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Old 01-19-2009, 06:20 PM
 
Location: Bradenton, Florida
27,236 posts, read 40,273,555 times
Reputation: 10915

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tin Knocker View Post
What should have happened is the PEOPLE should not have tolerated it. The real question is where were the police? Why werent those fellows surrounded by local law enforcement, disarmed & held for trial.
Your words, not mine.

 
Old 01-19-2009, 08:04 PM
 
Location: Northglenn, Colorado
3,689 posts, read 9,253,000 times
Reputation: 944
Quote:
Originally Posted by ParkTwain View Post
Your modern-day squirrel guns versus microwave antipersonnel weapons. Good luck!
The insurgents in Afghanistan and Iraq have done a pretty damn good job at holding the largest military force in the world at bay until now. Civilians held that military force at bay in Vietnam until politics played its course and the military force had chosen to remove itself from the conflict. A world super power was defeated after spending itself into oblivion in Afghanistan trying to keep a foot hold. Wow, easily squashed they were not. There is always a mouse to the elephant. The people will always have the power unless disarmed.


the microwave weapons are NON-LETHAL, and have a relatively short range. They can be taken out very easily at range with a simple hunting rifle. there are very few in the field due to them being so new. If you want them to be effective, you would have to remove guns from citizens and force them to take up bat and club.

Last edited by Noahma; 01-19-2009 at 08:14 PM..
 
Old 01-20-2009, 02:40 AM
 
113 posts, read 154,481 times
Reputation: 64
Default Delusions

Quote:
Originally Posted by monkeywrenching View Post
if you want to scrap the Constitution, then scrapping the federal goverment would also be the obvious choice to follow right behind scrapping the Constitution.
That's exactly what this man TKramar is proposing, Mr. moneywrenching. I believe it's called anarchy, right? We all know how well that has worked throughout history.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TKramar View Post
Kent State. Those were Guardsmen, granted, but we haven't had active duty military on point anywhere within our borders. I'll bet that they would have willingly shot people down in New Orleans too.
You apply one instance of someone making a stupid nervous decision to all American soldiers all the time? You are amazingly silly and delusional or perhaps you just like to bait us all, yes?

Quote:
Originally Posted by TKramar View Post
Did I say I want them to have guns? I want to put the genie back into the bottle, so that the meek inherit the earth. Sensible people will eventually choose to eliminate offensive weapons entirely.

And the POLICE you seem to count on are a PART of the government--do you really expect them to do anything against them?
First of all, your dreamland ideal world, populated by happy carefree sheeple, is completely delusional (again...), and completely unlikely, as you well know in your heart. Unless, as I've said several times, you are quite delusional.

You will also note, perhaps, that events such as the unjustified attack by the FBI and other government agencies against The Branch Davidians was more than covered in the news. This self-examination and subsequent correction is one of the wonders, to me, of our form of Republican Government (not the party but the actual type of government here in the US; an elected representative Republic, under strict control by laws, not votes, not dictators or monarchs). It certainly is not done this way anywhere else on Earth, sadly.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ParkTwain View Post
Your modern-day squirrel guns versus microwave antipersonnel weapons. Good luck!
Actually, my husband has a very very accurate high powered scoped sniper rifle that he can and haas demonstrated to myself and others his ability to hit things well over 1000 yards away with it. Even if he's then "taken out" by a burst from an M1 Abrams tank, if he's already taken out 10 or 15 innocent cannon-fodder kids who have been illegally ordered to "take that farm house!", the psychological effect on those kids will be devastating as time rolls on. You don't agree? That's delusional.

It's been pointed out many times on this same thread that Vietnam, Afghanistan, Iraq and America (in the revolutionary war with Britain), that a dedicated armed homeland citizenry, seeing their liberties and lifestyle under direct threat, will take on any force no matter how technically advanced it might be. "Give me freedom or give me death" pulses through their hearts and minds, and they don't give a d@mn about the possibility of their own dying. In the meantime, the opposition's individuals are dying like flies and not much liking it. If you couple this with those oppressors being fellow citizens, to assume they would continue a murderous war of oppression on their own countrymen is, well, again, delusional.

The final vote is in for all to see: thinking that an armed citizenry would be quickly and easily and legally "wiped away" by our nation's own clearly illegal actions (Posse Comitatus - read it in Wiki!) is way more than just a little delusional!

Posse Comitatus Act - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
 
Old 01-20-2009, 02:58 AM
 
Location: Bradenton, Florida
27,236 posts, read 40,273,555 times
Reputation: 10915
I'm willing to pop my head back up after the fallout. When all the people who would kill another are wiped from the planet.
 
Old 01-20-2009, 04:35 AM
 
Location: somewhere in the woods
16,886 posts, read 12,541,451 times
Reputation: 5210
Quote:
Originally Posted by TKramar View Post
I'm willing to pop my head back up after the fallout. When all the people who would kill another are wiped from the planet.

the goverment is more likely to kill countries off, not armed citizens. we just take care of ourselves, so if your kind is not even willing to lend a hand to get the job done, then dont come to us looking for a handout when it is over.
 
Old 01-20-2009, 07:20 AM
 
Location: In a house
5,230 posts, read 7,321,196 times
Reputation: 2558
Quote:
Originally Posted by TKramar View Post
Your words, not mine.
You fail to comprehend the simplest of things. The police are of the people in a very real way.
 
Old 01-20-2009, 07:22 AM
 
Location: Londonderry, NH
41,505 posts, read 49,557,510 times
Reputation: 24548
thotful1 - I was involved in a war against a technically unarmed people that fought back with a great deal of determination. No matter how effective we were at thinning the herd they kept coming back and thinning us. After a while we left. I have never been able to find a reason for the war in Vietnam but I did develop a profound respect for the Vietnamese and more than a little contempt for the financiers that sent us there.

The only war I can think of where an invading army defeated an armed people was the US Civil War. The Union Army eventually crushed the well armed Confederacy despite the fact every civilian had a firearm because much of the southern population that could have effectively fought the Union army were deliberately unarmed slaves. It proved impossible to defeat the Union or launch an effective guerrilla war because the slaves still had to be repressed. As we know the rebellion was crushed under the weight of the increasingly well supplied Union Army fighting an increasingly undersupplied Confederate Army and a starving southern population. So the Union won despite the prevalence of civilian firearms in the South.

I am a firm believer in an armed, trained, ready and willing civilian population’s ability to defend their turf and not incidentally defend themselves against criminal assault. I think everyone that considers themselves a free citizen should have received firearms training in high school and should carry a concealed firearm where ever they deem necessary.
 
Old 01-20-2009, 07:23 AM
 
Location: In a house
5,230 posts, read 7,321,196 times
Reputation: 2558
Quote:
Originally Posted by TKramar View Post
I'm willing to pop my head back up after the fallout. When all the people who would kill another are wiped from the planet.
Nah, given your propensity of jumping into things you are totally uninformed, ignorant & apparently incapable of understanding I imagine you'll be one of the first to go.
 
Old 01-20-2009, 12:17 PM
 
Location: Bradenton, Florida
27,236 posts, read 40,273,555 times
Reputation: 10915
I know how to keep my head down. Something you might look into.
 
Old 01-20-2009, 12:19 PM
 
Location: Bradenton, Florida
27,236 posts, read 40,273,555 times
Reputation: 10915
Quote:
Originally Posted by monkeywrenching View Post
the goverment is more likely to kill countries off, not armed citizens. we just take care of ourselves, so if your kind is not even willing to lend a hand to get the job done, then dont come to us looking for a handout when it is over.
we'll be the only ones left.
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