U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Happy Easter!
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Great Debates
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 01-08-2009, 11:40 AM
 
Location: West Texas
2,441 posts, read 5,246,318 times
Reputation: 3094

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tricky D View Post
I guess that makes sense, but isn't your picking and choosing not a logical result of a 2-party system?
In my opinion a 2-party system can only polarise the population.
Absolutely. And those that are farther left or right are quicker to label others who don't entirely agree with them. People think I'm "conservative"
because of my views. I am anti-gay politics (don't dislike gays, disapprove of the behavior, but understand people are different), pro-military, pro-gun rights, and anti-abuse of social programs. Those are all considered conservative values. But I am also pro-life, pro-stem cell research, pro-separation of church and state. Those are mostly liberal views. So, it depends on who I disagree with in the forums how I get labeled! LOL

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tricky D View Post
BTW is there a fundamental difference in how Liberals and Conservatives interpret your Constitution (besides their own political philosophy)?
From what I can tell (and this is only my opinion, you'll get plenty of rebuttal after I post, I'm sure), the conservatives interpret the Constitution in a way that provides for all people as a whole. This tends to overlook the individual freedoms and rights liberals fight for. Additionally, I've noticed that conservatives try to make the Constitution apply to the masses as a whole. This means that minorities (whether ethnic-based, sex-based, religously-based, etc.) get less say because they'll always be out-voted by the "majority" - which is Christian or conservative, although I think that demographic ratio is changing. In this case, often the individual (or the few) suffer for the benefit of the majority.

Liberals, on the other hand, seem to place individual freedoms above what is best for everyone (legalizing drugs is a good example). They interpret things to their benefit, or the benefit of each person as an individual. "Norms" and "society" don't hold as much value to them. In this case, often the majority suffers so the few (or individual) is happy.

Is either one more right than the other? Hard to say. I guess that's open to an individual's perspective.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 01-08-2009, 12:07 PM
 
Location: The Netherlands
8,567 posts, read 14,518,646 times
Reputation: 1573
Originally Posted by Rathagos
Quote:
So, it depends on who I disagree with in the forums how I get labeled! LOL
I can relate.
Many Christians ( and atheists) on the religion board can't really tell if I'm a theist or not, but this is because I simply don't care if I am or not.
I only know that although I do agree with Jesus' philosophy, I don't believe that he is God.

Quote:
Is either one more right than the other? Hard to say. I guess that's open to an individual's perspective.
I think it is in the balance of these 2.
And this makes politics very complicated because although a group consists out of individuals, the individual is not more important than the group, nor is a group more important than the individual; although there are exceptions.
One exception is that I don't believe that some criminals (like serial predators) should have the fundamental basic right to return to society.
And because I don't believe that we can't ‘cure’ and / or rehabilitate everyone, most of my countrymen brand me a 'fascist' because in such cases I'm not against the death penalty.
So I guess I'm not a good Dutch dude.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-08-2009, 04:41 PM
 
613 posts, read 1,154,123 times
Reputation: 187
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tricky D View Post
Originally Posted by allah truth LoL, you Americans pride yourself on the fact that you donate so much to good causes but according to 1 of your own American institutes, the Center for Global Development, it is the Dutch people who donate the most to charity around the world.
For the 4th year in a row.
The US isn't even in the top 10.

Source: Center for Global Development : Initiatives: Active: Commitment to Development Index 2008: Commitment to Development Index
That's who gives the most percent of what they make. in actuality America is by far the leader.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-08-2009, 04:46 PM
 
Location: Exit 14C
1,555 posts, read 3,637,871 times
Reputation: 390
Quote:
Originally Posted by Angel079 View Post
Based of several articles I was reading today, I got wondering "what makes an American the "TRUE" American or a "GOOD" American"?

What would be the characteristics you'd say "that's totally American?"
I don't think I've ever used the phrases "good American" or "true American" by my own choice. I wouldn't be comfortable with anything making someone an American besides being a resident of America.
Quote:
So I figured I'd googel what the immigration officers do to determine who'd get citizenship in our country and who doesn't and came across this test on the link below
I've been through the immigration process with a few people. Unless they've changed something, you don't have to pass any test to become a legal resident. You only have to meet some portion of a set of rudimentary requirements, which I wouldn't call a "test" or in any way evaluative of whether someone "should really be an American". To become a citizen, you have to learn some rudimentary facts about US history and the structure of the government. The test you linked to looks very similar to the rudimentary facts you had to learn previously.

Personally, I'm against immigration laws. I think people should be able to live anywhere in the world that they'd like to live without any hassle about it.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-10-2009, 06:43 AM
 
Location: The Netherlands
8,567 posts, read 14,518,646 times
Reputation: 1573
Originally Posted by allah truth
Quote:
That's who gives the most percent of what they make. in actuality America is by far the leader.
LoL, you accused us of not doing anything which I've proven to be false.
Besidez, there are many more Americans than there are Dutch so how come America isn’t even in the top 10 in that list?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-10-2009, 11:50 AM
 
Location: Pinal County, Arizona
25,107 posts, read 34,366,957 times
Reputation: 4893
A good American is self reliant - not looking to government for a handout.

A good American takes care of their family

A good American gives of their time to help others (time is more important than money)

A good American gets involved with their community and offering to give back

A good American registers to vote - and then takes the time to become knowledgeable about the issues and candidates - and then votes
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-19-2009, 06:10 PM
 
Location: Crossville TN
179 posts, read 497,354 times
Reputation: 50
First of sorry for not having returned in so long (moved).

I have to say reading all 3 Pages in one is bottom line simply inspiring to me and at times it makes me stop and think / consider. I really love the way this thread is going!!!

And no this is not been placed in reg to immigrants! If you want to get real technical here, we are all immigrants or at least our relatives have been at some time and points, unless you're also from Indian tribe somewhere here.
As for the test this is how I understood it (see here http://www.uscis.gov/files/pressrele...st_27sep07.pdf)

Did you notice thou, a lot things said have less to do with our country or being American then simply more along the lines of "what makes a good person".

Having moved around the world few times, I gotta say one of the things I love the most coming back right now (apart from the food places lol) is the respect for diversity here at home, rather then "needing to fit in a box".

I apologize I have to run for now, but promise to be back online soon.

As for our involvements and aid around the globe, I pers think we all should work (incl our Govt) in our own backyards for a change right now and then when all is said & done, then go past our borders.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-19-2009, 06:19 PM
 
1,115 posts, read 2,792,171 times
Reputation: 594
A good American weighs at least 230 pounds......

Haha, sorry I couldn't resist. I could write a lot more like that but i'll hold back.

Really though. There are so many different kinds of Americans. There is too much diversity in this country to say what it means to be an "American". In America you can be anything, and you don't have to be anything in particular, that's the beauty of it.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-19-2009, 10:01 PM
 
Location: somewhere in the woods
16,886 posts, read 12,541,451 times
Reputation: 5210
Quote:
Originally Posted by Angel079 View Post
Based of several articles I was reading today, I got wondering "what makes an American the "TRUE" American or a "GOOD" American"?

What would be the characteristics you'd say "that's totally American?"

So I figured I'd googel what the immigration officers do to determine who'd get citizenship in our country and who doesn't and came across this test on the link below - Up til then I actually considered myself fairly smart, well paying job after graduating collage etc - But if these listed question's are what makes someone a good citizen or not- I'd def better find a new home quick

So I just wanna know what you all think?

Questions and Answers for New Naturalization Test

did not look at the test, but am going by just your title question.

a good american is someone who holds true to the founding fathers principles come hell or highwater.

too bad there is only 1 politician in washington dc that understands that.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-20-2009, 09:20 AM
 
Location: Victoria TX
42,668 posts, read 71,556,197 times
Reputation: 35864
There is no such thing as a "good American" or a "bad American". All Americans alike have a sense of what is best for their own interest and, to varying degrees, the interests of their fellow Americans. Those interests are interlinked, and no individual can flourish without the cohesion of the nation as a whole. However, no two people are the same, and there are many diverse views on what is best for America. You cannot say that "good Americans" subscribe to a certain view of what is good for America.

Americans did not invent the concept of patriotism. It is hard-wired into every human being since the beginning of our species, because social organization is not possible without every member possessing a sense of the survival and the best interests of the group.

If you wish to insist that there is such a thing as a "good American", you must also be prepared to acknowledge that there is such a thing as a good Latvian, or a good Iranian or a good Basque, as opposed to bad ones. Are the good Basques the ones who favor a sovereign nation, or the ones who believe the best interests of their fellow Basques is to live under the umbrella of a greater Spain? Is a "good American" one who believes we ought to be kicking butt in Iraq, or one who believes we have no business being there? Both are expressing a sentiment based on what is best for America, so both are equally good Americans.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:

Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Great Debates
Follow City-Data.com founder on our Forum or

All times are GMT -6.

2005-2018, Advameg, Inc.

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35 - Top