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Old 11-20-2008, 08:43 PM
 
1 posts, read 912 times
Reputation: 12

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Quote:
Originally Posted by leangk View Post
It should never ever ever be legal for a couple reasons. FIrst of all who is to decide who can die? you? the the state? If we begin to decide we have to set laws and precendence.

So lets say we say everyone with severe cerebral palsy like that girl who was killed by her dad in Canada. When we do this, we are making a judgment of quality of life. if we decided that we are deciding quality of life

people in this debate never forget that important phrase QUALITY OF LIFE. we cant put a label on someones life and say "oh hes in pain, itd be terrible. id want to die if i were him". or "oh she has cerebral palsy, her life is terrible" because when you do that you are judging the quality of life.

and when you do that, tis easier to say that people with lower qualities of life should die. but where does it end? if we decide that its inhumane for people with a low quality of life to live, then we me "humanely" apply this to all people. because to do so, and let them live in thier "terrible condition" would be bad. so therefore, all people, no matter thier will to live or not (because as we have seen there are people with similar cases of aggressive diseases and some who want to live and some who dont"

The danger is that we would have to apply it to everyone, because the "right to die" is universal. and to not do so, would be, by law, "illegal"
I don't agree at all

I consider that active euthanasia shows compassion for patients in the final stages of a terminal illness. Many people regard it as inhumane to require a person to endure a difficult course of suffering while waiting to die of complications. As one author put it, “People who want an early peaceful death for themselves or their relatives are not rejecting or denigrating the sanctity of life; on the contrary, they believe that a quicker death shows more respect for life than a protracted one”. In this way the family tries to dignify the patient with a peaceful death and at the same time they feel better when they do not see their relative in agony. With this method the family feels empathy and respects the autonomy of the person who is severely ill.

What do you think about that?
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Old 11-23-2008, 03:03 PM
 
1 posts, read 856 times
Reputation: 10
In my opinion active euthanasia is murder. The government should not legalize euthanasia because even if the patient consents, it is still murder and a felony. According to the 1965 ‘Murder Act’, a person can be convicted of murder only if it is proved that the accused had premeditated the crime. When a doctor assists a patient in dying and has the consent of the patient, the crime becomes premeditated.

I know that active euthanasia is an ethical dilemma but we must be more realistic.
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Old 11-25-2008, 01:13 AM
 
Location: in my house
1,385 posts, read 2,682,376 times
Reputation: 558
I believe Oregon does have the death with dignity act. Only extreme conditions must be met for a candidate to be granted this right (a prognosis of 6 mos. or less, a thorough psychiatric evaluation to make an informed decision...). I agree with this.
I do agree everyone should have a living will. Hubby (who is a practicing neurologist) and I agree if one of us ever goes into a coma and becomes medically "brain dead" then just take off life support.
Being hooked up to tubes and machines doing everything for you.....to me that is not what life is about, I'd rather just be let go peacefully.
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Old 11-25-2008, 01:57 AM
 
9,912 posts, read 12,195,776 times
Reputation: 7260
Yes it should.

I find it barbaric to see some of the truly appalling things that people in great pain and suffering have to do in order to take control of their circumstances.

The existing laws and attitudes do not protect the elderly, those with severe physical disability or those who are suffering truly hideous diseases that don't always take their lives quickly. These are people who can't just hop on a plane and go to Mexico to get Nembutal or zip over to the Netherlands to a Euthanasia clinic. And why should people that aren't well and have arrived at such an extreme circumstances not have the right to die peacefully in their own homes? The existing laws don't even protect those who have made it abundantly clear over their life time that they do not wish to be kept alive in particular circumstances.

I wouldn't put my dog through many of the things I've seen people do in the name of preserving "sanctity of life". It disgusts and appalls me that anyone would consider it "right" to allow that kind of suffering to continue if the person who is suffering DOES NOT WISH TO CONTINUE. It should be their right to die peacefully with dignity at a time and place and in a manner of their choosing. If they require assistance to do so then they should receive the assistance they need.

Life will always be about quality over quantity for me and I find it far more humanitarian and compassionate to allow euthanasia and assisted euthanasia than not.
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Old 02-25-2009, 12:55 AM
 
Location: Tucson/Nogales
16,499 posts, read 20,055,588 times
Reputation: 22467
I work in a Long-term Waste (I mean, Care) Facility and how many times does the guilt of working there all but cripple me at the end of a shift. 40-50 million without health care coverage, and some 85 year old man falls down, breaks his hip, and goes to the hospital for a hip replacement, and meanwhile there's millions out there who haven't seen a Doctor in years. Crimes, of this nature, go on everyday, around the country, at these wasteful facilities.

I pray hard that this Depression becomes even worse than the Depression of the 30's to give this country an overdue blood transfusion. When the right wing Christians of this country join the soup lines, only then, will they reconsider their antiquated views of euthanasia, and government-controlled at that, realizing too late what a drain on our economy these wasteful facilities produce.

But as long as the money keeps flowing into these places, there will always be those who will continue to profit at other people's needless suffering and misfortunes.
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Old 02-25-2009, 01:31 AM
 
Location: Northglenn, Colorado
3,689 posts, read 9,261,330 times
Reputation: 944
Quote:
Originally Posted by tijlover View Post
I work in a Long-term Waste (I mean, Care) Facility and how many times does the guilt of working there all but cripple me at the end of a shift. 40-50 million without health care coverage, and some 85 year old man falls down, breaks his hip, and goes to the hospital for a hip replacement, and meanwhile there's millions out there who haven't seen a Doctor in years. Crimes, of this nature, go on everyday, around the country, at these wasteful facilities.

I pray hard that this Depression becomes even worse than the Depression of the 30's to give this country an overdue blood transfusion. When the right wing Christians of this country join the soup lines, only then, will they reconsider their antiquated views of euthanasia, and government-controlled at that, realizing too late what a drain on our economy these wasteful facilities produce.

But as long as the money keeps flowing into these places, there will always be those who will continue to profit at other people's needless suffering and misfortunes.
so we should just up and kill these 85 year old "wastes" that need a hip replacement? I'm sorry, but I value my health, I value my life. I do not want the government to decide that I must be wiped off this earth because my MS has progressed to far for me to work. I am preparing myself both mentally and financially for the day that this might happen. You might be the one that has to look into my 3 year old daughters face and tell her that you need to kill her father because he cannot walk, or he has fatigue so bad that he cannot stay awake for more than 4 hours at a time. That 85 year old you refer to in your post. Do you know why his hip went bad? Maybe it was started by a lifetime of working for a police force, chasing down criminals to protect the people of this country. I value life at any age, and would hope that people would be just as respecting of the person that is 85 as they would be of someone that is 30.

I think you need to find another line of work, you have no compassion when you call our older citizens "waste" because they might need a hip replacement.

Last edited by Noahma; 02-25-2009 at 01:43 AM..
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Old 02-25-2009, 02:39 AM
 
Location: Doonan, QLD
103 posts, read 162,520 times
Reputation: 148
Euthanasia, an interesting concept; however the arguments don’t match with where the real challenges lie.

Baby boomers – I believe some 80 million of them moving into their mid 60’s now, chronic health problems increasing, dementia increasing and life span increasing.

How is all this going to be afforded?

Actively killing someone against their will and consent is off the table; but the policy of save everyone, treat every illness to the last possible option is exhausted, and keep houses of people locked up who have little meaningful parts of their mental selves still present, will have to change.

When 80 year old demented patients come in with a bad pneumonia – the protocol is going to have to change from the current maximal treatment being standard, to comfort measures being standard.

It is a false dilemma that people are suffering from terrible pain and need to be let go and don’t have the ability to do it themselves and require medical help. First, chronic pain, especially in terminal illness is usually treated aggressively and second, these patients have access to large quantities of medications, when taken all at once will usually result in a painless death.

I think being a little more realistic with where resources are spent and when a naturally occurring illness occurs in someone with little quality of life; not treating it; but instead providing comfort measures (morphine, axiolytics) and letting nature take its course.

Physicians in other countries, I guess in this fashion, “play God” making these decisions everyday routinely. Unless the U.S. is going to further extend on what I believe to be 2.5 Trillion Dollars/year currently for healthcare that is not currently outperforming other systems in the world – the U.S. will continue to have serious financial challenges.

This is not an issue of whether to euthanize – but instead is going to be a necessity to stop treating illnesses aggressively once mental function (which can be easily quantified) or quality of life (which also can be easily quantified) is absent.
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Old 02-25-2009, 11:22 AM
 
Location: Ocean Shores, WA
5,082 posts, read 12,598,438 times
Reputation: 10554
Quote:
Originally Posted by j760 View Post

...Only God should decide when it's someone's time to go...
Then being an Atheist, I guess I'll live forever.
I hope Dr. Jack is around when I need him.
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Old 02-25-2009, 01:19 PM
 
Location: The Netherlands
8,567 posts, read 14,530,735 times
Reputation: 1573
Yes, but under strict control of medical experts (like a panel of MD's and psychiatrists) to determine if the client is sound of mind (and not depressed).
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Old 02-25-2009, 11:14 PM
 
Location: Tucson/Nogales
16,499 posts, read 20,055,588 times
Reputation: 22467
Quote:
Originally Posted by Noahma View Post
so we should just up and kill these 85 year old "wastes" that need a hip replacement? I'm sorry, but I value my health, I value my life. I do not want the government to decide that I must be wiped off this earth because my MS has progressed to far for me to work. I am preparing myself both mentally and financially for the day that this might happen. You might be the one that has to look into my 3 year old daughters face and tell her that you need to kill her father because he cannot walk, or he has fatigue so bad that he cannot stay awake for more than 4 hours at a time. That 85 year old you refer to in your post. Do you know why his hip went bad? Maybe it was started by a lifetime of working for a police force, chasing down criminals to protect the people of this country. I value life at any age, and would hope that people would be just as respecting of the person that is 85 as they would be of someone that is 30.

I think you need to find another line of work, you have no compassion when you call our older citizens "waste" because they might need a hip replacement.
I DO have MUCH compassion for the 50 million Americans WITHOUT health insurance, those losing their hard-earned assets through bankruptcy or garnishment of their hard-earned paychecks every day in this country.

And I DO have compassion for many of those patients. Like the 80+ year old woman heavily contracted with a G tube the past 7 years, whose daughter won't intervene. Why? She once told a co-worker: The way she treated me as a child, LET HER SUFFER! She hasn't visited her mother in years!

And the 49 year old brain-dead man who who shot himself in the head, but "survived" the ordeal, now being kept alive with artificial means. For how long? It could be years!

And the 80+ year old man with a G tube who screams and hollers in pain every night, with his deeply-religious wife in the same room who watches religious programs on TV every night, with a rosary in her hands. She could intervene, but to her that's not the will of God.

Yes, I SHOULD find a new line of work, I'm too compassionate for this kind of work.

IF I should live to be 85 years old, and I'm in need of a hip replacement, and IF I should selfishly ask for one, would someone so kindly put a bullet through my head?
Let someone much younger than me without health insurance have some much-needed operation in lieu of mine.

Last edited by tijlover; 02-25-2009 at 11:21 PM.. Reason: Forgot a line
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