Welcome to City-Data.com Forum!
U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Great Debates
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 03-27-2014, 11:21 AM
 
Location: somewhere in the Kona coffee fields
834 posts, read 1,216,853 times
Reputation: 1647

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by Amy1190 View Post
I don't agree with this. What would prevent alcohol being served to people underage and what about things like drivers licenses or passports where the DOB is essential?
It's a joke to show the absurdity of the claim to not indicate gender on a birth certificate: Why age? Parents? Location? Weight? There is discrimination and stereotypes against all of those.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 03-27-2014, 11:55 AM
 
Location: Utica, NY
1,911 posts, read 3,024,400 times
Reputation: 3241
Quote:
Originally Posted by KaraBenNemsi View Post
It's a joke to show the absurdity of the claim to not indicate gender on a birth certificate: Why age? Parents? Location? Weight? There is discrimination and stereotypes against all of those.
I agree that your DOB needs to be there.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-27-2014, 01:56 PM
 
Location: Portland, OR
9,855 posts, read 11,926,125 times
Reputation: 10028
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tassy001 View Post
I don't believe it, a child at 6 years of age is NOT going to understand the difference from a boy and girl...much less understanding what they feel they should be. I wanted to be a nurse when I was 5, I am not a nurse and can not stand the sight of blood. Things change as a child grows up.
Lets get real. A four year old can tell you if they are a boy or girl. Even if they don't understand what that means, they very much know what it means and they can probably tell you the gender of all their classmates too. It's mostly not an issue. But for those for whom gender identity is and issue, there are recourse's. Drivers licenses, and passports too, can be amended if an individual is legally entitled to officially change their gender. My drivers license doesn't have my race or hair or eye color anymore but it has a pretty accurate likeness of me right on the front. Anyone impersonating me at least will have to look like a man. That let's 50% of the population out of the equation. The DOT and TSA have enough headaches. Do you really want to remove all identifying criteria from government documents? Fine. Don't complain when crimes of identity theft spike through the roof. Things change so, let's just leave documents open ended as well. When thumbprint or retina scan or bloodspot DNA bio-metric identification is widespread, there won't be any need for drivers licenses or passports to contain race or gender data. We cannot throw out the tools we do have until the tools that we want are fully developed and online. That should be pretty clear, I think.

H
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-27-2014, 02:11 PM
 
31,897 posts, read 26,926,466 times
Reputation: 24789
Don't see why not. I mean "husband and wife" has been replaced by "spouse", "mother and father" by "parent 1 and parent 2" (or in some cases you can add a "three"), and so forth on most federal forms and or those that are used to obtain benefits from same, so what else is left?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-27-2014, 04:02 PM
 
Location: At the corner of happy and free
6,471 posts, read 6,670,076 times
Reputation: 16345
Quote:
Originally Posted by phatty5011 View Post
Always trying to please that 1 percent these days. Its gettin rigoshdarndiculous!
It's not even 1%. I find myself really struggling to reconcile my goal to be open-minded and accepting of people who are different than what I am accustomed to, with my common sense that says (in instances such as in the OP) this is going ridiculously overboard.

Should buildings be handicapped-accessible to accommodate the small percentage of people in wheelchairs? Sure, generally that makes sense to me.

Should clothing manufacturers have to offer all of their styles in a specially designed option for conjoined twins? That would be ridiculously overboard.

Should television networks have to include closed-captioning for the small percentage of people who are hearing impaired? Sure, generally that makes sense to me.

Should every school be required to let every student choose which restroom/locker room they use, based on whether the child feels like a boy or a girl? That seems ridiculously overboard to me.

Should each person, regardless of gender, be able to choose one other person with whom they wish to spend their life, and have the same legal protections given to a traditional male-female married couple? Sure, that makes sense to me.

Should we stop putting gender on birth certificates? Ridiculous.

Throughout nature, we have male and female. I don't think anyone can argue that these two distinct genders are necessary for continuation of species (with rare exception for asexually reproductive life forms). As open-minded as I am, I don't buy into the current trend to take something as basic as male and female, and turn it into a complicated CF free for all. Maybe someday I'll find out I was wrong, but for now, I feel like I'd have to be a gullible fool to accept that there are over 50 "gender identities." I'm sure this will offend someone, but it certainly seems that some people just crave being "different," and like to rebel against norms.

Agender
Androgyne
Androgynous
Bigender
Cis
Cisgender
Cis Female
Cis Male
Cis Man
Cis Woman
Cisgender Female
Cisgender Male
Cisgender Man
Cisgender Woman
Female to Male
FTM
Gender Fluid
Gender Nonconforming
Gender Questioning
Gender Variant
Genderqueer
Intersex
Male to Female
MTF
Neither
Neutrois
Non-binary
Other
Pangender
Trans
Trans*
Trans Female
Trans* Female
Trans Male
Trans* Male
Trans Man
Trans* Man
Trans Person
Trans* Person
Trans Woman
Trans* Woman
Transfeminine
Transgender
Transgender Female
Transgender Male
Transgender Man
Transgender Person
Transgender Woman
Transmasculine
Transsexual
Transsexual Female
Transsexual Male
Transsexual Man
Transsexual Person
Transsexual Woman
Two-Spirit

Here’s a List of 58 Gender Options for Facebook Users - ABC News
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-27-2014, 05:42 PM
 
Location: In the Redwoods
30,311 posts, read 51,917,889 times
Reputation: 23701
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tassy001 View Post
Taken from the article:
That wasn't the quote to which I was referring, though.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-27-2014, 05:49 PM
 
Location: Kansas
25,940 posts, read 22,094,372 times
Reputation: 26667
Well, I thought of maybe two categories: XX or XY. I had always thought that hermaphrodite would clearly be either of the two but learned I was way off: Intersex: MedlinePlus Medical Encyclopedia But, ultimately, I do not believe that "gender" should be removed from the birth certificate. Of course, I don't believe a boy should be able to use the girl's bathroom at school either. Boy? Girl? Those aren't genders, but encompass physical features. I have a spayed female dog who acts masculine. Does that mean that she is not a female but male? My brother and I both played with a lot of the same toys so, like how messed up did that probably make us? Could I have "programmed" my boys to be girls? Oh, is "boy" and "girl" not something one is supposed to say now? I feel sorry for this child in the article and the harm that the mother is doing. Let the kid be a kid and everything else will turn out the way it is supposed to when it really starts to matter.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-28-2014, 04:34 AM
 
Location: Canada
6,617 posts, read 6,538,543 times
Reputation: 18443
NO! gender should not be removed.

Whatever is between your legs is what should be listed as your gender on your passport, whether you "feel" like a man or woman.

If you've had a sex change, then gender should still be listed as whatever is between your legs.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-28-2014, 07:03 AM
 
1,680 posts, read 1,791,562 times
Reputation: 1342
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mack Knife View Post
Well, you were born a male or female physically, one way or the other. The birth certificate doesn't say what you think, feel or anything else, it documents the obvious physical gender at the time of birth.

Imagine, a mother delivers..."its a.....human!"

Way too much concern about a problem that does not exist. If you were born physically as a male or female, where is the harm in recording that, it is a fact.

While children can have certain feelings when very young, they can also be manipulated to understand those feeling in ways that aren't really reflective of what is going on. A boy wants to play with dolls. Even the toy manufacturers figured that one out, they cam out with GI Joes, Major Matt Mason and Ken. There are some parents these days that would see that as transgender behavior and then influence the child into thinking the same when the child only wanted to play with a doll. Well, those mentioned above are dolls too, we just call them "action figures". They are the same thing and fill the same needs in some children, fostering imaginations and so on.

If you were born as a male or female that is what nature came up with. If the individual decides to change that, their call but that doesn't ever change the fact of the birth.

There is no shame in being born male or female if the person feels differently later on. There is shame in not acknowledging the facts of your birth though.
This appears to be one very well thought out reply-
Amy, I'm not certain I agree with the woman attempting to remove gender from Birth Certificates.
This would be your natural physical gender however, if you decide to subscribe to the opposite as you become of age it is your right to give chase to the change.

I will admit any documentation should have the asterisk present upon approval.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-28-2014, 07:16 AM
 
Location: Tennessee
37,794 posts, read 40,994,120 times
Reputation: 62169
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stockyman View Post
The mother of a transgender child wants birth certificates not to indicate if a person is male or female. Apparently a lawyer in Vancouver wants to change the passport system too.
http://ca.news.yahoo.com/mom-transge...122859586.html

Do you agree with their viewpoints? Is it time to change the system of identifying your sex on documents?
I'm looking for a smuggler named Chris Sanchez. Am I telling people to be on the lookout look for a man or woman?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:


Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Great Debates

All times are GMT -6.

© 2005-2024, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Contact Us - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37 - Top