety ids always chnaging. Look closely at the 1920's and what you see is similar culture change to what has happened lately.which didn't last in the end. The 60's so called revolution didn't last. The inductrial revolutio which brought people i wave tot eh cities because they were the hubs of energy and transportatio for logistics reason. The great cultural shift that started in the post war is continuing with people actually being more ncontrol of their own future rather than be a part of the industrial thread mill of the production line.
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Old 04-16-2012, 03:23 PM
 
Location: West Egg
2,160 posts, read 724,477 times
Reputation: 1251
No.

All cultures are in a perpetual state of flux. A given person may or may not like certain cultural trends at a specific point in time. Inevitably, another person will hold the opposite view.

It's all a matter of taste, nothing more. The idea that there is some objective 'downsliding' (or the reverse, for that matter) is only so much narcissism.
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Old 04-17-2012, 03:29 PM
 
5,705 posts, read 3,961,970 times
Reputation: 3185
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rathagos View Post
Talking with some coworkers this Monday morning, and the subject topic came up. Surprisingly (or maybe not so suprisingly) every one of us believe that American culture and society is on a downslide and has been for several decades. What we can't agree on is when it started.
If I could put my finger on it, I'd say the eighties.
The seventies were still one of the last cultural peaks in the US history, but the eighties already went to Europe.
The inspiration never returned to the US in the same way as it used to be up until the eighties; American culture was on a downslide from that point on.
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Old 04-21-2012, 06:49 PM
 
Location: Purgatory
2,667 posts, read 2,260,113 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by erasure View Post
If I could put my finger on it, I'd say the eighties.
The seventies were still one of the last cultural peaks in the US history, but the eighties already went to Europe.
The inspiration never returned to the US in the same way as it used to be up until the eighties; American culture was on a downslide from that point on.
I agree, the 80's is really when the rampant materialism and consumerism kicked in, big time. The 80's spawned tacky pop music, technology at home, Thatcher in Britain and Reagan in the US. It was most definitely the start of the downward slide, only now even popular music from the 80's seems several notches above the crap in the charts today.
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Old 04-23-2012, 04:10 AM
 
Location: Houston, Texas
1,082 posts, read 860,957 times
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The downslide started with Kinsey. He is the father of the sexual revolution. Of course he preceded the sexual revolution and between him and the sexual revolution we had one of the most conservative periods of time in the 20th century.

So, the seeds of decline were planted by Kinsey. They germinated in the 60s counterculture free love movement.
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