Welcome to City-Data.com Forum!
U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Great Debates
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Closed Thread Start New Thread
 
Old 01-16-2015, 11:18 AM
 
Location: Philaburbia
41,710 posts, read 74,654,678 times
Reputation: 66649

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by texan2yankee View Post
I addressed a poster who specifically asserted the obese don't physically affect others. My post was an example of how obese persons can and do affect others, Aredhel.
You have yet to demonstrate how sitting next to a person who is obese on an airplane has affected you in a profound or lasting manner.

Quote:
There is a difference between condoning cruelty towards others and mandatory embracing or celebrating of obesity. The former is wrong and the later equally wrong.
Yet the latter has come about because of the former. No one is advocating it be "mandatory" that the public embrace or celebrate obesity. Anyone who wants to do that ... fine. What this acceptance movement asks for is respect, and asks that anyone who feels they cannot do so keep their sentiments to themselves. Basic human respect is not too much to ask for.

 
Old 01-16-2015, 11:31 AM
 
Location: USA
1,034 posts, read 1,081,074 times
Reputation: 2353
Quote:
Originally Posted by lkmax View Post
I think it's because people are unreasonably bothered by the appearance of overweight individuals. Yet, they feel as if they have to justify their desire to ridicule these individuals -- they do have a little bit of a conscience, after all. That is why they grasp for straws, like being "concerned" about the health issues or saying that fat people make them uncomfortable on a flight (when they probably only fly a few times a year and probably don't find themselves beside an overweight or obese person every single time.) I'm sorry, but a few hours of discomfort a few times a year doesn't seem like an appropriate excuse to be completely mean and hateful to the overweight as a whole. That's kind of like being mean to every mother that you see simply because a baby cried and disrupted your flight once last year.
This sums it up so perfectly that I wanted to quote the whole thing.

Yes, "unreasonably bothered" is the explanation. They can't just admit that they are "unreasonable," so they conjure up this reason—it's a "health concern," yes, that's it! And, despite studies which tell us that fat discrimination (cruelty to fat folks) does not encourage weight loss, but actually the opposite, they don't want to hear it. And that's because it's not about "health concerns" at all. It's about how bothered they are and how they want to lash out in some way.

Quote:
Originally Posted by 2mares View Post
There are still lots of weight loss groups and diets being promoted. Many gyms target those that are overweight, offering a different environment than your typical body builder gym. There are shows like biggest looser. Schools and fast food restaurants offer healthier choices. So I think overall its a movement to become more tolerant and understanding of obesity while still promoting overall health and fitness not a celebration of obesity.
This makes such perfect sense. And I think this is how a lot of it is.

Imagine how it must be for many fat people, to go through the long, arduous process of losing weight, day after day after day, exercising, dieting, working very hard, while still housed in a fat body and still getting "punished" for that. Day after day. Imagine if they started out at 300 pounds, and have lost 100 pounds so they're 200. Great, right? No, wrong. They're still "fat," so they still get punished for it. They've accomplished so much but it still means nothing, they are still treated like dirt by idiots who have no clue about their history—all they see is that this person is 200 pounds and so they "deserve" to be treated like garbage. And after all, if they didn't like it, they should "do something about it."
 
Old 01-16-2015, 01:59 PM
 
2,754 posts, read 2,207,878 times
Reputation: 5570
The more I think about it, Fat Acceptance is so wrong. It can influence young teens/adults that it's okay to be this way. No it's not. Unless you can stay young forever, your metabolism will slow down as you age, and your medical bills will probably rise for all those prescriptions you have to buy related to all that girth. Also your back and knees have a good chance to give out in everyday life when you get older.

Too many people like to ignore the impact of being significantly overweight when you get older. It's not okay and you really hurt yourself in the long run for accepting how fat you are.
 
Old 01-16-2015, 02:25 PM
 
35,910 posts, read 30,461,955 times
Reputation: 32159
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stockyman View Post
The more I think about it, Fat Acceptance is so wrong. It can influence young teens/adults that it's okay to be this way. No it's not. Unless you can stay young forever, your metabolism will slow down as you age, and your medical bills will probably rise for all those prescriptions you have to buy related to all that girth. Also your back and knees have a good chance to give out in everyday life when you get older.

Too many people like to ignore the impact of being significantly overweight when you get older. It's not okay and you really hurt yourself in the long run for accepting how fat you are.
Can you explain how fat acceptance is influencing teens and young adults to be fat. Where would they be seeing this influential material? Are you suggesting a full size model would have more of a negative impact on an impressionable young person's body image than a paper thin, airbrushed model? I don't believe these images and acceptance of a nearly unattainable body for most has done anything positive for the obesity. Neither has trying to punish ridicule those that are obese.

I think a more positive approach would be to educate and promote healthy eating habits and a more active lifestyle while accepting that people come in all sizes, shapes and forms.

Regardless of weight as we age our medical bills will generally increase and our back, knees and other things will begin to give out.
 
Old 01-16-2015, 02:44 PM
 
Location: USA
1,034 posts, read 1,081,074 times
Reputation: 2353
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2mares View Post
Can you explain how fat acceptance is influencing teens and young adults to be fat. Where would they be seeing this influential material? Are you suggesting a full size model would have more of a negative impact on an impressionable young person's body image than a paper thin, airbrushed model? I don't believe these images and acceptance of a nearly unattainable body for most has done anything positive for the obesity. Neither has trying to punish ridicule those that are obese.
This.

When and IF the Fat Acceptance movement becomes primarily about sending the message that fat is good, fat is preferable, then this complaint is valid. I am not convinced it is primarily about that. I do think that some aspects of Fat Acceptance go in that direction, and that's where I say, "They've gone too far." But I can't imagine that such a message would take too much of a hold. Most people know that can't be right.

What is most likely to take hold, is to get rid of the stigma and hatred towards the fat. With that absent, everyone can focus on it being a private health issue that is between the person, their family, and their doctor. Just like every other health issue out there.

And again I'll repeat that it's counterproductive to justify rudeness to a fat person. Society does not "reward" them for making the effort to lose weight; they still keep on punishing them until they are thin—which may take a very long time! How is this right? Why shouldn't the Fat Acceptance movement address this?

And that's the part that people who make the complaints about Fat Acceptance don't seem to want to acknowledge—that there is no reason or sense in being rude, because it doesn't do any good. It actually sabotages many people's efforts and makes them more likely to keep the weight on. (I linked to a web page several pages back which explains this.)
 
Old 01-16-2015, 02:59 PM
 
Location: Syracuse IS Central New York.
8,514 posts, read 4,479,858 times
Reputation: 4077
Everyone should be able to live in peace and not be made to feel that they are inferior regardless of how they look. Period.

Fat shaming only makes life hellish for the overweight/obese. Guess what? They already know what they look like. You are NOT helping them in any way, and actually are making matters worse as people will become defensive.

Let's just try to get along. It's a tough world out there.
 
Old 01-16-2015, 03:25 PM
 
Location: Garbage, NC
3,125 posts, read 2,996,154 times
Reputation: 8235
Quote:
Originally Posted by Easybreezy View Post
Everyone should be able to live in peace and not be made to feel that they are inferior regardless of how they look. Period.

Fat shaming only makes life hellish for the overweight/obese. Guess what? They already know what they look like. You are NOT helping them in any way, and actually are making matters worse as people will become defensive.

Let's just try to get along. It's a tough world out there.
Exactly.

People are only doing it because they want to make fat people feel as if they are less than them. If they were concerned about their health, then they would reach out to larger people that they know and offer to give them advice on working out or eating healthy.

People who are so concerned about someone's weight getting in the way of their health don't scream insults, physically assault people or make fun of them online.

At the end of the day, the Fat Acceptance movement isn't about hate. It's about loving yourself (no matter what you look like) and loving others, even if they are bigger than you.

Those who are anti-movement are against it because they want the right to hate an entire group of people because of their appearance. Because to them, fat people are the most disgusting vermin on the earth. It's actually very sad.

It's kind of like when your mother told you in school that people only bully you because it makes them feel better about themselves. When thinner people gang up on fat people, they are really doing it to make themselves look good. Since they aren't fat and therefore aren't unattractive or "unhealthy," then they are better than fat people.
 
Old 01-16-2015, 03:31 PM
 
Location: Las Vegas
5,864 posts, read 4,953,490 times
Reputation: 4207
Quote:
Originally Posted by elvira310 View Post
This.

When and IF the Fat Acceptance movement becomes primarily about sending the message that fat is good, fat is preferable, then this complaint is valid. I am not convinced it is primarily about that. I do think that some aspects of Fat Acceptance go in that direction, and that's where I say, "They've gone too far." But I can't imagine that such a message would take too much of a hold. Most people know that can't be right.

What is most likely to take hold, is to get rid of the stigma and hatred towards the fat. With that absent, everyone can focus on it being a private health issue that is between the person, their family, and their doctor. Just like every other health issue out there.

And again I'll repeat that it's counterproductive to justify rudeness to a fat person. Society does not "reward" them for making the effort to lose weight; they still keep on punishing them until they are thin—which may take a very long time! How is this right? Why shouldn't the Fat Acceptance movement address this?

And that's the part that people who make the complaints about Fat Acceptance don't seem to want to acknowledge—that there is no reason or sense in being rude, because it doesn't do any good. It actually sabotages many people's efforts and makes them more likely to keep the weight on. (I linked to a web page several pages back which explains this.)
We're already seeing that the fat "acceptance" movement is just turning into a celebration of being fat:


Fat "acceptance" is now becoming an excuse to demean skinny and thin women. We're told "real" women have curves. Increasingly though these "real" women aren't "curvy"...they're just fat. When men aren't attracted to them we're told we just "can't handle a real woman, which is very similar to modern feminism in that regard.

As to why it bothers me...being obese is a sign of lack of self control, no respect for themselves, and a weak will. As a fellow human I like to see people excelling and making the most of their lives. A strong society that prospers can never be made up of 30% fat people.

Last edited by Oldhag1; 01-16-2015 at 04:49 PM.. Reason: Copyright violation.
 
Old 01-16-2015, 04:22 PM
 
Location: Omaha, Nebraska
10,297 posts, read 7,879,440 times
Reputation: 27606
Quote:
Originally Posted by SoCalbound12 View Post
We're already seeing that the fat "acceptance" movement is just turning into a celebration of being fat
Because the woman in the first photo would be so much better off if she hated her fat body?

Because the woman who posed for the second photo would be so much better off if she felt she didn't deserve any man's love until she looks like an airbrushed model?

It's not a celebration of fatness, it's a celebration of loving yourself - which MUST precede any attempt to change if that change is going to ever be successful long-term. No person should ever believe he/she is not worthy of being loved simply because of a physical imperfection.

Quote:
As to why it bothers me...being obese is a sign of lack of self control, no respect for themselves, and a weak will.
Again with this nonsense. Does Oprah Winfrey lack self control and have a weak will? That woman's got more self-control, self-respect, and willpower in her little toe than most people have in their entire body, but she couldn't sustain massive weight loss long-term.

I have more willpower and determination than the majority of you - and I know it because I succeeded at doing something most of you would utterly fail at: I made it into medical school and completed residency and fellowship training. Funny how I can have the self-discipline to succeed at that, but be so unable to manage the "simple" task of maintaining long-term weight loss.

Maybe weight loss isn't so simple. Maybe, just maybe, folks ought to stop and think before opening their pie hole and ASSuming that the heavy person isn't already doing the best he or she can at that particular moment in life. Maybe they should try tending to their own problems before they criticize others.
 
Old 01-16-2015, 04:25 PM
 
2,754 posts, read 2,207,878 times
Reputation: 5570
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2mares View Post
Regardless of weight as we age our medical bills will generally increase and our back, knees and other things will begin to give out.
But the odds increase for our backs and knees to give out quicker if we weigh a lot more than we should. An average male in his 60s who is 5'9 and 170lbs is likely more mobile and has less aches and pains vs his counterpart who weighs over 250lbs. It's common sense.

I was only 41 when my doctor said I was on the path to taking meds for my high blood sugar. He told me to lose a few pounds and it should correct itself, which it did. And that was already with me working out doing weight training and cardio!

Fat acceptance is like giving up on life and to prepare yourself for the rest of your life on meds. Sure, there are very few exceptions to the rule but most people cannot escape the impact of being significantly overweight, especially as you age.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Closed Thread


Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Great Debates

All times are GMT -6.

© 2005-2024, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Contact Us - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37 - Top