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Old 05-09-2016, 09:12 AM
 
17,498 posts, read 17,374,323 times
Reputation: 25485

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Old Gringo View Post
Trump has activated the know-nothing "religious right" in a manner that hasn't been seen in many election cycles. But I think he'll have no success attracting anyone else. Even within his precious GOP there's a lot of resistance to his nomination.

It'll be a very entertaining campaign this fall. Look for some solid Dem gains.

But anti-intellectualism is nothing new.

It brought us such big hits as slavery, women banned from voting, and prohibition.

Wrong. The religious right were pushing for Cruze.

 
Old 05-09-2016, 09:21 AM
 
17,498 posts, read 17,374,323 times
Reputation: 25485
Quote:
Originally Posted by Unsettomati View Post
There is a definite segment of the populace that is deeply distrustful of education. These tend to be social conservatives (emphasis on the 'social') because social conservatism revolves around an embrace of the social status quo and education is information which is a path to new ways of doing things.

These people are so distrustful of education/information that they send their children to private schools or they home-school them to shield those children from information that they find threatening - evolution, sciences that all clearly demonstrate that the Earth is old, history that doesn't jibe with their favorite ancient holy book, etc.

They're afraid of information and they deeply distrust people who advocated learned consideration of things. They prefer instinctual reactions, regardless of the negative consequences that might ensue - in the final analysis, they would rather feel good about a course of action even if that course of action is ill-advised and produces worse results than one produced by well-informed reasoning.

Reason and facts and the world which deals with these things - education, intellectualism - is their enemy. And certain politicians are happy to dumb it down and rail against the 'elites' ... ... in order to pander to these folks.
Is it a case of anti-intellectualism or a case of the servant class tired of being treated as lesser humans by the elitist intellectuals? I was good in school and looked down on the bad students thinking they were stupid. I tried to tutor a classmate in math. We got to talking and though he wasn't book smart, he knew a great many things I didn't know. He tested soil chemistry and made adjustments based upon the crop the family was growing that season/field, he treated the sick or injured farm animals, he repaired and operated large farm equipment like harvesters. He wasn't stupid. He was smart in other ways that were more practical than what he could learn in books.
 
Old 05-09-2016, 09:22 AM
 
Location: New England
2,190 posts, read 2,216,236 times
Reputation: 1968
I think the audience that Trump has attracted more than any other candidate is under-educated working class white males. They have been attracted to his position on trade and his statements that we are being by all other countries. He throws out outlandish statements arguing for unrealistic tariffs on goods from China and Mexico. Many white working class males have lost their industrial jobs and blame places countries like China and Mexico for their suffering. Trump was ingenious in being the only right wing candidate to heavily criticize free trade. It is also interesting that he has pivoted on many of his previous stances just in the past few days. This is probably to pander to the poorer white population. While previously being for tax cuts for the wealthy Trump now considers it a good idea, he has flipped flopped on minimum wage saying that it probably should be raised. By doing these things he is pandering even more to the poor white supporters that he has. I don't think trump has gotten votes for religious, the guy can't quote correctly from the bible. Any intelligent voter would know that Donald Trump is not a devout christian.

Last edited by tysmith95; 05-09-2016 at 09:44 AM..
 
Old 05-09-2016, 09:32 AM
 
Location: Phoenix
29,904 posts, read 18,744,842 times
Reputation: 25863
I would definitely say that more idiots are voting than intelligent people, especially during the Presidential elections.
 
Old 05-09-2016, 10:32 AM
 
Location: La La Land
1,616 posts, read 2,479,980 times
Reputation: 2839
Quote:
Originally Posted by tysmith95 View Post
When I hear trump it sounds like he talks at a grade school level. Listening to one of his speeches there are very few coherent thoughts that comes out of the guys mouth. He is a very successful businessman and a graduate of the Wharton School of Economics. Is Trump acting this way in order to gain votes from Americans who despise the elite and highly educated types who run this country? Do Americans prefer leaders who sound more life regular folk than Ivy League standouts?

George Bush is another example of this albeit to a lesser extent. He was never a great speaker yet he became president twice. And i'm not saying that conservatives aren't smart intellectual speakers. Mitt Romney, John McCain, and Ted Cruz were great speakers. It just seems like there is a strong anti-intellectual sentiment among American voters that I struggle to understand.
Yes, he is pandering to the lowest common denominator, which tends to align with the average republican voter.
In America, approximately 30% of adults over 25 years of age have a Bachelor's degree. For a Master's this drops to about 15%. For those that find being successful in obtaining an education is a challenge, the default position is to belittle having an education. It is the foundation for the immense disrespect Americans have for education. If something is not easy we collectively decide it is not important.

This extends itself to politics. Understanding the complexity of what it takes to run a country that is a major member of the world community is beyond most. So we simplify electing a president to a juvenile popularity contest. The press is right there lowering the discussion as far into the gutter as they can. The final result is that our presidential election becomes American Idol.

Quote:
Originally Posted by notnamed View Post
It's a reflection of our education system. We have people who are in the highest elected positions in our country who actively deny science.
It is NOT a reflection of our educational system. The majority of teachers are educated professional who understand math, science, politics, civics, public speaking, etc. The small minority who somehow made it through and are not fully qualified are just that, a small minority. However, no teacher can overcome the influences of the home. If mommy and/or daddy say global warming is fake,most children will accept this way of thinking. With so many adults in this country embracing ignorance their sad influence is affecting children. Add politicians injecting their religious beliefs into schools and teachers are fighting a losing battle.

Last edited by quixotic59; 05-09-2016 at 11:22 AM..
 
Old 05-09-2016, 10:33 AM
 
17,498 posts, read 17,374,323 times
Reputation: 25485
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tall Traveler View Post
I would definitely say that more idiots are voting than intelligent people, especially during the Presidential elections.
Having a college degree doesn't necessarily make one smarter than those who never went to college. There are idiots with high level degrees and idiots with no degrees. Just because the candidate you don't like is winning doesn't mean the voters are stupid.
 
Old 05-09-2016, 10:40 AM
 
17,498 posts, read 17,374,323 times
Reputation: 25485
Quote:
Originally Posted by quixotic59 View Post
Yes, he is pandering to the lowest common denominator, which tends to align with the average republican voter.
In America, approximately 30% of adults over 25 years of age have a Bachelor's degree. For a Master's this drops to about 15%. For those that find being successful in obtaining an education is a challenge, the default position is to belittle having an education. It is the foundation for the immense disrespect Americans have for education. If something is not easy we collectively decide it is not important.

This extends itself to politics. Understanding the complexity of what it takes to run a country that is a major member of the world community is beyond most. So we simplify electing a president to a juvenile popularity contest. The press is right there lowering the discussion as far into the gutter as they can. The final result is that our presidential election becomes American Idol.



It is NOT a reflection of our educational system. The majority of teachers are educated professional who understand math, science, politics, civics, public speaking, etc. The small minority who somehow made it through and are not fully qualified are just that, a small minority. However, no teacher can overcome the influences of the home. If mommy and/or daddy say global warming is fake,mos children will accept this way of thinking. With so many adults in this country embracing ignorance their sad influence is affecting children. Add politicians injecting their religious beliefs into schools and teachers are fighting a losing battle.
Sounds like you're belittling those without a college education. Not everyone can go to college for a wide variety of reasons, some of which have nothing to do with mental capability. Some prefer to learn a trade and start work within a year or two of high school graduation. Sure we need doctors, nurses, and engineers. But those hospitals also need mechanics, electricians, carpenters, security guards, housekeeping, and many other jobs that don't require a college education. Engineers can design a building, but it takes a construction crew to build what the engineer designed.
 
Old 05-09-2016, 11:21 AM
 
Location: La La Land
1,616 posts, read 2,479,980 times
Reputation: 2839
Quote:
Originally Posted by victimofGM View Post
Sounds like you're belittling those without a college education. Not everyone can go to college for a wide variety of reasons, some of which have nothing to do with mental capability. Some prefer to learn a trade and start work within a year or two of high school graduation. Sure we need doctors, nurses, and engineers. But those hospitals also need mechanics, electricians, carpenters, security guards, housekeeping, and many other jobs that don't require a college education. Engineers can design a building, but it takes a construction crew to build what the engineer designed.
On the contrary, although I am a teacher I am a firm believer that college is not for everyone. I also do not believe that having a college education necessarily makes you a better person. You are absolutely correct that trade craft is a crucial part of our society and should carry no stigma. As a former engineer I stand by your last statement without reservation.

What matters is being a contributing member of society, to the best of your abilities, and respecting what each of us has to offer.

Trump is the poster boy for hatred, exclusion, misinformation, and general ignorance. I am no fan of Republicans but I will admit that Cruz, Rubio and Kasich at least behaved with some dignity and attempted to appear fit for national office. (Carson is an idiot). As a hard line Democrat I also believe that Sanders could tone down the anti establishment rhetoric a bit, and perhaps comb his hair more regularly.

Bottom line, regardless of your political beliefs, demeaning education, trade skills, or any skills or qualifications is just plain dumb. A good presidential candidate should send a message of unity and respect.

Except for the 1%. The 1% just plain suck no matter how you look at it.

Let's not even discuss the .1%.
 
Old 05-09-2016, 11:26 AM
 
Location: La La Land
1,616 posts, read 2,479,980 times
Reputation: 2839
Quote:
Originally Posted by Unsettomati View Post
There is a definite segment of the populace that is deeply distrustful of education. These tend to be social conservatives (emphasis on the 'social') because social conservatism revolves around an embrace of the social status quo and education is information which is a path to new ways of doing things.

These people are so distrustful of education/information that they send their children to private schools or they home-school them to shield those children from information that they find threatening - evolution, sciences that all clearly demonstrate that the Earth is old, history that doesn't jibe with their favorite ancient holy book, etc.

They're afraid of information and they deeply distrust people who advocated learned consideration of things. They prefer instinctual reactions, regardless of the negative consequences that might ensue - in the final analysis, they would rather feel good about a course of action even if that course of action is ill-advised and produces worse results than one produced by well-informed reasoning.

Reason and facts and the world which deals with these things - education, intellectualism - is their enemy. And certain politicians are happy to dumb it down and rail against the 'elites' ... ... in order to pander to these folks.
Good post!
 
Old 05-09-2016, 11:37 AM
 
Location: Viña del Mar, Chile
16,393 posts, read 30,837,500 times
Reputation: 16642
I think humans in general are stupid. The world talks about Americans being anti-intellectual, but they are all just as dumb. All politicians try to pander the lowest common denominator, regardless of the country. Majority of people are attracted to stupid things.

" I feel like I could have a beer with him "
" I like how he talks"
"he's good looking"


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