Are "Gay Pride Parades" damaging to the community (March, military)

[Bigfoot424]

I am a married male with strong Christian beliefs. That said, I also take the attitude of live and let live. I may not believe in gay marriage but I would never protest against it either.

What I'm wondering is what the images on the news and in the papers of participants in a Gay Pride march might be doing to the gay and lesbian community. I know there are gay and lesbian men and women all over the US I can handle that. I will admit that watching these men dress as women perplexes me and I wonder what it's doing to their cause. There are plenty of people, men especially, who strongly oppose all gays so it makes me curious as to why some might want to provoke some in their communities by dressing and marching like this.

There's little doubt that these people are not in the city and certainly not at the parades but their images (gay pride marches) are still put out there for all to see. (This Sunday's Washington Post Metro)

Just curious if others look at the parades and wonder why they would put themselves through this?

[bUU]

If you view Gay Pride Parades in the context of "Why [would they] put themselves through this?" then you regrettably aren't yet embodying the acceptance you claimed earlier in your message. I think, especially since you indicated what might be a visceral indoctrination biased against homosexuals from your religious perspective, it might be useful to find an analog. There probably isn't a perfect analog, because homosexuality is an orientation, while the available analogs are either mainstream people (i.e., "women") or interests instead of innate orientations (i.e., national heritages).

However, let's consider the Great Mohican Powwow. The dress and dancing that are part of the celebration are alien to you, most likely, and if you were not taught to respect alien aspects of American Indian culture, you would probably ask the same question: "Why [would they] put themselves through this?" Instead, because you were properly taught, and do embody the acceptance of American Indian culture, you view that event in a different light.

And because there is that difference between what many folks truly do accept and what they claim to but don't really accept, it is that much more critical for society to work harder toward promulgating acceptance of homosexuality, especially since it is an innate orientation rather than just a cultural heritage. That's why it is essentially to have such celebrations front-and-center, in the public streets, casting this alien thing as a fundamentally acceptable culture within our American culture.

It is also important to keep in mind that the point isn't to get you to the point where you want to change your cultural affinities. I appreciate American Indian and homosexual cultures without actually being drawn in to practice (or even particularly enjoy) either of them myself.

[Dayton Sux]

Back in the 1990s the Religous Right used to to film these parades and use the footage in documentary videos like "The Gay Agenda", to be used as an organizing tool against gay rights initiatives.

So yes, correct, some of the stuff at these parades have been used as ammo against gay rights.

In fact, back during the 1990s this was a debate within the gay community. There was a good book on the topic: ""After The Ball", which sort of was a call for the gay community to clean up its act if it was serious about civil rights.

[AnywhereElse]

Originally Posted by bUU

By the same token, how would the Powwow go over if the public face it presented to the world were participants dressed in conservative suits and dresses? Wouldn't that just have the haters just whine, "What are they hiding !?!"

No, comparing homosexuals to American Indians is insanity. You are talking about the heritage of people and not a lifestyle choice. Homosexuals are not descendants of a long line of homosexuals even though they might want to believe that since it would relieve them of personal responsibility for their lifestyle. The gay pride parades enforce the stereotypes of members of the LGBT community and if they think that is a good thing, let them go for it. Seeing them on television always gave me a chance to talk with my children about homosexuality and reinforce our belief system. Though, I gotta' wonder how damaging it is to more mainstream members of the LGBT community that keep most of the quirks of their lifestyle in private. Seriously, heterosexuals can be pretty out there with quirks of all types but they don't get out in the street and parade around displaying them. I guess these particular members of the LGBT community do? I don't think it is damaging to the community because this gives families an opening to discuss the lifestyle and inject their moral standing on such. I am sick of having members of the LGBT community compare themselves to black people and now American Indians and the struggle that both of those races had and still have today. How many homosexuals/LGBT had to sit in the back of the bus, use separate restrooms, attended segregated schools, faced signs in the windows saving they were not allowed in an establishment and a million other restrictions? How many homosexuals/ were loaded on ships like animals and bought and sold? How many homosexuals/LGBT had their food supply practically eliminated, had disease implanted into their groups to kill them, had their land stolen, were continually lied to and practically destroyed? Sick of the comparison. And, not to mention that the LGBT community has so much hatred for themselves that it seeps out making them claim it comes from others if they don't want to pick up the cross for the LGBT community. When one betrays the morals they were taught and those of mainstream society, one will feel guilt and that cannot be legislated away. I am not going to sell out on my morals to support a lifestyle, in any way, in order to relieve any group of the guilt they feel about what they are doing. So, parade around if you must as it gives the opportunity for education about the lifestyle.

[bUU]

Originally Posted by AnywhereElse

No, comparing homosexuals to American Indians is insanity.

You clearly didn't read the thread and just posted a reactive reply.

What I wrote earlier, that you clearly missed, was, "There probably isn't a perfect analog, because homosexuality is an orientation, while the available analogs are either mainstream people (i.e., 'women') or interests instead of innate orientations (i.e., national heritages)."

Originally Posted by AnywhereElse

You are talking about the heritage of people and not a lifestyle choice.

No, I'm talking about an orientation, and the cultural manifestations of that orientation in this culture. You're bigotry is showing, because the fact is that the homosexuals are "more so homosexual" than the American Indians are American Indians: The latter can essentially, and sometimes very successfully, if they so desire, distance themselves from their cultural heritage, while a homosexuals is a homosexual no matter what.

Originally Posted by AnywhereElse

I am not going to sell out on my morals to support a lifestyle

But evidently you'll sell out your morals to persecute an orientation.

[lucknow]

Tell me!!! Can I have a "Straight pride" parade? Not on your life could I. It would be considered anti gay and not allowed. The gay pride parades makes me sick. When I see what they are proud of I really have to wonder. Every kind of perversion imaginable is on full display as if these things deserve some kind of respect. These parades sure paint a pretty sordid picture of what the GLBT community is all about. There is a very glaring lack of anything wholesome, positive, good, decent or uplifting in these almost pornographic displays.

Among the straight community sex is a part of our lives but it's just a part. Maybe what? 10%, 5%, 2% or what ever. These displays by the gays make it seem they are obsessed with sex and that is the main thing that defines them and their lives. I would not like heteros who's lives are defined in such a manner and I don't like the gays that do it either.

[lucknow]

Originally Posted by bUU

You could have an Irish-American Pride parade, though, if you were Irish, for example.

Be honest: Wouldn't it be? Of course it would, and that's what's wrong with it. It wouldn't really be about pride - it would be about bigotry.

That's crap. It's OK to be proud if you are gay but it is not OK to be proud you are straight. Talk about the ultimate double standard. Now, the gays don't think us heteros have ANYTHING to be proud of and we should not be proud, I reject that idea totally. They just can't get beyond themselves. The thinking must be that I can only be proud in comparison to THEM. Not only does the gay agenda tell us what we must think about them it attempts to tell me what I am allowed to think and to feel about myself. You know, I really don't care what the gays think or do in their lives but I do get pretty hot when they tell me what to think. I think any group hetero or gay or whatever that defines it's self mainly in terms of sex is pathetic.

[43north87west]

Parades are dramatic; that's why people go to them. They promote communities, people, businesses, and organizations with floats, cars, marching bands, groups of people, animals--pretty much everything. If there wasn't something to look at, people wouldn't go to the parade.

While at the parade, media selects images and video which will elicit a reaction.

The sense of provocation is most likely intrinsic bias as a result of your "strong Christian beliefs".

[sponger42]

Originally Posted by lucknow

There is a very glaring lack of anything wholesome, positive, good, decent or uplifting in these almost pornographic displays.

You've probably never been to a gay event, and are speaking only to your imagination of what these events are like. I happened to wander through one such event last weekend, downtown. On a large stage there were conservatively dressed (t-shirt, jeans, backpack) teenagers and young adults talking about dealing with their sexuality in a healthy way. They were promoting some organization or support group for gays, and they had a celebrity guest from some TV show or something. Their tone was very respectful and there was nothing ostentatious about any of them.

It was actually pretty boring, so I went looking for the drag queens and their costumes on the way to the park. Saw a few.

Not every Gay Parade is like Carnival, and not every gay event is filled with barely-clad cross-dressers. In fact, I'd guess that the majority of events are pretty dull affairs (support groups, talks in gymnasiums or theaters, etc.), they just don't make the evening news.

Among the straight community sex is a part of our lives but it's just a part. Maybe what? 10%, 5%, 2% or what ever. These displays by the gays make it seem they are obsessed with sex and that is the main thing that defines them and their lives. I would not like heteros who's lives are defined in such a manner and I don't like the gays that do it either.

Sigmund Freud would disagree. And I'd say sex is a pretty big part of most people's lives. Even if you're not engaged in the physical act, I'd bet more than 10% of your life involves it in one way or another.

--

Finally, to answer the OP; I agree that the gay Agenda isn't really helped by ostentatious displays of homosexuality, costumes, singing, flag-waving, beating on drums, or dancing. However, that stuff is pretty fun/entertaining, and if you're going to have a gathering, it might as well be fun. The gays could probably do a better job of representing themselves to the world if they showed up to every event acting and dressing like Jehova's Witnesses, but you could say the same thing about every special-interest group in the history of mankind.

[bUU]

Originally Posted by lucknow

That's crap.

No it isn't crap. It called out your offensive perspective, and that perhaps embarrassed you, and so you decided to react to it in the manner you have.

Originally Posted by lucknow

It's OK to be proud if you are gay

Or Irish, or a Girl Scout, or a military veteran, or a member of Krewe.

Originally Posted by lucknow

but it is not OK to be proud you are straight.

That's not what I said. You couldn't come up with a cogent rebuttal to what I said, so instead of countering with a litany of cultural aspects that you would consider a matter of "straight pride" you made up this nonsensical and vacuous reply.

What I said was that you couldn't have a parade that was grounded pointedly in expression of bigotry.

Originally Posted by lucknow

Talk about the ultimate double standard.

Talk about self-delusion. You couldn't even outline half as many uniquely straight memes as there are evident gay memes featured in Gay Pride parades, ... as there are evident Irish memes featured in Irish Pride parades, ... etc. Just admit to yourself (because I don't expect you to admit it publicly) that you don't have any motivation for straight pride other than to extol the virtues of homophobia.

Originally Posted by lucknow

I think any group hetero or gay or whatever that defines it's self mainly in terms of sex is pathetic.

And the only ones in this thread thinking of homosexuals mainly in terms of sex is you and those that agree with you, so you've basically claimed that you're pathetic. Do you want to revise your remark, or let it stand?