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Old 10-27-2008, 07:24 AM
 
Location: Ottawa, Canada
609 posts, read 1,043,362 times
Reputation: 173

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Quote:
Originally Posted by GloryB View Post
Well...isn't THIS post the voice of common sense. Thanks SuSuSushi!
actually untrue. this isnt about who gets who pregnant, its about the fact that basically once a women is pregnant, the father loses all rights and gains all the responsibility. thats the problem here. he has no say over an abortion, yes or no. he then may have to pay child support.

what we are trying to understand is what gives a women 100% control over the situation? why are the mens rights violated so bad, and yet no one speaks out. people like you and SUSUSushi actually continue to propagate the feminist propaganda of "its my body".

this arguemnt has been slaughtered on so many levels. 1. people dont ahve complete control over their body (suicide euthanasian illegal)

2. its the babies body too, and as we know your rights end where another begins.
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Old 10-27-2008, 07:40 AM
 
Location: Montrose, CA
3,031 posts, read 7,863,957 times
Reputation: 1925
Quote:
Originally Posted by leangk View Post
, its about the fact that basically once a women is pregnant, the father loses all rights and gains all the responsibility.
Wrong. Men aren't solely culpable for the children they father, at least in the USA. Don't know where you are from, but here the mother and the father are legally equally responsible for the child.

Again, men do have a choice. I've clearly pointed it out to you, though you continue to ignore it, preferring instead to use inflammatory words like "murder" and "feminist propaganda" among others. Good luck with that, it's not working for you so far.
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Old 10-27-2008, 09:46 AM
 
Location: Cumberland Co., TN
20,014 posts, read 20,509,618 times
Reputation: 20369
Quote:
It was about Fathers who are demanded to pay child support for a baby they never knew existed.

What are your thoughts on this matter? Do you think the woman is the only one that has right of choice? and why.
I didnt see Dr. Phil, but my 2 cents: I believe it should be the womans choice to abort or not for the reasons already stated by several woman. I also believe that woman shoulder the responsibility of birth control for the same reasons. If a pregnancy occurs outside of marriage or the equivalent, there should be a reasonable amount of time in which the father be notified of the pregnancy, if he wants no part in it he would sign over all parental rights and not pay any child support. If he is not notified he forfeits parental rights and is not held to pay support. If he whishes to be a part of the childs life, he get reasonable rights and pays support. Of course details would be worked out by the court on a case by case bases.

We women, like it or not, are the ones that get pregnant so if we are not responsible for our own birth control and who we have sex with, we should be prepared to either abort or care for a child resulting from a pregnancy with the exception of pregnancy resulting during a marriage. In that case I feel the man should be required to pay child support because there is always a reasonable expectation of pregnancy.
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Old 10-27-2008, 10:03 AM
 
Location: Montrose, CA
3,031 posts, read 7,863,957 times
Reputation: 1925
No parent, male OR female, should be allowed to willingly relinquish financial responsibility for their child. This would hurt only the child, so all you anti-choice people should be able to get behind this idea without much trouble. Well, if you don't have a double standard, that is.
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Old 10-27-2008, 10:22 AM
 
Location: Maine
23 posts, read 40,056 times
Reputation: 34
I did not see the Dr. Phil show and I did not read all the posts for this thread.
I agree with 2mares. The woman needs to be ready either carry the child or abort it. The father should have the right to sign away any paternal rights or obligations. The problem would be when the father wants the baby and the mother does not. How can anyone tell her she has to carry the baby to term? It gets fuzzy there. Ultimately isn't it her choice since it is her body? If she is willing to make the sacrifice for him to have his baby then she also should be able to sign away her parental rights/obigations as well though.
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Old 10-27-2008, 10:34 AM
 
Location: Cumberland Co., TN
20,014 posts, read 20,509,618 times
Reputation: 20369
Quote:
No parent, male OR female, should be allowed to willingly relinquish financial responsibility for their child.
Not without also relinquishing their rights. But i'snt that the bases of adoption?
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Old 10-27-2008, 10:37 AM
 
Location: Cumberland Co., TN
20,014 posts, read 20,509,618 times
Reputation: 20369
Quote:
The problem would be when the father wants the baby and the mother does not. How can anyone tell her she has to carry the baby to term?
They cant. Thats where the men have a problem with "their rights" being violated. Heck I want to pee standing up, but dont have the equipment for it. Some things just suck.
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Old 10-27-2008, 10:38 AM
 
Location: Montrose, CA
3,031 posts, read 7,863,957 times
Reputation: 1925
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2mares View Post
Not without also relinquishing their rights. But i'snt that the bases of adoption?
Nice red herring, but we're not talking about adoption here.
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Old 10-27-2008, 10:41 AM
 
878 posts, read 1,846,070 times
Reputation: 460
Quote:
Originally Posted by SuSuSushi View Post
Wrong. Men aren't solely culpable for the children they father, at least in the USA. Don't know where you are from, but here the mother and the father are legally equally responsible for the child.
Wrong. The mother is not responsible for the child. She has a choice: support the child, or terminate the pregnancy. The father has no such choice.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SuSuSushi View Post
Again, men do have a choice. I've clearly pointed it out to you, though you continue to ignore it, preferring instead to use inflammatory words like "murder" and "feminist propaganda" among others. Good luck with that, it's not working for you so far.
You are clouding the issue. This isn't about abortion so much as it is about equality. If a man's choice in pregnancy is solely "don't have (unprotected) sex," then why not use the same argument when it comes to abortion? I am pro-choice: I support the right of a woman not to have sex. I am also pro-life: I support the right of a child to be free from murder by its mother.
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Old 10-27-2008, 10:51 AM
 
Location: Maine
23 posts, read 40,056 times
Reputation: 34
Now I am caught up...... The fathers rights.
Well I think this has been said but we all have the right to say no to sex in the first place.
If you do not exercise that right then deal with the consequences. Which happen to be that the mother ultimately decides whether the baby will be born or not.
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