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Old 10-26-2008, 10:40 PM
 
Location: Northglenn, Colorado
3,689 posts, read 9,255,557 times
Reputation: 944

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Quote:
Originally Posted by TKramar View Post
What if you don't seek the "American Dream"? You want to produce enough to provide food and shelter for yourself, but aren't interested in the rampant materialism or consumerism?
What do you think the "American Dream" is?

to me it is being able to succeed by my own hand. That is what the classic definition of the "American Dream" was. In recent years it has been grossly been twisted to be thought of as having "stuff"
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Old 10-26-2008, 10:59 PM
 
Location: The Netherlands
8,567 posts, read 14,522,229 times
Reputation: 1573
Originally Posted by Timberwolf232
Quote:
Personal responsibility IS a real thing, the way I would describe it is that a person takes ownership of their actions.
The problem here is that when it comes to global problems most individuals actually believe that they aren't responsible for these type of global problems.
These people often believe that since they're just 1 person they can't be responsible for how the world (read: human society) works.
It seems to me that modern humanity only wants the choice but not the responsibility of their actions.
This is why Americans believe in the American dream which only is an illusion.
Individuals who want to smoke (insist that they have the right to smoke) automatically affect more people than just themselves, especially when they smoke at home in the vicinity of their children or other people they claim to 'love'.
So there is no responsibility which is only restricted to the individual since we all are responsible for the society we live in and the society we live in is responsible for the world we live in.
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Old 10-26-2008, 11:15 PM
 
Location: Bradenton, Florida
27,236 posts, read 40,285,245 times
Reputation: 10915
We have no responsibilities to society...particularly if we want no part of society.
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Old 10-26-2008, 11:30 PM
 
Location: The Netherlands
8,567 posts, read 14,522,229 times
Reputation: 1573
Originally Posted by TKramar
Quote:
We have no responsibilities to society...particularly if we want no part of society.
What you want and what is are 2 different things.
Besidez, no man is an island.
As I understand it you have a wife or girlfriend who takes care of the economical stuff you don't want to be bothered with, so in essence you are still part of society through her.
But I agree that the degree of involvement with society should be the individualís choice.
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Old 10-26-2008, 11:34 PM
 
Location: Bradenton, Florida
27,236 posts, read 40,285,245 times
Reputation: 10915
I would prefer to have been born on an uninhabited island.

Unfortunately, that birth was NOT my destiny. Too bad for me. I still have no doubts that I would survive just fine outside society.
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Old 10-26-2008, 11:44 PM
 
Location: The Netherlands
8,567 posts, read 14,522,229 times
Reputation: 1573
Originally Posted by TKramar
Quote:
I would prefer to have been born on an uninhabited island.
I wouldn't mind that either, although I would prefer that Angelina Jolie or some other fine specimen of the female variety would end up on the same island I was on.

Last edited by Tricky D; 10-27-2008 at 12:00 AM.. Reason: typo
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Old 10-27-2008, 06:57 AM
 
1,474 posts, read 2,017,118 times
Reputation: 457
Quote:
Originally Posted by TKramar View Post
I would prefer to have been born on an uninhabited island.

Unfortunately, that birth was NOT my destiny. Too bad for me. I still have no doubts that I would survive just fine outside society.
If it was uninhabited, than pray tell, how could you have been born?????

either this is a dichotomy or an oxymoran...............maybe both
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Old 10-27-2008, 11:54 AM
 
Location: Bradenton, Florida
27,236 posts, read 40,285,245 times
Reputation: 10915
I wasn't born, I was hatched!
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Old 10-29-2008, 11:51 AM
 
Location: vagabond
2,631 posts, read 4,833,296 times
Reputation: 1300
Quote:
But I agree that the degree of involvement with society should be the individualís choice.
in order to be independent of society, you would actually need to get away from society. i think people are lying to themselves if they think that they can live within society, without being a part of it. if i am buying the goods, paying into the system, receiving any of the benefits, then i am not independent of society. only those that live by themselves (not even small groups), out in the middle of the natural world would be actually independent of society.

but we, as human beings, were bred for society. we thrive in society, not by ourselves. as tricky mentioned earlier, people can't live in isolation very well. in fact, isolation can have biologically fatal effects to a social creature. mankind was meant to be independently dependent; i work, but i do so for society, because i do so for my family. i create and dream, but i do so for society as much as i do so for myself, whether or not that is my actual goal. in order to make those efforts completely independent of society, i would need to get out of society. even if i take just my wife with me, that is society. that is a social contract, and therefore, i am still reliant on someone else.

aaron out.
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Old 11-01-2008, 10:19 AM
 
Location: The Netherlands
8,567 posts, read 14,522,229 times
Reputation: 1573
Originally Posted by stycotl
Quote:
but we, as human beings, were bred for society.
I disagree.
We humans are bred for tribal society and not a global society.
Nature has always preferred variation over homogeneity.
Unfortunately our (modern) technology has made us more and more homogenous.
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