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Old 09-12-2008, 09:17 PM
 
Location: Texas
433 posts, read 390,022 times
Reputation: 136

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Quote:
Originally Posted by normie View Post
It's true, the confusion over what you consider your "real" home isn't just for college students.

You can't make life difficult for people just because they have more than one home.

I think they do in fact make it difficult........
My folks were full time RVers home based in Texas. No actual property, just a mail address at my brothers. Then they filed their taxes with a return address at my house in Arizona. Took 3 years to finally convince Arizona they owed no income tax to Arizona for that year. Seems that Arizona considered you resident for the full year if you were in state for more than 180 day at any time- not consecutive days. Texas (where I now live) will cite you for a license violation (drivers or vehicle) if you've been working in the state for >30 days. Crazy rules

 
Old 09-12-2008, 10:45 PM
 
Location: Ohio
18,013 posts, read 13,243,316 times
Reputation: 13797
Quote:
Originally Posted by normie View Post
Do you think college students should be allowed to vote? Why, or why not?
Of course they should be allowed to vote, an amendment to the Constitution says they can.

Quote:
Originally Posted by normie View Post
Should college students' votes be assigned to their address prior to starting school?
It should be assigned to their home of residence. That is, they should vote by absentee ballot if they cannot arrange to be at their home of residence.

Quote:
Originally Posted by normie View Post
And how would this be done?
A simple software change to add a field or make use of a field not currently used in either the driver's license database or voter registration database.

Quote:
Originally Posted by normie View Post
Should the rule be that students who live off campus can vote, but those living in a dorm cannot?
No, that would violate amendments to the Constitution.

Quote:
Originally Posted by normie View Post
Should students be allowed to vote in national elections, but not local elections?
They can vote by absentee ballot for local elections in their home of residence.

Quote:
Originally Posted by normie View Post
For purposes of disclosure, I'm active in voter registration and think registering out-of-state college students is a brilliant strategy. But I'm more interested in hearing what other people think--so it may be a while before I step in to present my POV.
If I would be you, I'd be calling the state penitentiaries to find out if any of them have internet so you can still participate on this forum while you do your prison time.

You do realize you're committing voter fraud, right?

I know I've said this a dozen times, but it isn't enough to read the law. You need to use a source like Anderson's On-Line that will show you two things: first, if the law's been amended or modified in any way; and secondly, it will cite all relevant related laws, so that you don't over-look laws that over-lap or conflict. After that you have to do case law research to see if the issue has appeared before a court and if so, how the court interpreted relevant sections of the law.

Where there is no case law and the issue appears to be in the gray area, then you'd want to contact the appropriate state agencies, such as Attorneys General or Secretaries of State for a written opinion on the matter (that's what they do -- FTC staff attorneys used to provide written opinions on the Fair Debt Collection Practices Act and the Fair Credit Reporting Act until a sufficient body of case law was developed to interpret the statutes and they stopped issuing opinions around 2001 or so).

States treat out-of-state students differently that non-students who enter the state.

As far as states are concerned, if you come as a student, you are not a resident of the state.

"But I've been here 30 days and I have a driver's license." Doesn't matter. As far as the state is concerned, you are an out-of-state student seeking an education and therefore you are not a resident.

"But I have a job and live off-campus." Doesn't matter. As far as the state is concerned, you're an out-of-state student and not a resident of the state.

Is there a time when you would not be considered an out-of-state student and therefore eligible for residency? Sure, when you reach the age of 23 or if you can prove no one has claimed you as a dependent on their state or federal income tax returns for at least 3 years.

So, e-mail or phone the state prisons and that way when you get caught you can cooperate with the District Attorney and maybe get sent to a prison that allows you to use the internet.
 
Old 09-13-2008, 11:23 AM
 
Location: Home is where the heart is
15,400 posts, read 25,256,409 times
Reputation: 18984
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mircea View Post
If I would be you, I'd be calling the state penitentiaries to find out if any of them have internet so you can still participate on this forum while you do your prison time.

You do realize you're committing voter fraud, right?
LOL, ummm, no I don't think so. Maybe you don't realize what voter registration volunteers do. We sit at a table and hand out forms to people who ask for them. When we're not at the tables we leave the forms in a stack, so they can help themselves. The bottom line is the only possible crime we could be accused of might be littering.

If people want to discuss the election and if we're not swamped, I often do. This is a free country, so guess what--we have a right to talk to people in a public area, just like we have the right to talk about politics on an internet forum.

They don't send you to the state penitentiary for that--but if you're really concerned, this morning I'm at a table near the Reston Library, which happens to be right next to the Reston Police Station. Feel free to call the police and ask to have me arrested. They'll get mad at you for trying to intimidate a volunteer.

By the way, I do not appreciate your threatening tone--that's prohibited in this forum. And if you're going to make accusations that I'm engaged in illegal activity, you need to back up that allegation with something a little more solid than legal-sounding mumbo jumbo. Show us evidence. Provide a link that proves voter registraton volunteers are breaking the law.

Last edited by normie; 09-13-2008 at 11:48 AM..
 
Old 09-13-2008, 11:39 AM
 
Location: Foot of the Rockies
84,967 posts, read 98,814,535 times
Reputation: 31381
http://www.dos.state.pa.us/voting/lib/voting/guide/student_voting_guide_05.pdf (broken link)

College Students Vote (http://www.sos.state.ia.us/elections/voterreg/collegestudentsvote.html - broken link)

Keeping Students Away from the Polls - The Board - Editorials - Opinion - New York Times Blog

Minnesota Office of the Secretary of State - Absentee Voting Within the U.S.

Above are a few websites that contradict what some have been saying, that college students can't vote in their college town.

I have filled out the Colorado residency form several times, and I don't remember if they ask you where you are registered to vote. I believe they may ask students under 23 where their parents are registered. In any event, this would not be an issue for an in-state student registering in their college town instead of their hometown, nor would it be an issue for a student at a private college.
 
Old 09-13-2008, 02:44 PM
 
Location: God's Country, Maine
2,052 posts, read 3,974,482 times
Reputation: 1295
Quote:
Originally Posted by MICoastieMom View Post
As a first-time voter for McGovern who voted in my first election (primary) when I was only 17, I am appalled that anyone would be so devious as to suggest, much less to attempt to control the outcome of an election through the 18-21 vote. Sounds rather reminiscent of the Jim Crow laws to prevent blacks from voting. The Constitution provides 18-20 year olds the right to vote. Period. To put any conditions or restrictions that single them out essentially is an attempt to disenfranchise them, and is highly un-American in my opinion. How about you also try to impose conditions on the 19th amendment as well, instructing women to vote the same as their husband or closest male relative? Good grief!
The argument has little to do with the Constitutional right to vote.

A couple of years ago in Maine, our Legislators introduced a bill that would make the college students vote in their home states. It failed. They are well within their rights to manage residency status.

The reasoning is that they are, for the most part, perpetuating a swollen liberal minded big government attitude, by voting for candidates that we are trying to resist at the local, state and national levels.

There has been a lot of controversy over this and I expect another shot at it. The practice represents fraud and corruption in the way we elect our candidates. Very few of them have any sense of the political landscape, other than what they are being hand fed by the University establishment.
 
Old 09-13-2008, 03:22 PM
 
2,180 posts, read 3,187,506 times
Reputation: 838
Quote:
Originally Posted by dmyankee View Post
Very few of them have any sense of the political landscape, other than what they are being hand fed by the University establishment.
I believe that if we establish "sense of the political landscape" as the criterion by which one is entitled to vote in any given jurisdiction, then the number of people who would be permitted to vote will be severely diminished, dmyankee.

If I am not mistaken, the courts have rejected the notion of voter tests as determinants for voting rights, so I don't really see how your argument applies.

However, above and beyond your stance that they should not be permitted to vote due to ignorance of the issues, there is your claim that what sense they have is only what "hey are being hand fed by the University establishment."

1) Do you have any evidence to support that assertion?

2) Even if your assertion is the case, is that any different from anybody else with single stream sources of news, whether the local newspaper or a particular television channel they watch or the person who votes based on what a spouse or parent has told them? Should those people, too, be denied the voting 'privilege?'

3) What colleges do you know that recommend to their students how to vote in local or even state and national elections? I know of a few workplaces that do that and some churches, but not colleges.

a) Should those who are influenced by their churches or workplaces be disallowed?

b) Do you have evidence of colleges engaging in such a practice?

c) Ever notice how well adolescents respond to being told what to do by the authority figures in their lives?
 
Old 09-13-2008, 06:21 PM
 
Location: Home is where the heart is
15,400 posts, read 25,256,409 times
Reputation: 18984
Quote:
Originally Posted by jps-teacher View Post
Even if your assertion is the case, is that any different from anybody else with single stream sources of news, whether the local newspaper or a particular television channel they watch or the person who votes based on what a spouse or parent has told them? Should those people, too, be denied the voting 'privilege?'
Beautifully stated. I hadn't thought about it much, but it's true that some churches are trying to influence their flock. I still receive e-mails from a church I belonged to in California more than a decade ago. They like to organize prayer groups, usually for a member who has cancer or for storm victims or something like that. This year they've asked people to pray for one of the candidates (and believe me, there's some pretty emotional baloney written in these e-mails).

BTW, just because a church asks you to do something doesn't mean you will. And it doesn't mean you have to make a big scene about denouncing them, either. You can simply ignore e-mails. I do it all the time.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jps-teacher View Post
Ever notice how well adolescents respond to being told what to do by the authority figures in their lives?
LOL, so true, so true. And it's not just the adolescents who respond that way! I'm like that too--if somebody tries to manipulate me, it only strengthens my resolve to trust my own judgement and follow my own point of view.

Earlier today somebody tried to manipulate me by suggesting I would be picked up by the DA and sent to the state penitentiary. You know, for the horrible crime of volunteering at a voter registration table.

I guess I was supposed to get scared, but instead I got offended--and then I got energized. And now I'm even a little bit in love with the idea. I'm 73 years old and walk with a cane. I have lymphoma and diabetes and nothing much to lose. I'm cute--the reporters would treat me like their grandma. So c'mon, haul me off to the state pen! I would be such a poster child for getting people to care about their right to vote.

Why not, we've had every other cliche, why not a sweet little old lady hauled off for registering voters? I would be on all the news stations. I'm soft spoken, but intelligent and (IMO) good at making speeches. I have a sterling record of community service going back to the 1970's. I have friends in the media. Oh my, I would get more attention than Palin and Obama combined!

Ok, OK my point is not that I really think this would happen. My point is: I'm not reacting in the way that poster expected. And the same thing applies to college students. They're old enough and wise enough to think for themselves, and that's exactly what they'll do.

Last edited by normie; 09-13-2008 at 06:31 PM..
 
Old 09-13-2008, 06:26 PM
 
Location: Home is where the heart is
15,400 posts, read 25,256,409 times
Reputation: 18984
BTW, I'd also like to point out that you can't predict how people who pick up voter registration cards are going to vote. I'm sure there are plenty of young republicans who pretend to be democrats (and vice versa) just for the fun of thinking they fooled a little old lady. And more imprtantly, people change their minds.
 
Old 04-18-2014, 03:51 PM
 
Location: The New England part of Ohio
17,572 posts, read 21,756,199 times
Reputation: 44352
Quote:
Originally Posted by normie View Post
Two points before we get started on this discussion:

1. College enrollment is at an all time high. As a result, a historic number of students from New England, New York, and California (blue states) have not been accepted to schools near their homes and instead have gone to schools in the south and the midwest (often red states).

2. The electoral vote will decide this election, not the popular vote.

As a result: One strategy during this election has been to appeal to "out-of- state" students, telling them they have the power to turn their new state purple.

My question: Since these students are temporary (4-year) residents, do you think this is
a) a smart strategy, or
b) an abuse of the electoral system
c) a waste of time because college students don't vote, anyway

More questions behind the question:

Do you think college students should be allowed to vote? Why, or why not?

Should college students' votes be assigned to their address prior to starting school? And how would this be done?

Should the rule be that students who live off campus can vote, but those living in a dorm cannot?

Should students be allowed to vote in national elections, but not local elections?

For purposes of disclosure, I'm active in voter registration and think registering out-of-state college students is a brilliant strategy. But I'm more interested in hearing what other people think--so it may be a while before I step in to present my POV.

"Should College students be allowed to vote?"

If the college student is over 18, that is the law of the land.

My first vote was as a college student. However, I was out of state and I voted via absentee ballot. My permanent domicile was with my parents. A dormitory is not a permanent residence.

However, many upper division and graduate students maintain their own apartments and do not go home every Summer. In that case, I think it should be up to the student in question to choose one place where they call home.
 
Old 04-18-2014, 07:36 PM
 
48,519 posts, read 81,030,761 times
Reputation: 17978
If of age they can vote in their home states like any other person away temporarily. no different than military really.
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