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View Poll Results: Would you be able to afford to Educate your child under a fully privatized system?
Yes 40 59.70%
No 27 40.30%
Voters: 67. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 09-30-2008, 04:14 PM
 
Location: Pennsylvania, USA
5,217 posts, read 4,111,845 times
Reputation: 908

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Polybius View Post
"Um.. this" was in response to your post in this thread which quite simply said: "All of the top schools in the world are publicly funded and/or government run, btw".
Did you not mean 'All of the..... '?
Additionally the second url is a link for secondary schools- you can tell this because it says 'secondary' with the link.

yeah.. those are the best schools in the U.S.. i was talking globally .. BIG difference.. I say it again.. THE TOP SCHOOL SYSTEMS IN THE WORLD ARE ALL PUBLICLY FUNDED.. I didn't say the U.S. I said the world..




You posted "Having 30% of America's population uneducated and undereducated is just completely unacceptable." I agreed. So I posted a link to demonstrate that public schools in 10 states and the District of Columbia graduate less than 70% of the enrolled freshmen, (close to1/3?) and Nevada at 56% (nearly half!!?). Overall, public schools leave an average of 25% of the children uneducated. Do you now understand the point about PUBLIC SCHOOLS and 30% uneducated; the points we were in agreement with? Our Public Schools are failing to educate our children.


If a child fails or flunks out of school or decides to walk away from school at the age of 16 without graduating..that's on them. .I already acknowledged that it would NOT be for lack of availability of an education. There is a VAST difference between being uneducated because schools are out of reach as opposed to uneducated for people who drop out of school, fail to put in the work and leave THEMSELVES or their children uneducatd as a result!

You need to understand that in a debate it is incumbent upon the one making an assertion to provide a basis and cite for said assertion. IMO "you can go dig up my posts that link" doesn't meet that test.


I've met the test repeatedly.. the fact that you don't read through all the threads on this post is not my problem. I'm not going to waste my time repeating the same links over and over and over....they are there for you to read if you so choose.
You don't know what "gov't" does better!! Amazing admission!

Because i haven't sat down and compared areas where there is gov't run or free market run..

BTW.. I also linked to studies that showed that public and private schools in the U.S are equal in performance..


IMO, this is a poorly written, poorly reasoned out rant. So I respond with an opinion (rant?) I believe to be well reasoned and supportable. Since you have "NO FAITH whatsoever in corporations etc" I suggest that you move to the projects and live in "gov't" provided housing, drive a Trabant, Yogo, or Lada (all prime examples of 'gov't' produced cars), educate your child in a "gov't" school in Nevada. I Find it amazing that you're in favor of "gov't" systems even if you don't know what 'gov't does better!



Or they can send their children to public school where 25% (on average) are left "uneducated and undereducated".

P
School performance falls along socio economic lines.. Private schools are primarily white kids from good socio economic standings.. so those schools will have overall better "numbers". I linked to studies that compared students of similar socio- economic standing in both types of schools and the results were even..with public schools actually performing better on math tests.

And that is even evident in my neck of the woods where the poorer neighborhoods have poorer performance.

So.. privitize the entire system and open up the schools to everyone that can afford it or those on public assistance.. and it will be no better. Just look at the results of the voucher program in DC. It was dissappointing and proved to not be more effective than the current system.

DAMN Straight I don't trust corporations.. they are only out to make a buck and would screw anything and anyone.. even thier own countries economy to get as much money as they possibly can before they cut and run. Don't need to live in the projects to have a distrust for corporations..

Im tired of corporate welfare.. Im' tired of my politicians being bought and paid for by money greedy corporations who corrupt everything they touch !!

I only trust government more because I can actually hold members of Congress and the Senate accountable when I cast my vote.. I have NO control when it comes to corporations.. until I make my voice heard, as so many have this past week, on capital hill by holding our senators, congressman and local politicians accountable.

And that also includes taking more active role on the local levels and holding those running the schools in the LOCAL government more accountable!!

Last edited by TristansMommy; 09-30-2008 at 04:23 PM..
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Old 09-30-2008, 05:48 PM
 
Location: Pinal County, Arizona
25,107 posts, read 34,361,805 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tricky D View Post
What truly would be asinine and foolish is claiming that everyone who disagrees with you is asinine and foolish, which is exactly what you are doing.
Your statement is completely false
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Old 09-30-2008, 05:53 PM
 
Location: Pinal County, Arizona
25,107 posts, read 34,361,805 times
Reputation: 4893
Quote:
Originally Posted by TristansMommy View Post
All of the top schools in the world are publicly funded and/or government run, btw.
TM - what you are failing to acknowledge is, the statement above, made by you, has been totally proven FALSE.

Clearly, "all of the top schools in the world" (your words) ARE NOT PUBLICLY FUNDED AND/OR GOVERNMENT RUN.

I would suggest you review, and revise, your untrue / false statement
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Old 09-30-2008, 06:51 PM
 
Location: The Netherlands
8,567 posts, read 14,516,394 times
Reputation: 1573
Originally Posted by Greatday
Quote:
Your statement is completely false
That is just your opinion.
Having an opinion is not the same as stating a fact; calling something ugly does not make it ugly.
But I guess that people who still believe that are egocentric.

You believe that you need a formal education to be intelligent, which as a fact is not true.
The very 1st schools were created by people who no doubt were intelligent but never had a formal education before.
Besidez, sending a child to a (private) school will not guarantee that he will become an intelligent person.
But joining a certain fraternity/sorority might make him a successful person.
It obviously is not about how intelligent you are, but who you know.
Just like politicians & politics, it is all about appearances instead of content.
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Old 09-30-2008, 07:01 PM
 
Location: Pennsylvania, USA
5,217 posts, read 4,111,845 times
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http://www.mckinsey.com/locations/uk...ion_report.pdf

International report on how the top school systems inthe world come out on top...

And.. the school systems are Public school - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Alberta Alberta into Confederation stipulates that each school district in the province must have both a public school system and a separate school system. (Despite their names, both school systems are considered "public" in the greater scope of the term, as both are funded by taxpayers
Australia E. The major part of their costs is met by the relevant State or Territory government. Independent schools, both religious or secular (the latter often with specialisations), may charge much higher feesducation is primarily regulated by the individual state governments, not the federal government
Belgium
Finland The Finnish education system is an egalitarian Nordic system, with no tuition fees for full-time students
Hong Kong In Hong Kong the term government schools is used for free schools funded by the government (they also have a system like the U.S with private schools that charge tuition)
Japan The Ministry of Education, Culture, Sports, Science and Technology (MEXT) is responsible for educational administration.Virtually all elementary education takes place in public schools; less than 1% of the schools are private. Lower secondary is publicly funded as well.. and what is "high school' is NOT compulsory and so it is not free.
Netherlands Schools are furthermore divided in public and special (religious) schools Education policy is coordinated by the Dutch Ministry of Education, Culture and Science, together with municipal governments. There are public, special (religious), and private schools. The first two are government-financed and officially free of charge
New Zealand There are three types of school: state, private (or registered or independent) and state integrated schools. State and state integrated schools are government funded
Ontario Publicly funded elementary and secondary schools are administered by the Ontario's Ontario Ministry of Education, while colleges and universities are administered by the Ontario Ministry of Training, Colleges and Universities.
Singapore Education in Singapore is managed by Ministry of Education (MOE), which directs education policy. The ministry controls the development and administration of state schools which receive government funding but also has an advisory and supervisory role to private schools
South Korea A centralized administration oversees the process for the education of children. The Ministry of Education and Human Resources Development is responsible for South Korean education Their schools are publicly funded as well.

And the study found that the reason these schools excelled was in the quality of educators they hired.

Now ..your statement about MY statement has been found to be false.. so i would suggest YOU review, and revise your untrue statements.
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Old 09-30-2008, 07:39 PM
 
Location: Pennsylvania, USA
5,217 posts, read 4,111,845 times
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Here is the UN List of top school systems in the world

1. South Korea 1.4 percent
2. Japan 2.2
3. Finland 4.4
4. Canada 5
5. Australia 6.2
6. Austria 8.2 The Republic of Austria has a free and public school system, and nine years of education are mandatory
7. Britain 9.4
Education in England is the responsibility of the UK Secretary of State for Children, Schools and Families and the Secretary of State for Innovation, Universities and Skills, though the day to day administration and funding of state schools is the responsibility of Local Education Authorities.

8. Ireland 10.2
9. Sweden 10.8
10. Czech Republic 12.2 Education in the Czech Republic is free and compulsory from ages 6 to 15.[
- (tie) New Zealand 12.2
12. France 12.6 Primary and secondary education are predominantly public (private schools also exist, in particular a strong nationwide network of primary and secondary Catholic education), while higher education has both public and private elements
13. Switzerland 13 Schools are constitutionally delegated to cantors and is free in public schools.

14. Belgium 14
  1. Schools owned by the communities (GO! Onderwijs van de Vlaamse gemeenschap; réseau de la Communauté française)
  2. Subsidized public schools (officieel gesubsidieerd onderwijs; réseau officiel subventionné), organized by provinces and municipalities
  3. Subsidized free schools (vrij gesubsidieerd onderwijs; réseau libre subventionné), mainly organized by an organization affiliated to the Catholic church
    - (tie) Iceland 14
    16. Hungary 14.2Most pupils attend public-sector schools, which are administered and organized by the public authorities, primarily the local governments

    - (tie) Norway 14.2 Secondary education in Norway is primarily based on public schools, and is attended by 96%[citation needed] of the students. Until 2005, Norwegian law held private secondary schools to be illegal unless they offered a 'religious or pedagogic alternative', meaning that the only private schools in existence were religious (Christian), Steiner/Waldorf and Montessori schools. The first "standard" private upper secondary schools opened in the fall of 2005.
  4. 18. United States 16.2
    19. Germany 17
    - (tie) Denmark 17
    21. Spain 18.6
    22. Italy 20.2
    23. Greece 23.2
    24. Portugal 23.6
Again.. the problem is NOT that the schools are publicly funded and/or gov't run.. the problem is in the techniques used to teach students..as based on the study linked to in my above post .
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Old 09-30-2008, 09:08 PM
 
Location: Pinal County, Arizona
25,107 posts, read 34,361,805 times
Reputation: 4893
Quote:
Originally Posted by TristansMommy View Post
Now ..your statement about MY statement has been found to be false.. so i would suggest YOU review, and revise your untrue statements.
You, YOU said "ALL TOP SCHOOLS"

Do you consider Yale a top school? Or, Harvard? Or, MIT? Or.....
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Old 09-30-2008, 09:38 PM
 
Location: Pennsylvania, USA
5,217 posts, read 4,111,845 times
Reputation: 908
Quote:
Originally Posted by Greatday View Post
You, YOU said "ALL TOP SCHOOLS"

Do you consider Yale a top school? Or, Harvard? Or, MIT? Or.....
First.. I said the top SCHOOL SYSTEMS in my other post.. and that's what I meant in the one you are trying to quote..

This debate revolves around the privitization of public schools.. .which is elementary and secondary schools... and has nothing to do with college education.. so while I may have typed schools in haste in that post.. I've said the same thing over and over and over again as school systems.

Colleges , or optional additional education, is in a whole other league and NOT what this topic is about or in reference too.. colleges, while open to the public, do not fall under the public education category as they charge tuition that isn't paid for through taxes (property taxes) or run by the government. It's also not MANDATED education but optional. Again.. a whole other ball game. So therefore top "schools" that pertain to the category of mandated elementary and secondary education .. my statement is not incorrect after all.

Don't try to backpeddle now because I've proven YOU wrong.
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Old 10-01-2008, 02:47 AM
 
1 posts, read 1,218 times
Reputation: 10
Default Re:If schools were privatized would you be able to afford an education for your child?

It will very difficult if schools were privatized because the cost for the education is already high.When it becomes privatized than people from low and middle class can't afford that cost.


http://www.get-accepted.com[url="http://www.get-accepted.com"[/url]
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Old 10-01-2008, 07:43 AM
 
Location: Pinal County, Arizona
25,107 posts, read 34,361,805 times
Reputation: 4893
Quote:
Originally Posted by TristansMommy View Post
First.. I said the top SCHOOL SYSTEMS in my other post.. and that's what I meant in the one you are trying to quote..
No, you said, and this is your EXACT QUOTE:
Quote:
Originally Posted by TristansMommy
All of the top schools in the world are publicly funded and/or government run, btw.


You said NOTHING about school systems TM - you said "SCHOOLS"

Maybe you INTENDED to say "school systems" but, the FACT is - you did not say that
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