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Remember California's pool laws? Even if a burglar forced his way into your home, broke the lock to your metal pool cover, and then DROWNED, it was ALL YOUR FAULT?? Laws like this attempt to find absolutes in issues that have no black and white capability. Little Wendy accuses little Johnny of hitting her, therefore it happened.
From now on I'm going to need a public notary to come along for a sexcapade, and all forms will have to be signed and notarized and reviewed by my lawyer, before we have sex. We'll also have to voice tape your clear consent. Thank you.
This is not a question a normal person should ask.
Rape is vastly under-reported by survivors, both male and female, because of the legal, social, and emotional ramifications.
The "problem" of false reporting is also vastly overblown.
Read through them all so far and this answer is the best, imo.
Have you thought about what a victim goes through when they decide to report? Why would anyone subject themselves to that? Why can a woman run up to you and say "HELP! He stole my purse!" and not be accused of lying?
I try to have some sympathy for those who don't understand sexual assault. It's tough. Our brains (assuming they are normal) have trouble processing that kind of violence. There are maybe great youtube videos by survivors, both male and female. How can an armed police officer be sexually assaulted by two thugs? After that victimization, his coworkers further victimized him by their attitudes. Being raped gives you the same feeling that executioners give a victim right before he kills them. Then the control of your body is stripped of you and you have to endure whatever torture the perp commits upon your body. It's not about sex for the perp. That's why male on male isn't about homosexuality.
Read through them all so far and this answer is the best, imo.
Have you thought about what a victim goes through when they decide to report? Why would anyone subject themselves to that? Why can a woman run up to you and say "HELP! He stole my purse!" and not be accused of lying?
I try to have some sympathy for those who don't understand sexual assault. It's tough. Our brains (assuming they are normal) have trouble processing that kind of violence. There are maybe great youtube videos by survivors, both male and female. How can an armed police officer be sexually assaulted by two thugs? After that victimization, his coworkers further victimized him by their attitudes. Being raped gives you the same feeling that executioners give a victim right before he kills them. Then the control of your body is stripped of you and you have to endure whatever torture the perp commits upon your body. It's not about sex for the perp. That's why male on male isn't about homosexuality.
False rape claims are normally made as an excuse when sexual misbehavior becomes public, as in pregnancy (or fear of pregnancy), or sexual activity being discovered (I didn't want to, he forced me). Playing the victim is also the gold standard of attention seeking behavior. That's not likely to ever change.
The new California law is more of an anti-alcohol law than an anti-sex law. Getting positive consent still leaves it in the "he said, she said" court, but having more than two drinks drinks before sex means you are a criminal, just like drunk driving, except you get to be on a sex offender registry that will follow you for the rest of your life.
My partner is a survivor of sexual assault, and that this fear of these nebulous false rape claims, "playing the victim", or outrage over not being able to drunk people somehow trumps their experience or the experience of the hundreds of thousands people who are raped is repulsive.
Go find a survivor of assault and tell them that you think the idea of being accused or raping someone is every bit as bad as their actual rape.
Go find a survivor and tell them you want to limit their protection because you want to sleep with drunk people without consequence.
Or don't--because they already hear those things and much, much worse quite frequently.
If a law designed to prevent rape outrages you so much, maybe you need to step back and take a hard look at your own sexual behavior.
Last edited by Oldhag1; 10-04-2014 at 02:42 PM..
Reason: Removed filtered word
I'd say getting raped is far worse then being accused of it. But being accused of a sex crime can be pretty bad too. I was once a witness for a guy that was accused of exposing himself to a girl who was walking to school. It was obvious he didn't do it but the girl who was 12 or so said it was him even though her original description to the police didn't match. Even though the guy who most thought did it had left the job site and never came back.
This guys name was mud for the year plus it took to go to trial. My testimony cleared him because when the act was comitted we were both in the trailer looking over the blue prints. Lucky for him.
Rape is a terrible crime and most of the time it happens when too much drink or drugs are involved. Women and men should never drink so much they lose control.
OP.. You're making it sound like men are being victimized by this new law. If one follows the guidelines as to what does or doesn't constitute ones ability to give consent why would you have a problem? When in doubt keep it in your pants.
You need not ask your wife of g/f for verbal consent, you only need make sure that she is "capable" of giving it.
This whole " false allegation" argument is just a smoke screen as they are more the exception than the rule. That being said.. If one follows the guidelines, one is probably less likely to to be falsely accused. ( here again, when in doubt, keep it in your pants).
A man who is falsely accused, jailed and raped is no different than a woman who is raped and beaten.. She " didn't do anything wrong" either, yet she was raped and beaten. Bad stuff happens to good people all the time. How hard is this? If she's too incapacitated to make a rational decision, the law will make that decision for her, and likewise... If you don't have the capacity to decide whether or not to have sex with her... The law will make that decision for you. Proceed at your own peril.
My partner is a survivor of sexual assault, and that this fear of these nebulous false rape claims, "playing the victim", or outrage over not being able to **** drunk people somehow trumps their experience or the experience of the hundreds of thousands people who are raped is repulsive.
Go find a survivor of assault and tell them that you think the idea of being accused or raping someone is every bit as bad as their actual rape.
Go find a survivor and tell them you want to limit their protection because you want to sleep with drunk people without consequence.
Or don't--because they already hear those things and much, much worse quite frequently.
If a law designed to prevent rape outrages you so much, maybe you need to step back and take a hard look at your own sexual behavior.
Your anger is misplaced. Men all over the country have had their rape convictions overturned and have been released from prison because modern DNA evidence proved that they didn't even have sex with the woman, much less rape her. In many cases, DNA evidence has been degraded or was not preserved, so all we know is that they were convicted, often on questionable testimony. We have no idea how many men are in prison and branded as sex offenders because of knowingly false testimony by women.
There is good reason that prosecutors are reluctant to proceed without forensic evidence that the sexual contact was forced. The California law is an attempt to force prosecutors to obtain more convictions by moving the alcohol standards on the theory that women can't responsibly consent to sex if they have been drinking. By that logic, women can't be held responsible for DUI because they were drunk when they got into the car.
I'm sorry your partner was sexually assaulted. It sounds like she suffers from PTSD because of it. I hope she gets effective treatment. No one has any sympathy for her attacker. However, you might try to conjure up a little compassion for the men who find themselves falsely accused of rape, sometimes without even having sex. At least rape victims are protected by anonymity and don't have to register their addresses on public web sites.
This is not a question a normal person should ask.
Rape is vastly under-reported by survivors, both male and female, because of the legal, social, and emotional ramifications.
The "problem" of false reporting is also vastly overblown.
I think it's a legitimate question. Rape is a horrible thing. I have experienced it myself, and it the most terrible thing that has ever happened to me. (I didn't report it). However, being falsely accused of it is no picnic either. A man (or woman) who is falsely accused of rape faces his/her loss of job, reputation, friends, family, even imprisonment. No person deserves to be falsely accused of that crime. As for the yes/yes law OP has mentioned, all I need to say is: it's California, of course
Your anger is misplaced. Men all over the country have had their rape convictions overturned and have been released from prison because modern DNA evidence proved that they didn't even have sex with the woman, much less rape her. In many cases, DNA evidence has been degraded or was not preserved, so all we know is that they were convicted, often on questionable testimony. We have no idea how many men are in prison and branded as sex offenders because of knowingly false testimony by women.
There is good reason that prosecutors are reluctant to proceed without forensic evidence that the sexual contact was forced. The California law is an attempt to force prosecutors to obtain more convictions by moving the alcohol standards on the theory that women can't responsibly consent to sex if they have been drinking. By that logic, women can't be held responsible for DUI because they were drunk when they got into the car.
I'm sorry your partner was sexually assaulted. It sounds like she suffers from PTSD because of it. I hope she gets effective treatment. No one has any sympathy for her attacker. However, you might try to conjure up a little compassion for the men who find themselves falsely accused of rape, sometimes without even having sex. At least rape victims are protected by anonymity and don't have to register their addresses on public web sites.
No, my anger is not misplaced and you trying to explain it away is needless.
First, drop the gendered language. Women make up the vast majority of reported survivors, but men are raped too, and women can rape. Nothing in this law seeks to protect women or vilify men.
The result of dialogue like this is that people who have been raped are often not believed, insulted, or afraid to come forward. It's estimated that 75% to 95% of rapes are never reported.Rape statistics - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
So what you're implying is that it's so important to protect the two percent of those who are falsely accused that you don't care if happens at the expense of 75%+ of those who are raped and never dare to come forward.
I am not saying that false allegations are acceptable. They aren't. But they are a nearly non-existent problem, especially when compared to the severe under-reporting of sexual assault.
Violating a person's body is not the same as driving drunk, but if you want to use that comparison, fine. Why is it unacceptable to use a vehicle while drunk but perfectly okay to use a drunk person's body?
Quote:
At least rape victims are protected by anonymity and don't have to register their addresses on public web sites.
Have you seen what happens to people, especially women, who speak out about sexualized violence, whether it's in general or through sharing their own experiences? My partner did this recently and was flooded with hundreds of comments threatening them with rape and murder.
We have a horrible problem with rape culture in this country. Equating being accused of rape to actually being raped is part of that.
Being accused of rape is one of those rare things that destroys a man's reputation in all aspects. Nobody will ever look at you the same even if its found out the woman lied
"Luckily" for men, very few are even arrested, much less convicted of rape. From how men talk, you'd think every woman has accused a man at some point - but if that were the case and indeed, men's reputations were permanently soiled then most men would be "destroyed". That obviously is NOT the case. As others have said, under-reporting is rampant and false accusations relatively rare and almost always found out. It's an interesting question, but one without merit.
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