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Old 11-13-2018, 08:16 AM
 
4,434 posts, read 5,325,669 times
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Iím a strong supporter of the second amendment and also strongly disturbed by the number of mass shootings, but it never leads me to blame the gun.

I really wish I knew what causes these situations honestly. I cannot for a second put myself into the shoes of these people. They are just crazies. Iíve been angry, Iíve been irate at stupidity around me, political issues, whatever else, but Iíve never wanted to harm someone else for their essential and important right to freedom of speech and belief. Itís just totally irrational. I also donít understand why the random killings?! If I did ever shoot someone, it wouldnít be random. It would have to be targeted like, say, someone raped my GF and justice wasnít served in court, so I decide to go John Wick on them. That I can understand and I can put myself in someoneís shoes who commits such a crime. Even though I donít advocate or excuse taking the law into your own hands, make no mistake, but I can rationally sympathize.

But going into some place and just indiscriminately killing people?! I really donít get it. I think thatís part of the problem is none of us debating what causes these shootings can grasp what brings a person to this level. Sometimes it appears to be racism or whatnot, but others itís just like some really twisted cry for attention, I guess? I feel itís a bit pointless when I see people arguing over it because it seems like the bogeyman to me. Just insert whatever YOU think is wrong with society and BAM thatís the cause. Donít like women overshadowing men in the workforce? Bam, explains shooters. Think everyone has turned their back on your religion? Must be they need to find Jesus / Allah / God / whatever. Donít like video games because youíve clearly never played them (nor read the studies)? Video games caused the shootings. Think social media is evil? It causes social isolation and shootings lol. Donít think kids should be raised by a single parent? Destruction of the typical family structure has caused mass shootings.

Itís almost like go down the list and pick a few things from the buffet line and you have your solution. Doesnít mean it has literally any relevance but it makes you feel better that youíre onto something because humans naturally grasp for explanations. I admit I donít have any. I think some people are just mentally disturbed and ďsnap,Ē because I donít think 99% of people could ever imagine doing something like that. Iím a strong, gun loving white guy who never backs down from a fight if someone else starts it, but I would never ever want to hurt innocent people or hurt anyone except in self defense if it was a last resort. What makes someone able to do such horrible things to other people? I really donít know. I find it so sad and tragic thinking of these lives that were pointlessly taken, happy people going about their lives, plans and dreams for the future, and in walks some nutjob who ends it all. Itís heartbreaking.
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Old 11-13-2018, 04:44 PM
 
Location: San Jose
1,533 posts, read 456,459 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 2nd trick op View Post
And while I'm convinced that any attempt at wholesale prohibition of firearms won't work, the only real argument which resonates with me is that the predominately-rural tradition of sport hunting provides our military with a supply of citizen-soldiers who know how to handle a firearm before they're inducted. That argument has been tested and proven in combat situations for over two centuries.
Of all of the qualities need for good soldiering, being a good shot isn't anywhere near the top. Discipline, structure, heart, team work, toughness, following orders and experience are far more important qualities to have in soldiers then a few men with prior hunting experience. Not to mention that historically our citizen soldier model hasn't produced very good results overall.

Then you have soldiers from other parts of the world who grow up with zero firearm and hunting experience who make excellent soldiers. Gurkha's immediately come to mind. Truthfully having a massively armed populous does nothing to protect us from a foreign power or a tyrannical government.
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Old 11-13-2018, 05:43 PM
 
Location: Colorado
9,940 posts, read 6,352,013 times
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*sigh*

So my son is in his first sexual relationship, with an adorable, attractive young lady who is also...trouble. She's been in and out of mental hospitals her whole life. She has sexual abuse in her history, and she admits to risky behavior and extreme emotional manipulation. She self harms. She uses threats of self harm, and self harm actions, to manipulate others. She is in group therapy and seeing 3 different counselors, and taking meds now, but she's still...a mess.

And recently, she added to her Facebook profile, a photo of the shooters from Columbine. My son says she is "a total fangirl" for mass shooters and talks about how much she wishes she could do that at their school. Why? Because people "look at her" and she cannot stand it when people "look at her." I could report these things. People have. She would get sent away for a few days. Again. And then she'd come back. Again. None of these stays in hospitals, and none of the therapy, and none of the meds, has been enough to "fix" any of this.

You know, there is one, and only one thing, that stands between this being teenage melodrama, and national news tragedy. She doesn't have access to a gun. Thankfully my son doesn't, either, and I've no intention to see that change.

Look, I get it, guns don't kill people, people kill people. It's a violence problem. Or a changing social/gender roles problem. Or it's inequality. Or it's a mental health epidemic. I do understand the enshrined sanctity of American gun rights. I do. I don't trust the government either. Though I also don't think that the might that the government can bring to bear is anything that all the gun owners in your town can stand up to in any way that matters, either. If "the man" comes for you, your gun, even if it is a very nice gun, or several very nice guns, isn't likely to save you. If you think it will, think about Ruby Ridge, or Waco, for a while. But so if this is a mental health issue, and I do think that the media's barrage of violent fantasy into the brains of our youth is a factor... What about the fact that when some of us were young, we might get melodramatic over this or that, but no one co-signed it and made a fuss and enabled it for us? A lot of the depths to which people take their mental illness thing, now, just...weren't seen as even an option when I was young. And a lot of people are "getting help" but I don't see it making a ton of difference for all too many of them.

I don't know the solution. I can't sit here and type, "Well here's what I think we need to do" and blahblah like my opinion somehow matters here anyhow, even if I did. But I certainly do not think that putting women and minorities back in our places so that white guys can feel safely on top of things again, is any kind of a solution that makes sense. If anything, parents of boys, especially white boys I guess, need to be trying to raise them to find a place in a world that also includes and respects people not like them. Unfortunately I think that the way consumerism gets a choke-hold on parents, it's all too easy to indulge them to the point of entitlement. I've been guilty of that myself, to my everlasting regret. I don't know...but these problems, they are too big to be simple. Maybe too big to solve.
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Old 11-13-2018, 09:31 PM
 
2,147 posts, read 815,680 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pilot1 View Post
The most recent mass shooting occurred in California which has the most restrictive gun laws, and ammunition laws in the country. "Gun Violence" is a misnomer. It is PEOPLE VIOLENCE. The guns just happened to be the tool in this instance. The elites do not want to stop inner city black on black violence, and the other largest component of "Gun Violence" are SUICIDES.

Why do you cling on to something that has had its day and now it is time to give it up. We aren't a bunch of colonists in a lawless land.

Put guns in the hands of the "PEOPLE VIOLENCE" and what do you get? Dead people.
Take the gun away and what do you have? Live people. Simple equation.
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Old Today, 01:35 PM
 
6,538 posts, read 1,587,592 times
Reputation: 4734
Quote:
Originally Posted by kitty61 View Post
Why do you cling on to something that has had its day and now it is time to give it up. We aren't a bunch of colonists in a lawless land.

Put guns in the hands of the "PEOPLE VIOLENCE" and what do you get? Dead people.
Take the gun away and what do you have? Live people. Simple equation.
Take the guns out of peoples hands....and you end up with SUBJECTS, not citizens!!


Plus, if you take the guns out of their hands, very good chance we would see another 'tool' being used to rack up the body count, like others have said, in the UK, knife attacks are becoming common...do you see a trend?


More people need to realize they are being duped over these mass shootings, public health and safety has been the disguise/deception, used to regulate, ban a few other things too, problem is, thats NOT the real reason, drug laws are a GREAT example, Govt tells us they are to protect public health and safety...but in reality, they were created as a tool of racism, to control a few specific races...they had nothing to do with protecting public health and safety, that was just a cover, a deception.


You have to look at who stands to benefit from increased laws, regulations, with the drug laws, the criminal organizations, law enforcement, prisons, etc benefit and/or profit.
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Old Today, 11:29 PM
 
4,434 posts, read 5,325,669 times
Reputation: 4496
Quote:
Originally Posted by kitty61 View Post
Why do you cling on to something that has had its day and now it is time to give it up. We aren't a bunch of colonists in a lawless land.

Put guns in the hands of the "PEOPLE VIOLENCE" and what do you get? Dead people.
Take the gun away and what do you have? Live people. Simple equation.
Youíre kidding, right? So you think removing a constitutional amendment and disarming legal citizens will be a good thing? Thatís about the dumbest thing Iíve ever heard. Criminals donít care about laws - thatís why theyíre criminals - and murder is already illegal, why hasnít that stopped murders?! Because again CRIMINALS donít care about laws! So all youíd be doing is disarming the good guys so you could make for easier targets when gangsters and other evildoers pull a gun, of which there will always be many floating around.
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