How about a "relative" minimum wage? (companies, dollars, high school)
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
God, I miss those days. You could pick up a really nice car for $500 and it would last 10 years because they weren't beat to hell from commuting 50 miles one way as folks do today. You could pick up a used 67 Mustang for dirt with 50K on it and it would still run today if you took care of it. My buddy has a 62 Falcon in his backyard in unbelievable shape. The entire car is original, the paint is 8/10 and the interior is the same. Not bad for 53 years old. It has a straight 6 so it isn't going to guzzle gas.
Not to go off topic, but the reason a car doesn't last a long time anymore is because the environmental wackos, and the government that caters to them. They have decided that fuel efficiency trumps reliability. Everything is made of plastic, because the government demands a certain mpg.
Not to go off topic, but the reason a car doesn't last a long time anymore is because the environmental wackos, and the government that caters to them. They have decided that fuel efficiency trumps reliability. Everything is made of plastic, because the government demands a certain mpg.
Sure. That is why you still see so many Ford Granadas on the road, and Plymouth Horizons, and Chevy Citations, and Pintos and Mavericks not to mention Studebakers and Packards and Hudsons. THOSE were GREAAAAT cars, yeah sure you bet.
With all the debate going on with raising the minimum wage, I have an idea that would solve most of the anti-hiker's concerns. Instead of an absolute dollar amount, make the minimum wage for example half the mean (full-time equivalent) pay of all workers in the company. (The average is mean and not median for a very good reason - it means that if you pay the executives an exorbitant salary you'd have to give your rank-and-file workers a raise too to make the math work.)
This proposal has the advantages in that it does not force a business to spend any more money on pay than it does now (though it may force them to be more equitable with it), concerns that there may be more inflation are moot, and for the inflation that does occur there is no need to change the law to account for that (since there is no fixed amount in the statute). The main drawback is that it'd be harder for the individual workers to enforce it, although if the government requires employers to keep records of their workers' pay then they can make that general statistical information (not necessarily individual worker's pay if privacy is a concern) public.
Minimum wages do not support the economy. They maintain POVERTY in a CIVILIZED country!
The 1% also does NOT support the economy.
People need to be paid in tune with what their jobs entail. A football player should not make millions while a call center rep who deals with nasty people for 12 to 15 hours a day gets paid $9 an hour, and be snidely told to get a degree if they want a better job! A degree is NOT FREE to get! Minimum Wage does not buy people degrees!
Minimum wages do not support the economy. They maintain POVERTY in a CIVILIZED country!
The 1% also does NOT support the economy.
People need to be paid in tune with what their jobs entail. A football player should not make millions while a call center rep who deals with nasty people for 12 to 15 hours a day gets paid $9 an hour, and be snidely told to get a degree if they want a better job! A degree is NOT FREE to get! Minimum Wage does not buy people degrees!
Case closed.
Who are you to decide that? Again, I'm sure that lots of people can work a call center. It's not a high skill, and anyone with a pulse can pretty much do the job. On the other hand, how many can play football to the caliber that it takes to make the pros?
It's not just about hours worked, or education attained. It's about talent and motivation. I bet that football player practiced and practiced and practiced lots of hours to get to the level that he is at. How many hours do you think that call center rep spent on their career?
Minimum wages do not support the economy. They maintain POVERTY in a CIVILIZED country!
The 1% also does NOT support the economy.
People need to be paid in tune with what their jobs entail. A football player should not make millions while a call center rep who deals with nasty people for 12 to 15 hours a day gets paid $9 an hour, and be snidely told to get a degree if they want a better job! A degree is NOT FREE to get! Minimum Wage does not buy people degrees!
Case closed.
Next time you need a productivity revolution to help pull billions of people out of poverty around the world and help enrich the lives and pockets of all of us, don't look for a Bill Gates or an Andy Grove or a Michael Dell or some other member of the despised 1%. Go find that call center rep or that burger flipper and see what they can do for you.
You will have about as much success with that as trying to get a mortgage loan or a car loan from Dodd or Frank or Pelosi or Sanders or Warren.
If you think bigwigs just sit back and rake in the money, you obviously know no CEO's of large corporations.
And yes, those lower rung jobs are important, but you are missing the point - ANYONE can fill those positions. No, the CEO can't do all the jobs, but lots of grunts can. BUT I bet not one of those grunts could fill the CEO position.
It's NOT a corporation's responsibility to provide "sufficient" salaries. They provide a job to someone that AGREED to work for a particular wage. Period. End of story.
The pathological envy of the successful in this country is astounding.
It is not a corporation's job to provide "sufficient" salaries?? You can't be serious?!!?? What is their obligation to their employee then? Nothing? Why have minimum wage at all? Let's get rid of it and see how well THEY DECIDE to treat us then. As Chris Rock says, "someone who pays you minimum wage, does so because they can't pay you any less" and that is absolutely 100% true. It's not about envy, it's about fair treatment. No one should have to work 2-3 jobs 80 hours a week to just squeek by. NO ONE.
If I show up to work every day and do my job well for 40 hours a week, then YOU as my EMPLOYER should thank me for my hard work and keeping YOUR corporation running by assuring that I have enough funds to keep me and my family sheltered, fed and clothed. That how it was in the '40s, '50s, '60s and '70s. It can and SHOULD be that way today.
Unfortunately that "agreed" upon salary isn't really agreed upon. Most people in these positions have to take what they can get because there are more applicants than jobs. If I don't take that job for $10 an hour because I want $12, they'll just keep looking until they find the person who will take $10. Now I don't have a job at all. It's a "sellers market" in the corporate world which gives them leverage to offer ****ty wages because a lot if people have no other option.
I agree and have always agreed that the higher ups, CEOs etc SHOULD make more money. That was never the issue, but there is NO FLIPPING WAY any person on the planet works so hard, so valiently and faithfully that they deserve a $12 million yearly paycheck topped with a $19 million bonus. There is NOTHING you can say to justify that a CEO not only "earned" that money, but he is SO valuable and so deserving of that money that it is worth putting several hundred thousand bottom rung employees on food stamps for him to receive it.
Here's another disgusting look at income inequality.
25 hedgefund managers make more money, A LOT MORE MONEY, than 158,000 kindergarten teachers COMBINED! Who do you think deserves more money? Some hedge fund guy whose job it is to move money around, or the people responsible for getting our children, America's future, off on a strong first step??
It is not a corporation's job to provide "sufficient" salaries?? You can't be serious?!!?? What is their obligation to their employee then? Nothing? Why have minimum wage at all? Let's get rid of it and see how well THEY DECIDE to treat us then. As Chris Rock says, "someone who pays you minimum wage, does so because they can't pay you any less" and that is absolutely 100% true. It's not about envy, it's about fair treatment. No one should have to work 2-3 jobs 80 hours a week to just squeek by. NO ONE.
This is going to veer off topic as every min wage thread does, but here it goes anyway.
The low wages continue mainly because unions have died. If every walmart employee, mcdonalds employee, or (insert your choice of company here) employee walked off the job tomorrow, How fast do you think the CEO's or other leaders of these companies will be at the bargaining table ?
These people only respond to money, so the only way to fight them is to stop their flow of money. It doesn't matter how many degrees you have or how much data you can quote. Stop that money and watch what happens.
(Also acceptable would be to create a third political party that represents labor that can win elections but that will take time.)
It is not a corporation's job to provide "sufficient" salaries?? You can't be serious?!!?? What is their obligation to their employee then? Nothing? Why have minimum wage at all? Let's get rid of it and see how well THEY DECIDE to treat us then. As Chris Rock says, "someone who pays you minimum wage, does so because they can't pay you any less" and that is absolutely 100% true. It's not about envy, it's about fair treatment. No one should have to work 2-3 jobs 80 hours a week to just squeek by. NO ONE.....
It is a corporation's job to pay the least they can for raw materials, production equipment, supplies, inventory, and LABOR. Just like you seek the best value for your purchasing dollar. Do make sure you are paying "sufficient" amounts to the grocery store? Do you pay the least you can for what you want when it comes to clothes or cars or food? "Sufficient?" You can't be serious.
Is it not the employee's job to provide "sufficient" value per hour of labor??
Chris Rock is a worse economist than Paul Krugman.
If the minimum wage was eliminated, the person whose labor is worth $8 or $12 or $20 would see no change. People whose labor was worth $4 or $6 would get jobs. There is no downside.
This victim mentaility, see how well they treat us, is ridiculous when each of us is free to become as valuable as we choose. Beyond a beginning job on the lowest rung, being low-value is a choice. If we subsidize that counterproductive choice, we will all be poorer because more of us would be less valuable than we might otherwise become.
If you can't earn your way, society should give you welfare benefits. Your poor employer should not bear the cost of your ineptitude and/or lack of ambition and/or personal shortcomings, voluntary or involuntary. Take a careful look at your paycheck. That is your market value. Not enough to suit you? Try to be of more use to the rest of us. You can tell you are on the right track when some employer will pay you more.
]I think any job that needs to be done should pay enough for the worker to provide for themselves and a dependent (I do consider continuing to exist as a species to be a priority) in a reasonable fashion. I would even go further and say that all workers deserve some recreation. The should be able to afford to spend a few days at the beach in a motel, occasionally eating out at a moderately priced restaurant, etc.
Why should an employer have to foot the bill of an employee's life choices?
To compensate the employee at the agreed-upon rate for the employee's satisfactory completion of the employee's assigned tasks.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pennies4Penny
If I show up to work every day and do my job well for 40 hours a week, then YOU as my EMPLOYER should thank me for my hard work and keeping YOUR corporation running by assuring that I have enough funds to keep me and my family sheltered, fed and clothed.
Why should a company pay you more than another employee just because you have choose to have more kids, eat organic food, live in an expensive part of town, and wear designer clothing?
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Minimum Wage does not buy people degrees!
