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If a Black Artist tries to play towards a general group of people they are told they are being white. I think that is what happened to Witney Houston, she went on drugs after she was told that she was a sell out to her people. She was acting white.
lmao.......explain what she did to appeal to le whites?
The drugs part: blame that on B.BROWN
[quote=Ron.;5537645]Ok, I get where you're coming from. You're "white" and you basically have an issue with blacks. So you get on a mostly white website to bash blacks hoping to get other whites on board. thank god you only have 8 responses.
I think you are being too hard on the guy...
I see his point about changes in urban culture.
Look at the soul,r&b music,etc of the 50,60s,70s.
Compare with todays music and its message.
I dont think the decline in values,etc is exclusive to the black community.
Everytime a white person makes a observation he is automatically..
Labeled a racist.
mainstream culture has been doing it for years. back in the golden age of harlem, whites "slummed" it by patronizing black establishments. now with the technological advances, people can see the "show" from the comfort of their home.
i think the 60's and 70's had a positive representation because of the emerging idea that black was beautiful and that black was equal to white. eventho the civil rights era was trying, the immediate effect was a more eloquent, productive black population. there was pride in being black and beautiful.
since then, certain periods of time have been marked more with turbulence than with smooth sailing. the effects of drugs and drug sentencing in the 80's created a particular cultural, urban scene. the general public ate it all up. and now thats what the market wants.
the good thing is that entrepeneurs like P miller(master P) and denzel have joined forces to create BETTER BLACK TV. its happening, but the effects of the 80's gave birth to a particular image of balck america that pervades to this day.
it is doubly "cool", and evidence of how "those" people act.
this topic is more comlex. but these are just some rudimentary thoughts.
You make some very good points.
A couple of years ago I happened upon a Bernie Mac stand up show on BET. He was doing a routine comparing black and white office workers. The gist of it was tha blacks took long lunches, were always late, and talked on the phone too much while whites did none of these things. The mostly black audience was in stitches and high-fiving each other. I was somewhat shocked because they seemed to be celebrating one of the worst racial stereotypes if not confirming it. And I can only imagine if a white comedien did the same routine.
Switch to sports: The antics of many (not all) black athletes are in sharp contrast to the few that broke the color line from the 50s to the mid 70s. Those guys were humble for the most part and sort of "just glad to be there." Contrast them with Terrel Ownes, Plaxico Buress or Pacman Jones.
It seems at times that some black folks want to embrace the same negative images they used to eschew.
I don't see this as only a black issue. You can see the same thing happen at a "Larry The Cable Guy" show. His routine is based on stereotypes, often negative ones and you see white people in the audience laughing and having a great time.
Does that mean that the stereotypes are true? maybe for a few people but Im sure not the majority. Is itrue for people in the audience? maybe a few but definitely not all. Its the same with a show where a black comedian speaks on stereotypes. Its the same when Margaret Cho speaks about gay stereotypes.
I think people hear these routines and laugh because they know its true on a certain level but it doesn't mean that it represents all in that group. Its also been happening for years to different groups. Its an issue we can all relate to.
Wanted to add one more thing: I think the majority of the NFL is a little touched (I think all the tackling jostels their brain) so none of those athlete examples provided are not the best examples)
A couple of years ago I happened upon a Bernie Mac stand up show on BET. He was doing a routine comparing black and white office workers. I was somewhat shocked because they seemed to be celebrating one of the worst racial stereotypes if not confirming it.
Ummm, it's a comedy show. They are supposed to laugh. They may also be high fiving not because they are like that but they may know someone like that. And FYI, there are whites that do these same things.
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Originally Posted by Moth
And I can only imagine if a white comedien did the same routine.
Actually, there are several white comedians that riff on black people. Ralphie May comes to mind.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Moth
It seems at times that some black folks want to embrace the same negative images they used to eschew.
So you formed this opinion by watching a comedy show?
Ummm, it's a comedy show. They are supposed to laugh. They may also be high fiving not because they are like that but they may know someone like that. And FYI, there are whites that do these same things.
Comedy often has a basis in truth. The audience was reacting while nodding their heads. Thus they were affirming what he was saying.
Quote:
Actually, there are several white comedians that riff on black people. Ralphie May comes to mind.
Never heard of him.
Quote:
So you formed this opinion by watching a comedy show?
I have not formed any opinion. Rather I am simply speculating and asking what others might think. And no, I did not base it soley on one Mac skit. I also cited behavior in professional sports while others have spoken about those shows on UPN and so forth.
I am sure this topic will be controversial but I have noticed that back in the 60's and 70's, African Americans did some great things in terms of entertainment. I personally love shows like Good Times, Sanford and Son, etc. These shows were great in terms of quality but also in terms of being truly "American", not strictly for African Americans. In terms of music, the same thing applies to a lot of Motown songs, some incredible music was created by African Americans and these songs were simple, good and they seemed to appeal to the entire American population regardless of race. Lately, it seems like most AA shows have become something that only African Americans appreciate and understand and they tend to emphasize on stereotypes, ignorance and stupidity as if that is something cool. I was listening to a song from the 70's by the Cornelius Brothers called "It is too late to turn back now" and I was amazed that they actually spoke normal English in those times and used proper grammar, the song is amazing and people of all races can relate to it. On the other hand, I was listening to a rap song yesterday by some Soldier Boy and I can't even understand half of what he is saying, the lyrics make absolute no logical sense and he just repeats the same stupid lines 10 times, over and over. Very sad!
You've mentioned this before (in a different forum perhaps).
I'm not certain what your concerns are--beyond lamenting the demise of good music and television, as I do too--but I think that your ultimate complaint lies with (1) network and record label execs; (2) the consumers who make it possible; and (3) the actors and "artists" themselves.
If you think that entertainment consisting of buffoonery, shucking, jiving, rump-shaking, and bling-blinging survives based on the support of Black people alone, you're sadly mistaken. None of this junk remains viable and successful without broad support by whites and others. Moreover, none of it is commercially possible without whites and others.
You know why you hardly see serious Black people on tv and in movies? Because unless they're Denzel or Halle, it's not a good sell. You know why there are so few Black professionals in media management? Because they're a threat to the status quo of low class (Black) entertainment. Know why hip hop is so commercially viable? Middle class white kids with disposable incomes.
Personally when most people don't want their children to watch much of what is on TV that means we have a problem IMO. It kind of become a freak show like the old circus shows and plays to a more freak society.
I am sure this topic will be controversial but I have noticed that back in the 60's and 70's, African Americans did some great things in terms of entertainment. I personally love shows like Good Times, Sanford and Son, etc. These shows were great in terms of quality but also in terms of being truly "American", not strictly for African Americans. In terms of music, the same thing applies to a lot of Motown songs, some incredible music was created by African Americans and these songs were simple, good and they seemed to appeal to the entire American population regardless of race. Lately, it seems like most AA shows have become something that only African Americans appreciate and understand and they tend to emphasize on stereotypes, ignorance and stupidity as if that is something cool. I was listening to a song from the 70's by the Cornelius Brothers called "It is too late to turn back now" and I was amazed that they actually spoke normal English in those times and used proper grammar, the song is amazing and people of all races can relate to it. On the other hand, I was listening to a rap song yesterday by some Soldier Boy and I can't even understand half of what he is saying, the lyrics make absolute no logical sense and he just repeats the same stupid lines 10 times, over and over. Very sad!
Comparing any popular entertainment today to movies, tv and music of the 60s & 70s and you will notice a considerable decline in the quality, regardless of race. These massive corporations sell what people want to buy and as long as there is money to be had, there will be people willing to perform stupid, meaningless acts of so-called entertainment for a quick bunk with no care at all about the quality of the product. This isn't a black/white issue, it's all about the green.
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On the other hand, I was listening to a rap song yesterday by some Soldier Boy and I can't even understand half of what he is saying, the lyrics make absolute no logical sense and he just repeats the same stupid lines 10 times, over and over. Very sad!