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Before I could even begin to address what you've said, I'd have to explain certain things to you so that you would understand where I'm coming from. In brief, I don't believe Christianity is about following rules and regulations. There are too many different denominations of Christianity that differ from one another, so when you reference a "religion that says don't do this or that", it really is immaterial, because certain "rules and regulations" don't apply to all "brands" of Christianity. One particular denomination may feel something is right/wrong, while a different denomination believes the opposite.
I'm NOT a fundamentalist Christian. So naturally I will believe differently than one.
To be Christian by definition you have to follow the rules and regulations layed down by Christ. If you don't follow those rules your not Christian. Period.
Any denomination that doesn't follow Christs "rules and regulations" is not Christian.Period.
You can debate everything else in the Bible and still be christian but not Christ teachings. Its his teachings that make you Christian.
By your standards I could call myself Christian, after all the only parts of the bible I disagree with are the Books between and including Genesis and Revelations.
As far as what causes homosexuality, what difference does it make? Homosexuals are homosexuals. Nature or nurture doesn't change a thing.
hmm i think to say "you choose to be gay" is kinda like saying to most people here " you choose to be straight". unless of course you argue that everyone is naturally straight and they "choose" to be gay..
an important thing though to consider is our genetics and nurture. (or nature and nurture). do you choose to like the taste of apples? do you choose to like women? or do you just, like women??? it semms though that a very important part that helps decide, is our growing up. its not a lie that many gay men had bad relationships wiht thier dad (not all but alot). could this be a factor. im sorry i dont have time so i cant get into it all right now.
but i can understand the "anti-gay setiment". its not so much a feeling of being against gays, but rather the culture and life sorounding it. aids spread fast among the gay community for a number of reasons. large amounts of unprotected sex, mutliple sex partners and so on. also drug use was famous in the gay community.
it therefore represented everything a good wholesome family was for. not saying i support it, just i understand where they are coming from
No, far from it, and simplistic and naive as well. I also don't believe in fairies, ogres, dragons, ghosts, witches, elves or any other supernatural beings. If I did decide to "worship" some make-believe beings I would choose "Zeus and the Gang". All this still begs the question that when you can only reply with "religion" you leave out everyone who doesn't subscribe to your particular belief-system. Ergo, end of discussion.
But i havent replied 'with only my religion' and in fact, sometimes i havent even brought up God when showing the danger and deviant behaviour behind practicing homosexuality. Im glad you dont believe in the tooth fairy to elves stories ...but you are able to recognize design and engineering I would assume. If you a interested in the weightier issues of life and if your Will allows, then take a look at the razor edge precise parameters of design and engineering to our personal Universe . Any open minded rational person who doesnt have an apriori-philosophical bias and ulterior motives , would agree it wasnt designed by materials and raw chemicals left over from a gigantic explosion . Are you ok for a personal moral Theistic Creator existing , or, would this offer some rather difficult implications to your life ? By the way, your chosen way of Humanism is a religion also. In fact, we all have some sort of 'a religion' (generic sense) we follow in life.
To be Christian by definition you have to follow the rules and regulations layed down by Christ. If you don't follow those rules your not Christian. Period.
Any denomination that doesn't follow Christs "rules and regulations" is not Christian.Period.
You can debate everything else in the Bible and still be christian but not Christ teachings. Its his teachings that make you Christian.
By your standards I could call myself Christian, after all the only parts of the bible I disagree with are the Books between and including Genesis and Revelations.
As far as what causes homosexuality, what difference does it make? Homosexuals are homosexuals. Nature or nurture doesn't change a thing.
1. First and foremost and most essential, you are only a Christian if you have specifically realized you are a Sin practicing person, you recognize youre need for a personal Saviour , you accept the free gift of having complete forgiveness instituted thru Gods plan of Christ dying for you on the cross to bridge you to God, are sincerely willing to surrender your life and live for God with his power, and there being evidence that a drastic change has taken place as a result of this conversion. This is called The Born Again experience . Unless this has taken place...then reading the Bible, going to church, giving to United Way, or even believing in God...is not enough.
2. To answer your last question, it makes a huge difference both in this life and when you give accountability to God in the end. Homosexuality is not 'a nature experience' ; going for a walk in the woods, is. Homosexuality like every other action we take , is a choice. No one MAKES you do it. Some things are deeply engrained in us however, but nothing that is too impossible to overcome as many can testify to.
My posts are in blue because I don't have the energy to expend constantly breaking down your faulty arguments through typing out all the open/close tags.
Thanks for your responses. The act of making love is also a physical act and when it touches fecal matter in the rearend , fecal matter becomes part of the love making process. I know if you give it a try, youll agree with me . As for the rest of your answers, they are only your opinion which is based not on objectivity but rather an apriori-philosophical bias which helps justify what you want to do regardless. As for the final response..you do have a sickness im afraid but until you realize that and want to get help to overcome it, youll seek ways and people to justify your lifestyle which youve become well acquainted with that is offering some degree of comfort and satisfaction. Everyone at the center of their heart, instinctively knows the acts of homosexuality are wrong but the nature of mankind is such that we suppress what we know is wrong so we can be the ultimate Decider . Regards.
I can debate god with you all day but ultimately it between the person and god ..The last time i read my bible i didn't see the passage where anyone had to check with you or anyone else for that matter...you talk about the bible how about mat chap 22 ver 34-44 love God With all your heart and love your neighbor as yourself... maybe you should read mat chap 5 ver 43-48 don't hate your enemys pray for them ... but then again you remind me of mat chap 7 ver 15 watch out for false prophets they come in sheeps clothing but inwardly are ferocious wolves....or ver 21 when folks like you say lord lord i have done these works in your name can i enter the kingdom of heaven and jesus said i never knew you.. you may better read also mat chap 7 ver 1 JUDGE NOT LEAST YE BE JUDGED.. or mat chap 23 ver 25 woe to the so called teachers of law they clean the outside the cup but the inside is full of self indulgence and greed.. you sir have no idea yourself what Jesus Christ wants with us his servants i suggest more bible study and prayer then you will really see who the great man jesus was.. Jesus died for EVERYONE.... not just a select few...
I can debate god with you all day but ultimately it between the person and god ..The last time i read my bible i didn't see the passage where anyone had to check with you or anyone else for that matter...you talk about the bible how about mat chap 22 ver 34-44 love God With all your heart and love your neighbor as yourself... maybe you should read mat chap 5 ver 43-48 don't hate your enemys pray for them ... but then again you remind me of mat chap 7 ver 15 watch out for false prophets they come in sheeps clothing but inwardly are ferocious wolves....or ver 21 when folks like you say lord lord i have done these works in your name can i enter the kingdom of heaven and jesus said i never knew you.. you may better read also mat chap 7 ver 1 JUDGE NOT LEAST YE BE JUDGED.. or mat chap 23 ver 25 woe to the so called teachers of law they clean the outside the cup but the inside is full of self indulgence and greed.. you sir have no idea yourself what Jesus Christ wants with us his servants i suggest more bible study and prayer then you will really see who the great man jesus was.. Jesus died for EVERYONE.... not just a select few...
Im pleased to see you can quote a few bible verses. However, the Bible nor God requires Christians to be tolerant of wrong lifestyles and sexual immorality. In fact, the Bible says we should expose them while trying to make people see the error of their poor choices . It is true Jesus died for everyone incl. the homosexual...which is why everyone incl. the homosexual needs to apply the substititionary death of Christ toward oneself and turn from their pattern of lifestyle sin . It depends on two things : First that youre willing to turn from your sin and depend on the free gift of Christ thru his atonement on your behalf, then secondly, to rely on Gods power and wisdom to help you stay on the right track thru making your life a sacrifice for him . God has provided many sources for you to get the wisdom from professionally trained counsellors in homosexuality and he is willing to give you the power to overcome . You already know instrinsically that running to the arms of another man isnt correct or healthy for you ; that should be reserved for God alone. It is now your choice to either make a definitive move to get beyond homosexuality , or, to keep on suppressing your moral conscience that it is wrong and to keep seeking others to support you who think its great or who are engulfed in apathy and could care less. Thank you, and i hope you will choose the former method. Regards.
I believe it is a choice, enacted out of a desire to free oneself of a bad situation (sub-conscious) where an individual knows a person or family member would disapprove, and would break relations based on homosexual behavior; or, to draw attention (positive or negative) where the individual otherwise has lived a life without the desired attention... "look at me... look at me.. look at me!!"
Religion, in my opinion, plays no role in this whatsoever. There was homosexuality before Christianity. Therefore, to try to put it into religous context holds no water.
I have heard the argument that there are animals that conduct in homosexual activities. Just out of curiosity, what are they? And what behavior do they demonstrate through homosexuality? Is it because they are attracted to the same sex of species? I know dogs that will "hump" other dogs, but that does not portray a transferrence of affection, it's a domination behavior. Since there are only a handful of species on Earth, to my knowledge, that have sex for the sake of "pleasure" and not "reproduction", all these other animals do not partake of homosexual behaviors for the attractive reasons that humans do. Unless it has been discovered, and I'm not aware - it very well may have been, that dolphins, or primates engage in homosexual activity, that argument also holds no water to me.
I have heard the argument that a series of experiments was done with male rats where they were segregated as a society to only male rats. After a period of time, the rats started trying to copulate with each other. I see two points to this. First, look at our own jail system. When you put an entirely male population together, they also adopt a behavior of homosexuality, even when such behavior was not demonstrated on the world they lived before going to jail/prison. Secondly, Abraham Maslow, in a paper wrote out the "Theory of Hierarchy" in 1943. He soon after ammended the paper so that at the bottom of the pyramid, at the physiological level - the basic level of requirements needed for an individual to survive, listed: air, water, food, and sex. As a basic need, a species either consciously or subconsciously needs to have sex. And it has been documented that there have been species that have resulted either in asexuality or where through nature, they change from female to male (or reverse). If sex is a primal instinct, an physiological need for survival, then when no women are present, the male may resort to fulfilling that need in any environment friendly or hostile.
But, since out in the open world, there are plenty of females, there is no physiological drive for male to male copulation. Therefore, male-to-male attraction becomes a deviance - a choice.
It has also been brought up that years ago, Greeks often considered having sex with boys the ultimate in sharing affection and status. But, again, that proves that it was a chosen behavior, not a biological one.
People cite studies done, scientific or medical, that point to the fact that homosexuality is nature versus nurture. If this was truly a fact, as the studies try to indicate, this discussion thread wouldn't even exist. No one is debating if 2+2=4. That is a proven. No one is debating whether there are actually male and females of a species. That is a proven. If homosexuality was a biological attribute, not a choice (conscious or unconscious), then this debate would not be happening.
For all those reasons above, I will stand by my opinion that homosexuality is a choice (whether from the conscious or sub-conscious), and not a result of biology. But I am open to fact or other persuasive argument.
hmm i think to say "you choose to be gay" is kinda like saying to most people here " you choose to be straight". unless of course you argue that everyone is naturally straight and they "choose" to be gay..
an important thing though to consider is our genetics and nurture. (or nature and nurture). do you choose to like the taste of apples? do you choose to like women? or do you just, like women??? it semms though that a very important part that helps decide, is our growing up. its not a lie that many gay men had bad relationships wiht thier dad (not all but alot). could this be a factor. im sorry i dont have time so i cant get into it all right now.
but i can understand the "anti-gay setiment". its not so much a feeling of being against gays, but rather the culture and life sorounding it. aids spread fast among the gay community for a number of reasons. large amounts of unprotected sex, mutliple sex partners and so on. also drug use was famous in the gay community.
it therefore represented everything a good wholesome family was for. not saying i support it, just i understand where they are coming from
Good point about the "culture" being objectionable to some people more then the homosexuality itself. Rep coming.
But i havent replied 'with only my religion' and in fact, sometimes i havent even brought up God when showing the danger and deviant behaviour behind practicing homosexuality. Im glad you dont believe in the tooth fairy to elves stories ...but you are able to recognize design and engineering I would assume. If you a interested in the weightier issues of life and if your Will allows, then take a look at the razor edge precise parameters of design and engineering to our personal Universe . Any open minded rational person who doesnt have an apriori-philosophical bias and ulterior motives , would agree it wasnt designed by materials and raw chemicals left over from a gigantic explosion . Are you ok for a personal moral Theistic Creator existing , or, would this offer some rather difficult implications to your life ? By the way, your chosen way of Humanism is a religion also. In fact, we all have some sort of 'a religion' (generic sense) we follow in life.
I'm not a humanist. You assume too much and are way off topic. When you bring God into it you end rational discussion, as you just have.
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