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Old 10-16-2012, 09:29 AM
 
8,402 posts, read 19,659,004 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by A2DAC1985 View Post

A doctor does what THEY think is best for you. They are the experts. There must be a reason why two doctors gave you the same medicine, when you though you needed something else.

A lawyer does what they think is best for their client. Yes, and they manipulate the system to produce the desired result, wiht little ethical or moral intervention.
Quote:
Originally Posted by A2DAC1985 View Post
That's the key part. Not all lawyers "become" politicians. And certainly, not all politicians are former lawyers.

What about doctors who become politicians? Are they just as bad?
A dentist who is a state senator here lied to my face repeatedly when we were in the early stages of working together on a project years ago. He used many of my suggestions, but told me he'd come up with these ideas himself. Eventually I stopped pursuing the project. I found out later that he'd already contracted with someone else, while "working" with me, because they were cheaper. Basically he took what he learned from me and told the other guy to do it that way, while I was still trying to get his business. Shame on me for not seeing it sooner. That dentist is one of the reasons I started giving out very little info until I was under contract.



Quote:
Originally Posted by markg91359 View Post
Talk about self-serving nonsense. Many prominent people in this society don't believe that they should be held to account for their mistakes and carelessness. If you fall into that category, I don't suppose you will like lawyers.

The world we live in today does have a lot of waivers, warnings, and sometimes even I think that precautions go a bit a far. Nevertheless, I contrast it with the world I grew up in the 1960's in this country.

1. Cars had no seat belts.

2. Child safety seats for children were non-existent.

3. I had a friend badly scarred by an old-fashioned steamer in which the top was not secured to the bottom. One day, being three years old, she pulled it off the counter and poured scalding water all over herself.

4. I used to target shoot and one day a gun with a particularly poor design prematurely ignited a rim fire cartridge and it blew up in my face. I was lucky I didn't lose the sight in one of my eyes.

5. Defective designs in airliners and airplanes caused numerous crashes and fatalities over the years.

6. Lawn mowers and snow blowers didn't have safety devices that shut off when your hands were not on the controls. It lead to many people having fingers and toes chopped off by moving parts because they acted without thinking.

Accidents are caused. They don't just happen. No one likes lawsuits, but in our society where everything is governed by a profit motive and there are incentives to do things in a cheaper and more slipshod way, lawsuits by private individuals are a necessity. I'd argue that a private tort system is better than government regulation. It gives each individual the power to redress their grievances. Its not a "one-size-fits-all model" like regulation inevitably is. Finally, a jury of other citizens in the community decides whether you are entitled to compensation as opposed to some bureaucrat.

Lawyers will never be held in the same esteem that doctors are and that's fine with me. It doesn't change the fact that whether we are liked or not we fill a valuable and essential role in controlling the power of abusive corporations, omnipotent government officials, and irresponsible people in all professions and occupations.
For every one of the important lawsuits that promote worthwhile change, there are a hundred that are frivolous. They suck up the resources that WE pay for, and take up precious time that should be spent on more important cases.

Accidents are part of life. They aren't all sue-worthy.
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Old 10-16-2012, 09:45 AM
 
Location: Chicago area
13,225 posts, read 7,301,065 times
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We have a good friend that's a very successful personal injury attorney and he told us that juries side with MD's about 90% of the time. I've worked in healthcare for about 25 years now and I've seen some excellent Doc's and some real Bozos that I can't figure out how they ever made it through medical school. There is this misconception by the public that MD's are God and can't possibly make mistakes. He told us that in some parts of the country that no matter what they do people believe that the MD's are never wrong. Our friend is the nicest most generous person and doesn't fit the stereotypical lawyer image. He won a multimillion dollar case and took part of his commission and set up a foundation in honor of his client to help others in the same predicament. He also bought the victims mother a car from his earnings. I guess the bottom line here is that you have to look at people as individuals and not as some stereotypical misconception.
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Old 10-16-2012, 09:58 AM
 
8,414 posts, read 8,676,859 times
Reputation: 26212
Quote:
For every one of the important lawsuits that promote worthwhile change, there are a hundred that are frivolous. They suck up the resources that WE pay for, and take up precious time that should be spent on more important cases.
And you have no basis for your 100/1 ratio. My opinion that there are 100 solid cases for every 3 frivolous ones is as solid as yours.

Quote:
Accidents are part of life. They aren't all sue-worthy.
Tell me that after your whole family is killed because a semi-trailer truck driver falls asleep and drives over the top of their car.

This is a case I was actually involved in.
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Old 10-16-2012, 11:02 AM
 
Location: Chicago
1,312 posts, read 1,536,257 times
Reputation: 1486
Quote:
Originally Posted by vmaxnc View Post
(1)They are the experts. There must be a reason why two doctors gave you the same medicine, when you though you needed something else.

(2)...Yes, and they manipulate the system to produce the desired result, wiht little ethical or moral intervention.
1. They are the experts on my pain??? My insurance company and myself were paying for services. I told them that I needed medication for the pain I was in. The doctors denied what I needed based on their own thoughts.

If I want to sue somebody for having a faulty escalator that caused harm to me, a lawyer will take my case. The lawyer doesn't say, "You should have taken the stairs, therefore I will not take your case." Even if the lawyer thinks I'm to blame for the incident, and they take my money, they will do what I want them to (within legal guidelines).

Doctors make judgments based on their education/experience, but it is filtered through their own experience and personal feelings on the situation.


How about this (true story):

I have a sister. Back when she was younger she had a problem. She couldn't talk. She was 2 years old, and all she could do was scream.

3 years old? Only scream.

4 years old? Only scream.

5 years old? Only scream.

Between ages 3 and 4 my mother took my sister to the doctor. My mother thought my sister was "tongue tied". My sister couldn't stick her tongue out of her mouth, not even past her teeth... couldn't lick an ice cream cone, etc. The doctor berated her and told her there was no such thing as being "tongue tied". He told her, essentially, that she (my sister) was just "retarded". My mother left the office in tears.

Because my sister could only scream (scream for: the bathroom, for food, for being tired, for being too warm/cold, etc.) my mom taught my sister sign language so she wouldn't have to scream every time she wanted something. My sister picked up many signs, and used them effectively.

When I was 7 years old I needed my tonsils out. We went to a special doctor that would do the surgery for me. My mom and sister came along for my consultation.

While in this doctor's office, my sister wanted/needed various things and communicated them to my mom through sign language. The doctor remarked how it was great that my mom taught my deaf sister sign language. My mother informed him that she was not deaf, but just didn't speak.

This doctor asked to take a look at my sister and quickly came to the realization that my sister was, in fact, "tongue tied". He said he would schedule an operation for her to have her tongue "clipped" (that part that connects to the bottom of your mouth) after my tonsil surgery was done.

Two (2) weeks after my sister's surgery, she was starting to talk. She currently speaks perfectly fine. If my mother would have listened to the first doctor and his "experience/education", my sister my very well have been a (screaming) mute to this day.


Moral of the story?: Doctors use/do what they think is best given their own BIAS. Lawyers will do what their clients want, within the law, whether they personally agree with your legal troubles or not.



2. Do you know what ethics are??? Look up the terms, "Deontological", "Teleological", and "Golden Mean", then tell me lawyers don't have ethics.




Also, I have a few more stories of how doctors did what "they think is best", and didn't even take into consideration what the patients wanted, and turned out to be totally wrong. I can provide those stories upon request.
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Old 10-16-2012, 11:16 AM
 
Location: Chicago area
13,225 posts, read 7,301,065 times
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[
















Also, I have a few more stories of how doctors did what "they think is best", and didn't even take into consideration what the patients wanted, and turned out to be totally wrong. I can provide those stories upon request.[/quote]
I lost a work friend to a simple hernia repair. The last time I saw her she was on a ventilator and I took her down to the cath lab after her first arrest. She died a day later. Over a hernia repair! I gave her family my friends number. He'll get them a well deserved settlement. How do you botch a hernia repair??????
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Old 10-16-2012, 11:25 AM
 
Location: Chicago
1,312 posts, read 1,536,257 times
Reputation: 1486
Quote:
Originally Posted by animalcrazy View Post
[

I lost a work friend to a simple hernia repair. The last time I saw her she was on a ventilator and I took her down to the cath lab after her first arrest. She died a day later. Over a hernia repair! I gave her family my friends number. He'll get them a well deserved settlement. How do you botch a hernia repair??????
I have a story about appendicitis. I will only tell it if the poster I responded to wants to hear it.
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Old 10-16-2012, 12:22 PM
 
Location: San Diego
993 posts, read 775,559 times
Reputation: 854
Quote:
Originally Posted by LexWest View Post
I think we're aware of the stereotypes involving the "life-saver" doctors, and "pond-scum" lawyers; and generally, it's assumed doctors are "better."

I'm not denying there are good doctors, as there certainly are many. I'm also not denying there are lawyers that are only after your money. But there are also good lawyers out there who actually do care about their clients and aren't necessarily striking it rich either, as well as doctors that take advantage of patients. You seek out services from lawyers. You go to them when you need them. They will not "make" you see them. Doctors make or expect you to see them (whether you need to, want to or not) with appointments, check-ups, etc. There are an abundance of clinics opening in America in recent years. Are they really for convenience, or are they taking for granted the declining health of Americans? Do we really need all these treatments, preventive measures, supplements, or are they underhanded ways of making money (by convincing us our doctors are trying to "help" us)?

As much as I love my doctor, and haven't needed a lawyer myself, my overall point is people generally make the doctor vs. lawyer divide far too black and white. Let's not pretend all doctors are really after our best interest, and that there aren't actually lawyers who really are after our best interest.

Thoughts?

The problem is that there are few doctors who chase ambulances to exploit someone's injury to increase their own personal revenue stream.

There are also few doctors who defend child molesters, murderers and rapists in court.

There are also few doctors who defend evil corporations in court that profit off of the harming of citizens.

That's why Lawyers are considered scum while doctors are not.

Disclaimer: My sister, adopted brother, and basically all of my cousins are attorneys.

However, there are attorneys like my sister, brother and my cousins who got into law to make a difference. My sister runs a charity. My brother fights to protect natural resources. My cousin is well on his way to a political career where he'll attempt to make the world a better place.

And there are doctors who exploit the insurance system, who make patients get unnecessary surgery to increase revenue, who work for tobacco companies and make shady medical reports to deny the dangers of their products, etc.

That's why you shouldn't judge people solely based on their profession. You should judge people based on who they are as a person.
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Old 10-16-2012, 01:40 PM
 
Location: SW MO
23,605 posts, read 30,495,011 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ThinkBeforeYouVote View Post
My cousin is well on his way to a political career where he'll attempt to make the world a better placce.

That's why you shouldn't judge people solely based on their profession. You should judge people based on who they are as a person.
Until or unless he becomes tainted, leading to corrupted. I hope it doesn't happen. However, I saw it literally hundreds of times during my 20 years as a political and legislative analyst. They start out meaning well but they don't always end up that way. I would hope your cousin would prove to be an exception to the rule. I do know some good ones even today.
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Old 10-16-2012, 07:06 PM
 
48,519 posts, read 81,474,308 times
Reputation: 17990
Actaully its trial lawyers who sue that are more like car salesman and if you study cliams they get most of the reward. Why;because they setup and run the system .I mena it has been said i time lawyers will not be a problem as at the rate the profession is growing ;we will all be lawyers. that creates a problem i that they have to creat new law and ways of getting money.
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Old 10-16-2012, 07:15 PM
 
Location: Southeast, where else?
3,914 posts, read 4,041,525 times
Reputation: 5781
Quote:
Originally Posted by LexWest View Post
I think we're aware of the stereotypes involving the "life-saver" doctors, and "pond-scum" lawyers; and generally, it's assumed doctors are "better."

I'm not denying there are good doctors, as there certainly are many. I'm also not denying there are lawyers that are only after your money. But there are also good lawyers out there who actually do care about their clients and aren't necessarily striking it rich either, as well as doctors that take advantage of patients. You seek out services from lawyers. You go to them when you need them. They will not "make" you see them. Doctors make or expect you to see them (whether you need to, want to or not) with appointments, check-ups, etc. There are an abundance of clinics opening in America in recent years. Are they really for convenience, or are they taking for granted the declining health of Americans? Do we really need all these treatments, preventive measures, supplements, or are they underhanded ways of making money (by convincing us our doctors are trying to "help" us)?

As much as I love my doctor, and haven't needed a lawyer myself, my overall point is people generally make the doctor vs. lawyer divide far too black and white. Let's not pretend all doctors are really after our best interest, and that there aren't actually lawyers who really are after our best interest.

Thoughts?

Doctors usually heal...lawyers usually hurt?
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