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The global economic imbalance of 1950 where the rest of the industrialized world was bombed to rubble and the United States was 50% of the world economy is long over.
I'm glad someone else realizes this. The 1950s presented a set of circumstances that will not be repeated. Germany and Japan were out of the game, and Britain and France were crippled. We had no competition. By 1965, the Germans and Japanese were back on their feet, and their factories were new, with the latest technology. This is when blue collar America began it's long decline. Perhaps the decline could have been minimized, if during the salad days, both labor, and ownership had been willing to take a little less, and seen more reinvestment into our industry.
The 1950s presented a set of circumstances that will not be repeated.
Hopefully not. The 1950s were a dark and gloomy decade in the US that included three recessions and saw the deflation of our self-image and global standing when the Soviets so easily beat us into space. We were looking and feeling very much like a spent and second-rate power in those years.
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Originally Posted by Herodotus
Germany and Japan were out of the game...
They had been effectively rebuilt as of the early 1950s.
No, They Don't, Rich people do not get rich by working, they get rich by exploiting the work of poor people.
This! Added to the military spending spree our government is on. How many wars are we fighting? Better question is WHO are we fighting for?
"The war is not meant to be won, it is meant to be continuous. Hierarchical society is only possible on the basis of poverty and ignorance. This new version is the past and no different past can ever have existed. In principle the war effort is always planned to keep society on the brink of starvation. The war is waged by the ruling group against its own subjects and its object is not the victory over either Eurasia or East Asia, but to keep the very structure of society intact."
I actually agree with a lot of your points, except for a few. New homes don't cost $360K in all areas. Depends where you live. The average "new build" here is about $270K and that is for a 4bd home, 2400 sq ft, 2 car garage, full basement and upgraded. My brother lives in Phoenix. He just bought a brand new home. 1800 sq ft for $155K. So truly depends on where you live. I'm in NW Indiana and the COL is lower here so jobs do pay less; however, we're also within 35-40 minutes of Chicago where jobs pay higher so most commute. I also agree that minimum wage is not meant to raise a family on. It's for part-time workers, high schoolers, students IMO. Anyone needing to raise a family needs to either get educated so they can get a better, higher paying job or work more that one job. With that said, the federal minimum wage is too low and needs to be raised. I also agree that they need to be more strict with public assistance. It should not be allowed long term. People should not stay on it their entire life! It needs to be capped to a said timeframe. Not to mention crackdown on fraud.
Didn't Pres. Clinton do away with welfare-as-a-way-of-life?
Difficult to answer without getting too political, but IMO the decline of union membership and their power is probably the number one factor. When a company is profiting millions or perhaps billions of dollars a year, yet laying off workers something is wrong. OTOH, if a company is breaking even or losing money lay offs would make sense to me.
I do not think unions can make a come back and perhaps the best we can hope for would be the creation of a 3rd political party (i.e. Labor Party) that could bargain for the ENTIRE American workforce instead of having small unions only bargaining for their members.
I also think boycotts can work in some circumstances, but they can be hard to organize and maintain, especially if they are prolonged.
"Bargain for the ENTIRE American workforce" with who? This isn't the days of railroad, steelworkers, autoworkers, and mine workers' strikes. The world has changed drastically since these days.
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Originally Posted by GeoffD
The global economic imbalance of 1950 where the rest of the industrialized world was bombed to rubble and the United States was 50% of the world economy is long over. No matter how much people wish it were so, you can't set the Flux Capacitor back to 1955, get the DeLorean up to 88 MPH, and re-live something that is never going to happen again. If you're average, unmotivated, and poorly educated, you're not going to prosper in 2016. In most of the country, you can achieve middle class by being average, being motivated, and having a bit of education as long as you marry someone with those same attributes. Only 6% of the workforce maxes out their Social Security contribution at $118,500. The formula for economic prosperity in the United States is to get married, stay married, and have an educational and work ethic that's better than average.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Herodotus
I'm glad someone else realizes this. The 1950s presented a set of circumstances that will not be repeated. Germany and Japan were out of the game, and Britain and France were crippled. We had no competition. By 1965, the Germans and Japanese were back on their feet, and their factories were new, with the latest technology. This is when blue collar America began it's long decline. Perhaps the decline could have been minimized, if during the salad days, both labor, and ownership had been willing to take a little less, and seen more reinvestment into our industry.
I'm glad some people understand something about history, which help to explain how we got here. It hasn't peaked. There is a tremendous amount of competition yet to emerge in the global economy. We have really only seen competition from China. Wait until some of the other larger countries in the world get their act together. The US needs to get much better at competing with the rest of the world. I don't think we have begun to figure out how we can raise the standard of living for our population without having a large manufacturing base to employ people.
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Originally Posted by craigiri
The economy is booming up here in New England.
It has been that way - to some degree - for decades other than the major Great Recession.
As far as the single person working...I'd bet that if families lived like most did in 1960, lots of households could get by on one wage earner. That means no jet-set vacations, no cable TV, no iphone, only the barest in and and all electronics goods, a house of perhaps 1100 square feet, etc.
Books could be written about your question - but I will give you the basic answer(s).
1. Most people live way above their means. The Government debt you speak of is part and parcel of that in many ways.
2. Unregulated Predatory Capitalism (our system) does not care about the masses making less. Not a bit. Sad, but true.
3. Americans, by and large, have been taught to be selfish. If we lived in a country where it was taught otherwise, we'd probably be different. But our culture is corporate controlled and corporate led. This means they sell fear - and fear generates profits.
4. The single largest driver of government (and other) debt in this country is Health Care. It costs almost 10K per person per year. See #2 above for the reason. Even a small attempt to fix it or head it in the right direction will fail - as we see now. Why, well...because of #5.
5. Lack of Education is the driver of all of the above. Civilization depends on education...otherwise we all just get what we can (classic idea of cavemen bopping woman on head and dragging her away)....
In many ways - look who we just elected - we are heading toward this goal. The guy grabs women and shifts his debt to other (bankruptcy) and many cheer. He claims he loves the uneducated...and they cheer.
I guess my question becomes "what do you expect?" in light of the above. Places like where I live (MA.) will go well economically because we value education, taking care of our populace (universal health care) and our products (biotech, tech, education, high end manufacturing) will always be valuable to the world.
But those areas of the country with people who either don't vote - or don't vote based on facts, education and the real world.....well, they are probably going to be in for some more hard times. Maybe forever.
You make some good points. The key question is how to provide large scale employment when out major employers are government, education, healthcare, and insurance. The question is whether these centers of employment are sustaining the economy or dragging it down.
I'm glad some people understand something about history, which help to explain how we got here.
Even if it's completely wrong? The 1950s were not some economic Disneyland for the US. Three recessions in that decade, even as we worked to rebuild the economies of our WW2 enemies.
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Originally Posted by villageidiot1
I don't think we have begun to figure out how we can raise the standard of living for our population without having a large manufacturing base to employ people.
Like agriculture a hundred years before it, manufacturing has very plainly lost any ability it might once have had to provide jobs for the masses. That's not just here, but everywhere. Keep in mind that since the mid-1990s, China has lost more manufacturing jobs than the US presently has.
With the fading away of jobs for the masses, universal basic income is the only way to provide decently for every individual and avoid even worse widespread misery.
We should do away with all the bits of "assistance" confetti that drifts down to this person or that person, all the alphabet soup of agencies and programs, then put in place a national health service, and finally guarantee every person a decent, unconditional basic income.
The old jobs factory jobs aren't coming back, but we can do without them if every individual is allowed to live a dignified life on a secure basic income.
Like agriculture a hundred years before it, manufacturing has very plainly lost any ability it might once have had to provide jobs for the masses. That's not just here, but everywhere. Keep in mind that since the mid-1990s, China has lost more manufacturing jobs than the US presently has.
Indeed, manufacturing is alive and well. What's struggling is manufacturing jobs. The situation is precisely the same with agriculture. And since so much of the American Heartland was a combination of agriculture and manufacturing, the corresponding job-losses were a double blow.
The 1950s were of course not some halcyon time; there never was such a time. But the mid-20th century was an unusual and inimitable time, in that large numbers of Americans with limited education were able to enjoy comparatively robust incomes. Such a thing wasn't possible 1-2 generations prior, and is probably no longer possible today.
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Originally Posted by josie13
With the fading away of jobs for the masses, universal basic income is the only way to provide decently for every individual...
The old jobs factory jobs aren't coming back, but we can do without them if every individual is allowed to live a dignified life on a secure basic income.
In principle this is a reasonable suggestion, but how is going to pay for the "basic income". Yes, we could raise taxes. But on whom, and how much? Yes, we could curtail or even abolish existing social-programs. But which ones, and how to do this fairly?
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