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Old 10-29-2008, 09:58 AM
 
274 posts, read 545,927 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by masonsdaughter View Post
Health care wouldn't have to be free, it could be set up on a sliding scale depending on income, or the insurance could be paid on a sliding scale.
This makes sense.

What services do you propose would be covered?
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Old 10-29-2008, 10:10 AM
 
Location: Pinal County, Arizona
25,107 posts, read 34,361,805 times
Reputation: 4893
Quote:
Originally Posted by AngelEyez02403 View Post
Where did someone get this 10 million figure from?

What you are talking about is a health insurance MANDATE, not a universal system where the government provides insurance.
The number comes from the Feds - of the 40 to 44 million estimated to be without health insurance - some 20 to 25% of this number are estimated to be illegal immigrants.

So again - do they get covered also?

If you are going to have a health insurance MANDATE - how do you expect to accomplish this without government intervention? For, you are going to have millions that say they do not want, nor will they pay for, health insurance -

So - how do you "Mandate"?
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Old 10-29-2008, 10:19 AM
 
1,905 posts, read 2,121,998 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by masonsdaughter View Post
Health care wouldn't have to be free, it could be set up on a sliding scale depending on income, or the insurance could be paid on a sliding scale.
lol, so we should have the top 1% pay for 40% of the healthare too. After all they need to pay their fair share.
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Old 10-29-2008, 10:22 AM
 
274 posts, read 545,927 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Greatday View Post
The number comes from the Feds - of the 40 to 44 million estimated to be without health insurance - some 20 to 25% of this number are estimated to be illegal immigrants.

So again - do they get covered also?

If you are going to have a health insurance MANDATE - how do you expect to accomplish this without government intervention? For, you are going to have millions that say they do not want, nor will they pay for, health insurance -

So - how do you "Mandate"?
I do not support a health insurance mandate---I never said that I did. I live in MA and that is what we have here and it's horrible.

And you are leaving out the number of underinsured---in total it is almost 100,000 AMERICANS.
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Old 10-29-2008, 11:11 AM
 
Location: CA
2,464 posts, read 5,686,058 times
Reputation: 2587
Quote:
Originally Posted by coastalrap View Post
According to the 2007 census, 60% of people in this country have employer paid health coverage. 8% have self paid coverage, 13% are on Medicaid and 15% don’t have coverage.

I’m sure that the employers that currently pay for 60% of the people to have health coverage would be very happy for the government to take over that expense.
Why would we want to shift that expense from the private sector to tax payers because 15% of people (note not necessarily citizens) do not have coverage?
Who here thinks employers will take that savings and add it to your paycheck? A windfall for the fortune 500.
Why do the 15% not qualify for Medicaid? Over the income level comes to mind.

The fact is and we all know it, there is a portion of that 15% that does not want to pay for health coverage. Many are young and don’t think they need it. They have other priorities and feel that health is not an issue for them at this time. They must also think they will not have an accident. Do we want to create a huge government bureaucracy because some people would rather buy iphones, flat screen TVs cars etc? Do you see how young people live, have you been to a mall lately?

We do not have the capacity for anyone who walks into this country to have unlimited healthcare when ever they want it. The government can’t tax us enough to pay for it. Healthcare would have to be rationed just like it is in all the other countries that have socialized healthcare.


The Vancouver British Columbia based Fraser Institute’s annual publication “Waiting Your Turn” reports that Canada’s median waiting times form a patient’s referral by a GP to treatment by a specialist can be as much as 40 weeks. The wait for an MRI or CT ranges between four and 28 weeks. One out of three Canadian physicians sends patients to the U.S. while the Canadian government spends over $1 Billion each year on healthcare in our country. Where will we go…Cuba?

But there is always Great Britain right? But wait, currently over 750,000 Brits are waiting hospital admission. Britain’s National Health Services hopes to achieve an 18 week maximum wait from GP to treatment by the end of 2008. Dentists are paid to treat a certain number of patients a year, when they are done they go on holiday, even if it’s only July. Many have gone to the back yard shed to pull their own teeth.

When the rationing begins here, will a 20 year old illegal have priority over a 60 year old citizen? Will the government have a right to refuse treatment? Will patient’s be responsible to live up to what the government decides are good health and fitness standards?

A lot of questions to ask before we go down this road but no one is asking.

Of course, our government did such a good job with the finance system, why not give them our healthcare to make better for us.
This is the best post on here IMO. You bring up valid points and questions that are often ignored. Sometimes we get so focused on the goal that we don't fully acknowledge the consequences. If we are going to walk into something that will not be reversed and will increase our tax burden then we should all do it with our eyes open to the negatives AND the positives. To me, there's too many negatives. There has to be some other option.
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Old 10-29-2008, 11:22 AM
 
48,519 posts, read 81,013,914 times
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The only way that you structure a universal heathcare sytem is to have even those at lower middle and middle incomes be taxed at 30-40% rates as in say the UK. This will mean also that cost for everyhtign goes up as they will be more heavily taxed or have high fees. It willt ake a income of 100.000 plus most likel;y to ever affors a home even then being very small compared to american standards.It makes the unelpoyment rate also giher especailly amongthose younger workers and will encourage many that now work minimum wage to not work and go on total welfare because they will i the end pay alot more. The UK and many european countries actaully are fairly small and the problems with providing coverage is really small compared tot ehUSA. In the end you etiher pay more or get less qauilty. Does anyone really think that the best doctor candidates are going to atke a huge drop in the average income of a doctor much less a specailist. By teh time you get to be a doctor ;you have spent a small fortune and alot of years in collage plus residency and then you have to get a practice which really has alo0t of cost involved. I think many will go to other degress that take less time and cost involved.Does anypone really think that the rich and the pwoierful are going to be in the same system as we are'think again./
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Old 10-29-2008, 11:24 AM
 
274 posts, read 545,927 times
Reputation: 89
We have the money in our system already---it's just the way it's allocated that's the problem.
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Old 10-29-2008, 11:30 AM
 
Location: Pinal County, Arizona
25,107 posts, read 34,361,805 times
Reputation: 4893
Quote:
Originally Posted by AngelEyez02403 View Post
I do not support a health insurance mandate---I never said that I did. I live in MA and that is what we have here and it's horrible.

And you are leaving out the number of underinsured---in total it is almost 100,000 AMERICANS.
If you don't create a "Mandate", there is no way to get everyone covered the way the left invisions.
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Old 10-29-2008, 03:02 PM
 
274 posts, read 545,927 times
Reputation: 89
How do you see that?
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Old 10-30-2008, 03:55 AM
 
Location: Eastern Kentucky
1,237 posts, read 2,640,714 times
Reputation: 1262
As far as illegal immigrants, we already pay for their health care. When they need medical attention they just walk into the nearest hospital emergency room. Do you think we aren't paying for that? England and canada are not the only countries to have health care. Medicare works pretty well here. Perhaps we could set a similar system with those above a certian income pay on a sliding scale either for the medical care or for the insurance.
A lot of people would like to go to medical school, but cannot afford it. As with our doctors in the military, the government could pay for their education an let them sign a contract to practice at a certian location at a certain pay scale for a specified period of time. As for the quality, I always had exelent care.
I'm glad some of you do not have to worry about meeting your premiums, but I would ask a little compassion for those who cannot.
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