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Old 09-02-2012, 09:02 AM
 
12,643 posts, read 12,071,712 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jerseygal4u View Post
So why do people have a problem with hair growing naturally from someone's head?
I ask my self why people have these invented problems with many things people do. Seems people just search for reasons to be critical of someone.

The "corporate culture" is just a BS term as there is no one book on corporate culture, every place is different, and everyone has their anecdotal stories regarding workplace dress codes. Dreads are not acceptable in some companies, perfectly fine in others. Just last year a company (Swiss if I recall), that published a dress code even stating what underwear a person is suppose to wear.

My opinion is a person should be hired based on skill; it is because the lack of doing this simply concept that we have to have an array of EEO laws. My job is to maximize shareholder wealth, that is it, not input my personal opinion regarding fashion and make hiring decisions based on that.
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Old 09-02-2012, 09:20 AM
 
12,643 posts, read 12,071,712 times
Reputation: 17282
Quote:
Originally Posted by jghorton View Post
Years ago, IBM presented all employees with a "dress for success" orientation. The information was derived from a large number of studies of things like, "What colors, styles, appearance trends, etc. do business people trust or respond well to?" There were no 'rules or requirements' by IBM, but, most of the intelligent, young IBM'ers came to a similar conclusion: 'These things make sense and work, so if I want to be successful, why wouldn't I give it a try?'

Ultimately, the majority of IBM'ers were characterized by black/blue pin-striped suits, long sleeve white blouses/shirts, conservative shoes, no facial hair, short haircuts, red/plain 'power' ties/scarves, etc. Correspondingly, IBM led the marketplace in computer sales and business consulting.

Maybe today is different, but, one does not see many professional people who interface with the public ... wearing nose rings, dreadlocks, tank tops, beards, etc. It's not really a question of what is 'required' or what one 'should' do, but, "What is appropriate and works in the specific environment?"
Can you please expand on this "dress for success"? What year and under what CEO? I would like to know since you did not allude to any year, and you stated "IBM led the marketplace in computer sales and business consulting." What, in the 70's? 80's? What year?

Because IBM has always been pretty uniformed, and in the 90's, this dress code was relaxed.
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Old 09-02-2012, 12:42 PM
 
Location: Philadelphia, Pa
1,416 posts, read 1,479,949 times
Reputation: 1565
Quote:
Originally Posted by jerseygal4u View Post
Shouldn't this be in the hair forum?

I don't think dreads are a way of expressing one's self.
Dreads are just the natural way black people's hair grows.
It IS the hair coming out of their scalp.
So why do people have a problem with hair growing naturally from someone's head?
I don't have a problem with people who don't can't or retired from working wearing dreadlocks. I have a problem with people wearing their hair in an un- presentable fashion.
It may be natural,yet their are many people who cut their hair.

Presentation is everything,many people just become discouraged with people wearing hair all in their face. I also don't believe that it's such blacks only with the dreadlocks, whites as well.
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Old 09-02-2012, 01:30 PM
 
Location: Dallas
5,463 posts, read 4,577,627 times
Reputation: 15591
The problem with dredlocks is that they are often full of lint, and other nastiness. I've been seated or standing behind someone wearing them and had a hard time keeping from gagging with disgust. Same with oily, unwashed hair. Neither has any place in a corporate environment.
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Old 09-02-2012, 05:24 PM
 
5,532 posts, read 5,714,122 times
Reputation: 3146
Quote:
Originally Posted by aquietpath View Post
The problem with dredlocks is that they are often full of lint, and other nastiness. I've been seated or standing behind someone wearing them and had a hard time keeping from gagging with disgust. Same with oily, unwashed hair. Neither has any place in a corporate environment.
1) Wrong answer. In the corporate environment people mimic their peers and follow the boss's example. For example, once casual wear had no place in a business environment. In the company I was employed in 2000, one day, the CEO came wearing chinos and a polo. Next week, about 1/2 of the senior management emulated it to the smallest detail. A month later, about 50% of all employees did the same.
2) But dreadlocks have a much deeper meaning. The people wearing them try to signal the "white establishment": we are different. We are not like you and we'll do almost everything we can to be different. Now, why don't you love us
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Old 09-02-2012, 05:53 PM
Status: "happy again, no longer catless! t...." (set 5 days ago)
 
Location: Cushing OK
14,421 posts, read 16,681,935 times
Reputation: 16425
Quote:
Originally Posted by boxus View Post
I ask my self why people have these invented problems with many things people do. Seems people just search for reasons to be critical of someone.

The "corporate culture" is just a BS term as there is no one book on corporate culture, every place is different, and everyone has their anecdotal stories regarding workplace dress codes. Dreads are not acceptable in some companies, perfectly fine in others. Just last year a company (Swiss if I recall), that published a dress code even stating what underwear a person is suppose to wear.

My opinion is a person should be hired based on skill; it is because the lack of doing this simply concept that we have to have an array of EEO laws. My job is to maximize shareholder wealth, that is it, not input my personal opinion regarding fashion and make hiring decisions based on that.
The image a company presents is up to them. I would hope that guys with longer hair and pony tails would qualify too if they allow dreds. And who sees them matters as well. Like it our not if working with the public the robot standard image is normal. Your not supposed to notice the guy helping you, but the help they give.

The place I worked for we never saw the public but had to look 'bank'. It was their choice. An similar job in a non-bank would likely have had different requirements for programmers. But as a trainee I got to do origional design and programming, which was amazing and I'd certaily wear suits for that. We can build a wall of rules or let people choose. If you have long hair/dreds/a full beard and you don't want them to go, and the company says you do you can pick hair or job. I'd rather have that then the minute control of everything from someone's rules.

And yes, hiring should be from skill. Perhaps it should be evaluated by someone seperate and the jobs you fit listed WITH grooming requirements. If its not worth a haircut, it's your choice. But its going to prune the unqualified who just 'feel right' or know someone.

Companies where things are very creative seldom want suits and ties. Companies where it's business and finance usually expect business dress and grooming. It is part of the feel of the job. I'm by no means an apologist for business, but I hate the way the rules are being detailed out so finely today, and if a company wants everyone to look totally businesslike, then let them. If a well qualified applicant doesn't want to work there and goes elswehere over hair or suits then its up to them.

What I'd absolutely say is wrong is saying a company must allow dreadlocks. It either says hair style is up to you or they set the list. You can't pick and choose to satifisy the sensitivites of some one 'group'.
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Old 09-02-2012, 06:02 PM
Status: "happy again, no longer catless! t...." (set 5 days ago)
 
Location: Cushing OK
14,421 posts, read 16,681,935 times
Reputation: 16425
Quote:
Originally Posted by oberon_1 View Post
1) Wrong answer. In the corporate environment people mimic their peers and follow the boss's example. For example, once casual wear had no place in a business environment. In the company I was employed in 2000, one day, the CEO came wearing chinos and a polo. Next week, about 1/2 of the senior management emulated it to the smallest detail. A month later, about 50% of all employees did the same.
2) But dreadlocks have a much deeper meaning. The people wearing them try to signal the "white establishment": we are different. We are not like you and we'll do almost everything we can to be different. Now, why don't you love us
So does the guy with hair to his waist and a nice fluffy beard. He's saying he's not part of the 'establishment'. That why grooming policies tend to be specific in what you can do. It's easier than excluding things.

And if one has dredlocks and don't wash their hair then the company had every right to say cut/wash/or whatever because its assumed that people keep their hair clean and others don't have to smell it. Same for the hippy guy or someone who lookes 'normal' but had smelly hair. Or the woman who over indulges on perfume. Your right to do what you want ends when you share a room with others and you do not have the right to smell it up because its 'traditional'.
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Old 09-02-2012, 06:16 PM
 
Location: Philadelphia, Pa
1,416 posts, read 1,479,949 times
Reputation: 1565
We should hire off three things: Skill,background and presentation.

Dreadlocks and long hair for men is not presentable and people tend to form and opinion and look the other way.
Here's a point
Your In walmart and you need help finding a product, who would you ask first?

The clean cut guy? Or the guy with dreadlocks 3 feet from his scalp?


Honestly, is this presentable to any of you?
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Old 09-04-2012, 02:35 AM
 
Location: Monnem Germany/ from San Diego
2,242 posts, read 2,314,898 times
Reputation: 4639
Quote:
Originally Posted by chris123678 View Post
We should hire off three things: Skill,background and presentation.

Dreadlocks and long hair for men is not presentable and people tend to form and opinion and look the other way.
Here's a point
Your In walmart and you need help finding a product, who would you ask first?

The clean cut guy? Or the guy with dreadlocks 3 feet from his scalp?


Honestly, is this presentable to any of you?
I would ask the guy with dreads first and I am a fairly clean cut (was not always) white guy.
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Old 09-04-2012, 10:37 AM
 
Location: Downtown Los Angeles
141 posts, read 235,863 times
Reputation: 132
Dreadlocks are fine; but I'm not fond of the obese corporate types' big bellies. They should get cut off. On the other hand, anybody who doesn't look cool enough, should be fired.
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