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Old 05-27-2016, 02:37 PM
 
769 posts, read 782,624 times
Reputation: 1791

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Why is this even important for the average person? Do your close friends and family give you a hard time to act like a man? I could not care less if someone is a man, a woman or somewhere in between. And I could not care less what strangers think of my gender expression. If a friend or a family member has issues with how I act then it's a matter of clarification or cutting loose.
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Old 05-27-2016, 03:25 PM
 
569 posts, read 552,313 times
Reputation: 286
Quote:
Originally Posted by octo View Post
Why is this even important for the average person? Do your close friends and family give you a hard time to act like a man? I could not care less if someone is a man, a woman or somewhere in between. And I could not care less what strangers think of my gender expression. If a friend or a family member has issues with how I act then it's a matter of clarification or cutting loose.
Neither would I care anybody was/is somewhere between. However, for a person's own good, some clarifications shall be declared. Say really, I did not really care a person going to their own downfall. I really did not care.

But since a person asked, and I felt like to answer it. Otherwises, I don't care. Has the world ever be a friendly place?
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Old 05-27-2016, 03:53 PM
 
Location: NW Nevada
18,158 posts, read 15,626,323 times
Reputation: 17149
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2mares View Post
You grew up in the 30's?
In the 50's girls were still not allowed to wear pants to school.
I didnt realize you personally were society. You know I wasn't speaking of you personally, right?

For all purposes, I could make the same statement to you, regarding "society". But it doesn't have any relevance either way. At any face, the "society" I know, which includes more that just me, does not see men threatened by women with strength, both of body and character, or by the manner in which they dress.

You do realize I wasn't singling you, personally, out , either, yes? Truly, I meant no affrontery, it neither will I apologize, as whatever it was that mkffed you about that post was unintentional.
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Old 05-27-2016, 04:37 PM
 
Location: State of Transition
102,210 posts, read 107,883,295 times
Reputation: 116153
Quote:
Originally Posted by croftylot24 View Post
Women are pressured to adhere to physical standards of beauty but even then, they don't get as much disapproval from people as men if they don't do it.

Men are pressured by society to basically be "masculine" (i.e not crying, being a "gentlemen", being the protector) and if they don't do these, they are not considered a "real man" by quite a few people. A feminine man will always be criticized more than a masculine woman.

In fact if men takes interest in female beauty the assumption is that he must be gay? Why. What is it about painting nails or wearing skirts that makes someone not a "real man".

What could be the cause of this?
OP, this is sad. Where do you live, that you feel this pressure? This thing about being stereotypically "manly", the John Wayne thing, has been OVER for roughly the last 20 years, at least, on the West Coast and in a few other parts of the US. It's history. And I wouldn't compare who's under more pressure to fit their allotted stereotype, if I were you. Women have always had that kind of pressure, too.

But maybe it's time you relocated to a more liberal part of the country....? Liberate yourself! Express the full range of who you really are, your unique self! The world needs you to be your whole self, all you can be.
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Old 05-27-2016, 05:07 PM
 
Location: Myrtle Creek, Oregon
15,293 posts, read 17,681,555 times
Reputation: 25236
Quote:
Originally Posted by Taluffen View Post
You really should do some research off of city-data regarding modern gender roles and expectations. But I will say it is a myth that women are given a pass if they don't adhere to certain gender expectations. In some social circles they may be able to ignore some but in many others, especially ones which are considered "conservative" and "traditional" there is plenty of pressure to act and behave a certain way. A good example are some men's rights internet organizations which simultaneously condemn traditional male roles as a breadwinner, but yet condemn men who act in anyway what is perceived as "feminine" while complaining about women who do not live in what they consider as their natural role (think 1950's passive housewife).
If you think women are not pressured to be "womanly," talk to a woman who doesn't like children. That's if you can find one who will admit to it. Cruella DeVille, anybody? They are demonized.
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Old 05-27-2016, 07:19 PM
 
1,278 posts, read 1,248,224 times
Reputation: 1312
Quote:
Originally Posted by croftylot24 View Post
Women are pressured to adhere to physical standards of beauty but even then, they don't get as much disapproval from people as men if they don't do it.

Men are pressured by society to basically be "masculine" (i.e not crying, being a "gentlemen", being the protector) and if they don't do these, they are not considered a "real man" by quite a few people. A feminine man will always be criticized more than a masculine woman.

In fact if men takes interest in female beauty the assumption is that he must be gay? Why. What is it about painting nails or wearing skirts that makes someone not a "real man".

What could be the cause of this?
i don't think society pressures men to be manly, in fact the opposite these days. men have been emasculated for decades. though they may look manly and buff, many men are in fact less decisive within a relationship structure than they were generations ago. women on the other hand are more and more taking the lead within that structure. i see this all the time when i meet with couples for financial planning. lol.

these days, it's not uncommon to see the man pushing the stroller or carrying the baby, and holding the handbag while the wife is discussing the home they're looking at with a realtor.
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Old 05-28-2016, 07:32 AM
 
477 posts, read 276,528 times
Reputation: 1316
Quote:
Originally Posted by Garthur View Post
Ask any car dealer who buys the cars, it's women, ask any real estate agent who buys the houses, it's women, Ask any university how many women they have enrolled and it's always over 50%.
Well, the women may be there, making the decision, but who's putting up the money? Probably the man.
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Old 05-28-2016, 10:46 AM
 
Location: Caribou, Me.
6,928 posts, read 5,904,275 times
Reputation: 5251
Quote:
Originally Posted by croftylot24 View Post
Women are pressured to adhere to physical standards of beauty but even then, they don't get as much disapproval from people as men if they don't do it.

Men are pressured by society to basically be "masculine" (i.e not crying, being a "gentlemen", being the protector) and if they don't do these, they are not considered a "real man" by quite a few people. A feminine man will always be criticized more than a masculine woman.

In fact if men takes interest in female beauty the assumption is that he must be gay? Why. What is it about painting nails or wearing skirts that makes someone not a "real man".

What could be the cause of this?
I disagree completely with your premise. Masculinity is now considered gross.
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Old 05-28-2016, 11:04 AM
 
Location: Oregon, formerly Texas
10,065 posts, read 7,237,863 times
Reputation: 17146
What the heck does "manly" or "womanly" even mean?

I think there are insane expectations in society for women regarding their looks that do not apply to men. A man can be good looking if he doesn't shave, even if his body fat is a little above normal, he's got a beer gut, etc... Women on the other hand are pushed to be thin & shamed if they are not, which is a double edged sword in a society where work is more and more sedentary with food more infused with sugar, corn syrups, etc..

Just look at Donald Trump who judges women based on how they look. Even when they are successful, if they are not good looking, well, he's going to put them down. Yet men fall under a different standard - their looks are a part of their total package.
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Old 05-28-2016, 11:36 AM
 
Location: Myrtle Creek, Oregon
15,293 posts, read 17,681,555 times
Reputation: 25236
Quote:
Originally Posted by manteca man View Post
Well, the women may be there, making the decision, but who's putting up the money? Probably the man.
Not so much any more. A large majority of people who lost jobs in the last recession were men, and those jobs have been slow to return. It's common now for women to have the steady office job with health insurance and retirement, while men are stuck in part time, menial jobs. That is the shape of the future. 57% of college graduates are women. Single women now make up 23% of first time home buyers vs. 15% for single men.
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