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Old 10-31-2008, 12:56 PM
 
230 posts, read 622,519 times
Reputation: 189

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This country used to be a center right nation. Not any more. A combination of events, not the least of which is the Bush administration's very unconservative government has given this country a solid tilt to the left. I think the best one can hope for is the breakup of the country. Yes, there it is I said it. I could never live in blue state America, and I was born and raised there. Let them have their socialist nirvana. A large swath of the SW is on its way to being retaken by Mexico by the sheer force of changing demographics. Northern California, Oregon and Washington may want to have their own form of wacky Blue state liberalism. Then you have Alaska and Hawaii, which has a strong nativist movement that remembers its past and would like to sever ties with the US. That's six separate countries by my count. Think something like that can't happen? Think again. For me, the election of Barack Obama and a veto proof Democratic Congress is the breaking point. I don't want to live in that kind of country and there are lot more like me out there than you think.
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Old 10-31-2008, 05:08 PM
 
Location: Orlando, Florida
43,858 posts, read 43,559,234 times
Reputation: 58603
Quote:
Originally Posted by SuSuSushi View Post
The American public is as a whole too lazy and too comfortable in their lives to actually get up the nerve to have a revolution.
Such a great post....so little rep points to give.

I think the balls of our nation are slowly dying out with the WW2 Vets.
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Old 10-31-2008, 06:15 PM
 
19,183 posts, read 27,734,523 times
Reputation: 4000
Quote:
Originally Posted by BLAZER PROPHET View Post
I agree in part. However, clearly the pendulum has fully swung. I'm 52 and have never in my life seen such pure hatred as I do today from liberals. Intolerance and hate have become the new liberal mantra.
Maybe you never read Ann Coulter. Maybe you never watched Jerry Falwell. Maybe you don't remember people rooting for AIDS patients to die in the 80's...trying to run anyone rumored to have the disease out of town on a rail. Maybe you don't remember Bull Connor in the 60's or that people cheered when National Guard troops shot four kids dead in Ohio. Shoulda been done long ago... Nobody had to write that lyric. It wrote itself. Right of of everybody's everyday life. And you're falling down over what, again?
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Old 10-31-2008, 06:58 PM
 
Location: Aiken S.C
765 posts, read 1,680,363 times
Reputation: 388
Quote:
Originally Posted by saganista View Post
Maybe you never read Ann Coulter. Maybe you never watched Jerry Falwell. Maybe you don't remember people rooting for AIDS patients to die in the 80's...trying to run anyone rumored to have the disease out of town on a rail. Maybe you don't remember Bull Connor in the 60's or that people cheered when National Guard troops shot four kids dead in Ohio. Shoulda been done long ago... Nobody had to write that lyric. It wrote itself. Right of of everybody's everyday life. And you're falling down over what, again?
How about fire hoses and attack dogs in Birmingham? The olympic bomber... Pat Robertson saying Katrina was gods punishment. The more i learn the more i study what America has become the more i would not use this flag that was made in China for toliet paper.
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Old 10-31-2008, 07:01 PM
 
19,183 posts, read 27,734,523 times
Reputation: 4000
Quote:
Originally Posted by Saintmarks View Post
It has been decades since we have seen a truly left wing government, and it seems we have to live by experience rather than learn from history. The Carter years are as close as we have seen of this style of government in my life time and its legacy speaks for itself.
Good Lord. Carter was (and still is) a conservative heart attached to a rational brain. Truly left wing, he was definitley not. This is just disturbingly off the mark. As for his legacy, you apparently have but the NewsMax version of it. Carter inherited quite the mess from Nixon and "Oatmeal Man" Ford (thank you, Gil Scott-Heron), and from those ashes, he crafted a road back to a stable present while working to create plans for a livable future that we still haven't managed to recreate. Then along came an oil embargo and the Iranian revolution. Not exactly stuff he signed off on.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Saintmarks View Post
Clinton actually ended up Center-Right as a Republican congress didn't allow him to stray too far to the left.
Clinton is/was a neocon, just one who didn't turn tail from the Democratic Party and go hide out among assorted fundie and PNAC extremists. Your Republican Congress, he toyed with, so much so that out of spite, they proceeded to stage the biggest political grandstanding stunt in US history.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Saintmarks View Post
The current economic situation on Wall Street is nothing more than a natural ebb and flow. A free market will correct itself. It is painful during the correcting phase, but it will ebb back IF government doesn't interfere with higher taxes, more unnecessary regulation and a belief that more and more layers of bureacracy can change things for the better. History has proven that it won't.
Daydreams. The current situation is nothing more than the cataclysmic collapse of a 30-year experiment with laissez-faire free-market capitalism. It is an experiment which has been run befoire and failed before. All that works in the long run is managed capitalism -- what most on your side, being apparently unable to distinguish between the two, call either socialism or communism. There is no "natural" cycle. There are only the recurring market failures that inevitably arise when markets are left to themselves. You and Alan Greenspan can sit a share how shocked you all are over all this coming to pass.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Saintmarks View Post
I believe it was Churchill that said that in his twenties a man's heart causes him to be a liberal, in his forties a man's mind causes him to be conservative.
No, he stole it from a French guy who was actually talking about the reluctance of the older folks to engage in blood-in-the-streets style revolution, but it's a nice quote to dress up otherwise undistinguished arguments, so you do see the misattribution often enough.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Saintmarks View Post
I can't blame the current youth and twenty and thirty somethings for believing the current CHANGE and HOPE rhetoric.
How can you blame any 40-, 50-, 60-, 70-, 80-, or 90-somethings? Take a look around. The place has been run into the ground as the result of eight years worth of disgrace and disaster, much of it cautioned against by the very people who now wish to take over. Maybe instead of penning these black-crepe laments for the future, you could take a stab at some laments (not to mention some apologies) for the past. There's an awful lot back there to atone for...
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Old 10-31-2008, 07:11 PM
 
19,183 posts, read 27,734,523 times
Reputation: 4000
Quote:
Originally Posted by elvislives View Post
How about fire hoses and attack dogs in Birmingham?
That was sort of subsumed into the Bull Connor reference.

Quote:
Originally Posted by elvislives View Post
The olympic bomber...
I had just left Atlanta earlier that day.

Quote:
Originally Posted by elvislives View Post
Pat Robertson saying Katrina was gods punishment.
Well, 9/11 at least. Too many people join the ACLU, and that's what you get.

Quote:
Originally Posted by elvislives View Post
The more i learn the more i study what America has become the more i would not use this flag that was made in China for toliet paper.
Well, I wouldn't do that either. I love the flag and I love what this country is supposed to be but certainly is NOT just at the moment. The country has been set on the wrong track. We are headed in the wrong direction. We desperately need a major change of course, and that change begins at the top.
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Old 10-31-2008, 07:29 PM
 
Location: Aiken S.C
765 posts, read 1,680,363 times
Reputation: 388
Change cannot come fast enough to suit me... Tonight i was in Canada and they laugh at us.. To them we are the retarded cousin kept locked in the basement. I feel most of the world views us that way. Our FLAG is made in China . How stupid is that ????
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Old 10-31-2008, 08:07 PM
 
Location: The Netherlands
8,567 posts, read 14,514,836 times
Reputation: 1573
Exclamation Evolve or die.

I dunno about revolution and communism, but I completely agree with Marx about the following:

Quote:
Philosophy is to the real world as masturbation is to sex.
Karl Marx
(German political Philosopher and revolutionary, 1818-1883)

Anyone who knows anything of history knows that great social changes are impossible without feminine upheaval. Social progress can be measured exactly by the social position of the fair sex, the ugly ones included.
Karl Marx

Sell a man a fish, he eats for a day, teach a man how to fish, you ruin a wonderful business opportunity.
Karl Marx

Social progress can be measured by the social position of the female sex.
Karl Marx

I am not a Marxist.
Karl Marx
Besidez, I want an evolution and not a revolution; revolutions may not be 'permanent' while an evolution generally is.
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Old 11-01-2008, 08:57 AM
 
230 posts, read 622,519 times
Reputation: 189
There's so much bile and drek here I hardly know where to begin. We've been drifting more towards a modern day feudalism rather than laissez faire free market capitalism. What has been labeled as and passed off as conservatism from Reagan to Bush II has often been anything but. Naturally there has been a reaction and the cure as it often is will be worse than the disease. I don't have the time and no one would bother to read it anyway to explain this in greater detail. We have not been getting conservatism, but we sure as hell are going to get a big dose of Big Government PC liberalism. Lastly, I don't care what the Canadians or the Europeans think. They have plenty of their own problems.
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Old 11-01-2008, 09:44 AM
 
Location: NW Nevada
13,341 posts, read 10,898,841 times
Reputation: 12285
A new American Revolution or a second Civil War? Semantics I guess. In the urban centers it is true that the American people have grown lazy and complacent. Not everyone lives in the cities though. Rural areas, for the most part, are populated by individualists that aren't used to things being as easy as urbanites. Out here our lives are quite different form a city dwellers. My morning routine consists of getting up far before the sun so I can get all our livestock and animals fed before I have to go to work. We have to get our house and property ready for the changing seasons( winterizing the well, securing ample food to get the stock through the cold months, keeping predators out of our pens etc). The summer months are used to get ready for another winter. It's a hard vicious cycle. The thought of civil war breaking out is certainly not a pleasant one, but laying down and dying ain't an option. Ol' Hank JR. said it once, "Country boy can survive".
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