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Old 07-18-2016, 09:09 PM
 
Location: East Coast of the United States
27,265 posts, read 28,339,813 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Port Pitt Ash View Post
Except you're not really seeing that yet in the Mexican communities despite their value of education, hard work, and close family ties.
As a whole, Latino Americans have a much lower percentage of 4-year bachelors degree holders compared to certain other groups.

Even among Latino Americans, there is significant variation. Cuban Americans have a much higher percentage of bachelors degree holders than Mexican Americans, for example.

 
Old 07-18-2016, 09:15 PM
 
10,337 posts, read 5,821,664 times
Reputation: 17879
"Why are some minorities more successful than others in America?"
Why are some minorities more successful than Americans in America, and vice versa?
Isn't the question: Why are some PEOPLE more successful than other PEOPLE?
Because they try harder. They have intellectual and emotional intelligence. They look for help. They know what they're good at. They love what they do. They're in the right place at the right time. People.
 
Old 07-18-2016, 09:28 PM
 
Location: louisiana
2 posts, read 2,333 times
Reputation: 10
I think the Hispanic community is hard working people and know how to stay out of trouble.Why is there so much violence in the low income communities in America.They have plenty of opportunities to make life better if they work hard and save.I wish there wasn't so much violence in America.I wish it was like it was in the 80's when the economy was working and money was worth something.Peace be with everyone-God bless America!
 
Old 07-18-2016, 10:35 PM
 
Location: Cleveland
170 posts, read 105,214 times
Reputation: 87
Education in countries from where we see the most immigrants (China, former USSR, India) have much better education than here. And furthermore, for free in most places.

My parents are from Soviet Russia, and they not only received some of the best schooling in the world, but they also went to one of the most prestigious universities in the world, and the USSR Government actually PAYED them to go, as did all other citizens. In Soviet Russia, every student was payed the equivalent of about $1000-2000 in today's money per month. This covered all rent, food, tuition, and left each student with a little extra spending money in the end.
 
Old 07-18-2016, 11:16 PM
 
Location: Queens, NY
49 posts, read 50,021 times
Reputation: 93
Quote:
Originally Posted by Salmonburgher View Post
East Asians - Tight Families Demand Certain Behaviour - High Rate of Success

American Blacks - Destroyed Families Demand Little - Low Rate of Success



How can you have a discussion with anyone when you apparently are unable to understand an obvious generalisation? Moreover, the OP question is asking about relative differences in various minority groups, in which case, we need to look at the various groups as wholes... i.e., we need to generalise.

Do you really believe that I am unaware that some blacks are successful and some East Asians are not?



No. That was not the reason. From slavery through Jim Crow, the black family in the US remained quite intact up until the start of LBJ's Great Society.

Prior to the start of Liberal do-gooders' attempts to help blacks, black women were more likely than white women to be married and living in intact families in the US. Let me repeat that so that the fact can sink in:

Prior to the start of Liberal do-gooders' attempts to help blacks, black women were more likely than white women to be married and living in intact families in the US.

Even while the nation was shamefully segregated, the black communities had black shopkeepers, doctors, attorneys, accountants, etc...

Now, you tell me what you think destroyed the black family.


I've done the maths.

I've also lived in East Asia for the past 32 years, and I speak the language where I live.

And again, getting back to the OP, the question is why do some minorities do well in the USA and some do not?

How East Asians fare in East Asia is irrelevant to this question.

There. I've done the maths.

Now, why don't you go back and read the question... and maybe look at a book and learn some history?

"No. That was not the reason. From slavery through Jim Crow, the black family in the US remained quite intact up until the start of LBJ's Great Society."

This is not true at all, I don't know what history books you've been reading, but black families during slavery were broken up CONSTANTLY - children were separated from their parents and sold to different families. Many slave masters had no interest in preserving the family unit of enslaved black people. When they needed to increase their numbers, some slave masters would pair people up (usually people who didn't even like each other) and try to get them to "breed".
Even mixed-race children who were born from enslaved black women/white slave masters were sold off to a different family, usually to hide the fact the slave master was abusing his slaves. Your comment isn't just a generalization, it's flat out wrong:

Slavery and the Making of America . The Slave Experience: The Family | PBS

This article discusses the incarceration rate of black men and black families:

50 Years After the Moynihan Report, Examining the Black Family in the Age of Mass Incarceration - The Atlantic

Of course the whole "model minority" is a myth:

Myth versus Facts: Asian American and Model Minorities

"Asians make the nation's highest median family income. But this statistic doesn't tell the whole story. Asian families have a higher percentage of their members employed in the workforce, so their family income is naturally higher. Also, the U.S. Census does not distinguish between Japanese-American citizens and Japanese residents in the U.S. who maintain their Japanese citizenship. Therefore, this figure includes many highly paid Japanese businessmen in the U.S. on extended business. "

And certain Asian groups, like Vietnamese, have a higher poverty rate and higher drop out rate:
https://www.whitehouse.gov/administr...ritical-issues

Asian-Americans: Smart, High-Incomes And ... Poor? : NPR

Not just that, but a number of immigrants from Asia in the past 20-30 years are more likely to come from a middle class background since they can afford the trip over, for instance a Chinese guy I know was a veterinarian back in Hong Kong. Of course, he has to start over again from a "humble" beginning because he spoke very little English. Poor Asians came to America in the late 1800's/early 1900's looking for work (before the U.S started passing laws like the "Chinese Exclusion Act", but after the Civil Rights movement helped passed the Immigration Act of 1965, more and more middle-class, educated Asians were immigrating to the U.S. So, comparing middle-class Asian immigrants to ALL black Americans of various backgrounds is unfair and it's very EASY to assume that Asians and black people all started from the same point when that was probably true over 100 years ago. Think about, how many poor farmers or McDonald's workers from rich countries like Japan or South Korea come to the U.S. and become middle/upper class citizens in high paying positions? I would say close to ZERO.

The poster from Nigeria makes much more sense, because they stated that the Nigerians that are in the U.S are those that come from more affluent backgrounds whereas a large number of Nigerians back in Nigeria don't even graduate high school. It's easy for people (especially Asian Americans) to believe that East Asians are "more educated and affluent" when most of their immigrants ARE from more educated and affluent backgrounds!

Korean Americans : Asian-Nation :: Asian American History, Demographics, & Issues

"After 1965, students-turned professionals were able to apply for permanent residence visas in the United States under provisions of the Hart-Cellar Act."

And it makes even more sense when you compare Korean immigrants to Vietnamese immigrants:

"Large-scale Vietnamese migration to the United States started as an influx of refugees following the end of the Vietnam War in 1975. Early refugees were part of a U.S.-sponsored evacuation and consisted mainly of military personnel and urban, well-educated professionals associated with the U.S. military or the South Vietnamese government. In contrast, a second wave of Vietnamese refugees, commonly known as “boat people,” arrived in the late 1970s. The majority of these arrivals came from rural areas and were often less educated."

If anyone reads articles on the myth of the model minority, they will find out that Vietnamese, along with Cambodians (who were also part of the refugees who came to the U.S. during the Vietnam War) and Laotians as well as other Asian groups outside of the East have higher rates of poverty and high school drop out rates.

And Asians in East Asia would show a variety of backgrounds - Almost half of the elderly population in South Korea live below the poverty line with the rate getting worse. Hong Kong has one of the widest income gaps of any developed nation along with around 40% of their residents living in subsidized housing. Japan's childhood poverty is on the rise, with 1 in 6 living in poverty. I don't think that social issues in Asia are irrelevant unless it's a side you prefer people didn't see.
 
Old 07-19-2016, 03:45 AM
 
Location: Tucson/Nogales
23,070 posts, read 28,795,075 times
Reputation: 32364
Let's not forget, when the starving Irish arrived in New York City, no prospect of a job was below them. As a result, in NYC, many blacks were pushed aside, taking jobs away from the blacks, even emptying chamber pots which was traditionally a job for black people. One job the Irish were incapable of taking away the from blacks, was working in the fields of the South. Just not strong enough for that kind of work!

The type of jobs that the a number of the Irish gravitated to were police jobs, as back then it was the poorest paid and most dangerous job you could have. And all along, the Irish have been a big force in the police departments.

Some minorities simply don't have the drive to be "successful", and the more driven can be extremely thankful for that.

My experience with Mexicans (one living with me for 15 years) is they're certainly not as driven/greedy as Asians, Indians, or a number of the African immigrants, and not anywhere nearly as materialistic. My Mexican roommate's big spending spree every month is going to a thrift store...........on his bike.........and how happy, happy, happy he is!

I work at a Long-Term Care/Rehab facility, and which minorities all have their hands up to work double shifts, extra shifts, 60-70-80-90 hours a week? Asians, foremost, then followed by Blacks, Whites, and the Mexicans? Rarely, if ever!
 
Old 07-19-2016, 03:55 AM
 
Location: Texas
44,256 posts, read 64,077,267 times
Reputation: 73913
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cape Cod Todd View Post
\ The Irish have gotten past their stigmas but it seems that black folk are still trying to break that stereotypical mold and the BLM crowd is not helping.

\.
The Irish weren't selectively bred to get the most physically fit and simple-minded (and therefore compliant during times of slavery) population.
I think selective breeding HAD to play a part in this process. And the difference.
There are records that slave owners were pretty particular and tried to create the perfect slave - that's going to be dumb and strong.
 
Old 07-19-2016, 07:46 AM
 
Location: Texas
38,859 posts, read 25,380,158 times
Reputation: 24780
Default Why are some minorities more successful than others in America?

Some minorities have been subject to much less oppression than others.

That isn't the complete explanation, but it is certainly the largest single factor. Many new arrivals to the USA were subject to discrimination, even if they were white, English-speaking Christians (Irish). Those who fell outside those narrow guidelines experienced varying degrees of bias. Some was subtle, some was violent.
 
Old 07-19-2016, 08:43 AM
 
6,326 posts, read 6,545,095 times
Reputation: 7457
Quote:
Originally Posted by GeoffD View Post
Successful immigrant groups tend to share the following in common:
* A high value on education
* A high value on work ethic

Pick what ever group you want. Eastern European Jews. Indians. Vietnamese. Chinese. Japanese. Korean. Russian. In general, those immigrant groups were, or are, statistically very successful. I think a big part of it is that we tended to get their best & brightest and the motivated risk-takers above and beyond their cultural bias towards stressing education and work ethic.

I think the value on education is at least as important as the work ethic. An unskilled person is always going to have a compensation cap because there is such an oversupply of unskilled labor. You can get to the middle class but your children are unlikely to do better than you unless you instill both the education ethic and work ethic into them.

I think that a big chunk of whitebread 'Murica has lost most of that education ethic and work ethic. It's OK to have a nation of Homer Simpson. That's fine. Just don't resent the people who do it right and have the 21st century job skills and the good work ethic.
What is a "skill"? If you've been around educated Indians, for example, growing their hands straight from their arses and incapable of just about anything requiring "skill" or even common sense not to break things, you would ponder that question.

There is society wide skill discrimination so to speak, and countless attempts on rationalization of why some people owe 1000 hours of their labor to procure 1 hour of labor of more deserving folks. Now, "education" is the most popular rationalization crutch which bestows heavenly qualities demanding top dollars, when in truth most educated folks, and especially some educated minorities, are ridiculously unskilled, and they extract top dollars not by virtue of their skills but just because they occupy higher spots in hierarchy of an organization, but not too high though. And exact rationalization of hierarchy is not important, the hairless apes for the past 10,000 years arrange themselves in the pecking/slaving orders employing various rationalization tricks. The most important thing to remember here, it is not a "skill" or "education", it is your place in the pecking order that defines ones compensation. And nope, skill/education "meritocracy" doesnt define the shape of the pyramid, since genuinely skilled/educated grunts rarely reach the top or even the middle of a pyramid.
 
Old 07-19-2016, 09:29 AM
 
510 posts, read 495,834 times
Reputation: 1297
I suppose your talking about modern well-educated immigrants vs poor immigrants. What is the difference of success? Well, the well-educated have an advantage of being from a relatively wealthy family abroad, or at least at access to a well established educational system (although the US doesn't recognize all international university degrees). When they come overseas with a STEM degree they can guarantee a high income job and live in a good neighborhood with good schools, and will make sure their kids are going to do the same.

If you're poor, well you can get over here, but you're probably working in a low paying job, living in a low income town, with awful schools. In many cases you lack stability so you have to move around (including your family). Language barriers also prevent complete integration and you likely lack any income source from your parents overseas as a means to establish a business or buy a house.

Conclusion: Come from money, and your quality of life is better.
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