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different states different rules. People here would find a way to call it discrimination. Was at the store today and a sign on the cooler at the register said "energy drinks with nutrition information may be purchased wih ebt food" I took a picture of it with the intent of showing it on here. cant figure out how to post pictures though. So here in California you can buy prepared food and now energy drinks.
Here in California, you can also use EBT cards at some farmer's markets (like the one in Hollister). Personally I think that's a great thing, as the markets sell mostly fresh produce straight off the farm. You can also use them at certain restaurants, which I also support, since even poor people might not be able to cook 365 days/year. And who really cares, as long as they're buying food? Nobody eats healthy every single day of the year, and the kids in particular need to feel like "normal" children every so often... plus they might have dietary restrictions, either health-related or religious, so it could get complicated to restrict their purchases too much.
I clearly said that part was "specific to this discussion," which means I was referring to the idea of forcing contraceptives, drug testing, etc. I also said it was a loose connection, as it's not the SAME as indentured servitude - but certainly reeks of the concept.
I don't see how.
Servitude means you're working without getting paid.
Welfare (often) means you're getting paid without working.
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No, the OP did not say that... their question merely asked if welfare recipients should be required to follow these rules, with no qualifiers for only those who are irresponsible.
His statement was vague, but as the thread went on it became clear that people were concerned that some welfare recipients keep having kids when they can't support the children they already have.
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I'm not an economist, nor did I feel like researching the exact numbers
Just so. That was obvious from your "It only costs you fifty cents" argument.
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But now that I have looked up a few things on the subject, it seems your numbers are rather inflated - as the ones I've seen only get that high when you DO include social security, Medicare, tax credits, etc.
I said "hundreds of billions of dollars," and I stand by that number. Anyone can find pie charts of federal spending breakdowns and dig deeper into the numbers. Let's not demand that people prove things that can easily be researched using google.
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And since you've apparently done the research, can you tell us (with sources) how much each individual taxpayer contributes to social welfare?
You mean go through millions of tax returns? Why would you ask me to do that?
You suggested that I only pay fifty cents for welfare. The only conclusion that could reasonably be drawn from that was that I either paid practically no taxes or that welfare doesn't cost much.
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Giving us total expenditures doesn't answer that question, since the funding doesn't come 100% from our personal income taxes.
You're right. But I don't see how that helps you, because any other sources of welfare money just add to the overall amount spent on welfare.
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I have also seen the stats on how many welfare recipients are elderly, disabled, children, and/or working at least part time; and if you add up those numbers, even if EVERYONE left was a lazy bum, it still wouldn't constitute a majority.
Strawman argument. Nobody has said that everyone on welfare is a lazy bum, undeserving or irresponsible.
Just to clarify...the same card is used for EBT food and EBT cash. Yes, you CAN buy chicken wings with EBT cash, but NOT with EBT food...which is what he had to have done. You have to tell the card if you are using food or cash (when you swipe it and put in your pin number).
This is true. And some people do that. The EBT cash can be used for just about anything, far as I know.
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Originally Posted by GoFigureMeOut
I think it depends on how ethical the store is. Where I live there was tons of fraud going on, particularly with small convenience stores where a person would buy cigarettes with EBT but the cashier would ring the purchase in as two loaves of bread. There's lots of ways to skirt the system.
I guess where there's a will there's a way, huh? Doing what that cashier did would play hell with the store's inventory.
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Originally Posted by Robertfchew
different states different rules. People here would find a way to call it discrimination. Was at the store today and a sign on the cooler at the register said "energy drinks with nutrition information may be purchased wih ebt food" I took a picture of it with the intent of showing it on here. cant figure out how to post pictures though. So here in California you can buy prepared food and now energy drinks.
Yes, I know they can buy energy drinks but so far we haven't been able to get any prepared foods to go through. I've had people leave rotisserie chickens at my register because they weren't allowed with EBT.
Last edited by Oldhag1; 01-27-2015 at 02:44 PM..
Reason: Merge
DO you not realize they go by your income as well? Its not just have more babies and get more food. That wouldnt be a very good system if people really could just ignore income, how much they pay in rent, other expenses, family size, etc...just to have more babies and get more food.
Seems flawed in logic and thinking... why do people continue to believe it then?
DO you not realize they go by your income as well? Its not just have more babies and get more food. That wouldnt be a very good system if people really could just ignore income, how much they pay in rent, other expenses, family size, etc...just to have more babies and get more food.
Seems flawed in logic and thinking... why do people continue to believe it then?
Again that can be skirted by working under the table or not being married to the father of your children. You can technically be a "single" mom yet have a live-in boyfriend who works but his income isn't officially counted as part of the household. It's not like anybody ever checks up on that sort of thing.
I do believe there are incentives to have more children, otherwise why bother? Are these people really that stupid? Or do they just find it acceptable to cram six kids into some crappy Section 8 apartment in the hood? If they're satisfied with living life like that, then there's no getting through to them.
I believe that if you are on welfare, and decide to have a baby, you should be automatically taken off the program.
Kind of told my husband we should get a divorce when we decide to have children. Seems more monetarily advantageous, imo. I was only halfway joking too.
People who are on welfare and keep having children just do not consider the impact of their on the broader society. I wonder where all the collectivist people are on this issue. Do they sanction people to behave irresponsibly.
how do you know what those people are "considering"? are you inside their heads?
Really? Then why do I take it for medical purposes, at a dose that is too low to even prevent pregnancy?
We were discussing birth control, not medicine. Please stick to the topic at hand.
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Originally Posted by gizmo980
Maybe you can answer the question nobody else has addressed, despite it being mentioned a handful of times... what about women who CANNOT take the birth control, for either medical or religious reasons?
They should stay off of welfare to avoid the BC mandate.
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Originally Posted by gizmo980
Wouldn't withholding government benefits from these folks be discrimination, based on their religion and/or "disability?" For example, some women can't take the pill because they're at a high risk of stroke, or because they've had certain types of cancers. Is it fair to deny them any government benefits?
Nobody would be denying them benefits. If their applications were denied due to religious affiliation or medical history, then you could argue discrimination.
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Originally Posted by gizmo980
Is it fair to deny them any government benefits? I'd love to see someone answer this!
I'd love for gizmo to answer why he/she thinks the women in this hypothetical are entitled to be supported by taxpayers.
I'm not saying we should not have a safety net the Great Depression proved we do need it because our economy depends on it, but we should try to find better ways to get people back to work. Education in our country is not great compared to other 1st world nations the money should be spent there instead of supporting the folks who dropped out of school can't find work later.
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