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Old 06-26-2017, 01:12 PM
 
Location: Tulsa
2,230 posts, read 1,702,599 times
Reputation: 2434

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Quote:
Originally Posted by ncole1 View Post
Are you meaning to suggest that immigrants are so irrational that they would choose to attend an institution at which they cannot succeed due to a language barrier? I'm sure some are, but it would be mass stereotyping to assume that most immigrants are.
I wasn't suggesting that.

But I'm suggesting many illegal immigrants and refugees decide to come to the U.S, a country where they cannot succeed due to multiple factors including language barrier.
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Old 06-26-2017, 01:13 PM
 
Location: Tulsa
2,230 posts, read 1,702,599 times
Reputation: 2434
Quote:
Originally Posted by NCN View Post
Illegals would be in prison along with other criminals.
This is exactly what Australia is doing.
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Old 06-26-2017, 01:14 PM
NCN
 
Location: NC/SC Border Patrol
21,663 posts, read 25,545,112 times
Reputation: 24368
Quote:
Originally Posted by ncole1 View Post
You assume that the system is fair to begin with in order to argue that the system is fair. This is a circular argument that does not address questions such as what the ideal waitlist time should be for a green card or the ideal requirements for a visa for work or school.



Not in prison. Deported. (Unless you assume that they would commit violent crimes, but this would be a severe stereotype that is not supported by scientific evidence. Yes, some do, but this is true of citizens also)
You have no understanding of USA law. Are you here illegally? Sounds like you are. I have never heard of the necessity for laws to be fair. Laws are laws and should be obeyed by everybody. We don't just obey laws we consider to be fair or that we like.

If you don't like a law then try to get the law changed but as long as the law is there it is binding. I have no problem with our immigration laws.

For your information, anyone being here illegally has committed a crime just from being here illegally. Ignorance is no excuse.
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Old 06-26-2017, 01:17 PM
 
18,495 posts, read 15,479,782 times
Reputation: 16163
Quote:
Originally Posted by NCN View Post
You have no understanding of USA law. Are you here illegally. Sounds like you are. I have never heard of the necessity for laws to be fair. Laws are laws and should be obeyed by everybody. We don't just obey laws we consider to be fair or that we like.

If you don't like a law then try to get the law changed but as long as the law is there it is binding. I have no problem with our immigration laws.
What's the point of a great debates thread if you just argue that the law is what it is and leave it at that? Is improvement not a worthy goal?

The First Amendment is also a law. And the principle behind it is that, among other things, there is great value in communicating when one disagrees with actions of the government.

I am native born, if it matters.
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Old 06-26-2017, 01:22 PM
 
3,393 posts, read 4,001,172 times
Reputation: 9310
Quote:
Originally Posted by ncole1 View Post
What's the point of a great debates thread if you just argue that the law is what it is and leave it at that? Is improvement not a worthy goal?

The First Amendment is also a law. And the principle behind it is that, among other things, there is great value in communicating when one disagrees with actions of the government.

I am native born, if it matters.
Do you know why legislators never introduce bills that involve changing current immigration law? It's not a coincidence. It because it would be wildly unpopular with their constituents. Even in the most liberal parts of the country, polling shows overwhelming support for current immigration law.


And if you think "improvement" means letting more immigrants in, ask Europe how that is working out for them. But they're pretty busy dealing with all the terrorist attacks.
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Old 06-26-2017, 01:24 PM
NCN
 
Location: NC/SC Border Patrol
21,663 posts, read 25,545,112 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ncole1 View Post
What's the point of a great debates thread if you just argue that the law is what it is and leave it at that? Is improvement not a worthy goal?

The First Amendment is also a law. And the principle behind it is that, among other things, there is great value in communicating when one disagrees with actions of the government.

I am native born, if it matters.
The only improvement we need to our immigration laws is that they be enforced. If you are native born, why don't you understand that to help anyone who hostilely comes into this country makes one a traitor. Read the constitution. It is as clear as day on this subject. Breaking our laws, no matter which law is harming our country. No one should help a person here illegally except to take them to the border. Humans make wrong decisions. That they are here illegally is not my fault. So if they are dehumanized, they did it to themselves.
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Old 06-26-2017, 01:34 PM
 
18,495 posts, read 15,479,782 times
Reputation: 16163
Quote:
Originally Posted by NCN View Post
The only improvement we need to our immigration laws is that they be enforced. If you are native born, why don't you understand that to help anyone who hostilely comes into this country makes one a traitor. Read the constitution. It is as clear as day on this subject. Breaking our laws, no matter which law is harming our country. No one should help a person here illegally except to take them to the border. Humans make wrong decisions. That they are here illegally is not my fault. So if they are dehumanized, they did it to themselves.
None of this addresses why you don't think that it should be easier for immigrants to be legal, apart from your belief that they are dangerous people more commonly than citizens are, which you have not supported by evidence.
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Old 06-26-2017, 01:37 PM
 
18,495 posts, read 15,479,782 times
Reputation: 16163
Quote:
Originally Posted by Book Lover 21 View Post
Do you know why legislators never introduce bills that involve changing current immigration law? It's not a coincidence. It because it would be wildly unpopular with their constituents. Even in the most liberal parts of the country, polling shows overwhelming support for current immigration law.


And if you think "improvement" means letting more immigrants in, ask Europe how that is working out for them. But they're pretty busy dealing with all the terrorist attacks.
I have an exercise for you: Count all the mass public killing events that have occurred due to immigrants, and divide by the total number of immigrants. Express as a rate. Now repeat the exercise for citizens.

I think you will find that immigrants are NOT dangerous people.
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Old 06-26-2017, 01:40 PM
 
Location: Tennessee
37,759 posts, read 40,861,775 times
Reputation: 62051
One of the reasons we have immigration laws is that we don't let too many poor people into this country putting a burden on American taxpayers. Yes, many illegal immigrants pay taxes but they don't pay enough to cover their cost. When immigration laws are not enforced, Americans are hurt.
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Old 06-26-2017, 01:45 PM
 
3,393 posts, read 4,001,172 times
Reputation: 9310
Quote:
Originally Posted by ncole1 View Post
I have an exercise for you: Count all the mass public killing events that have occurred due to immigrants, and divide by the total number of immigrants. Express as a rate. Now repeat the exercise for citizens.

I think you will find that immigrants are NOT dangerous people.
Just so we're clear, you're talking about ILLEGAL immigrants, correct?


I have friends that work on task forces with Homeland Security at the border. Many illegal immigrants are extremely dangerous. We are fighting a losing war trying to keep the dangerous ones out. I hear the horrible stories that the media suppresses. So don't try to lecture me.
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