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Old 02-27-2009, 09:58 PM
 
Location: Ohio
1,008 posts, read 640,290 times
Reputation: 250

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Braunwyn View Post


So, you're saying that the people of Haiti aren't capable. Why do you think that's the case?

Read Rushton.

 
Old 02-27-2009, 10:04 PM
 
19,081 posts, read 21,198,868 times
Reputation: 13392
Quote:
Originally Posted by OhioUberAlles View Post
Read Rushton.
I did a quick google on Rushton and IIRC, I've come across him before. I do not believe in such physiological differences, in the way of intelligence, between the races (be clear, societal races). I have no reason to buy into it. From what I've been reading, Rushton has been shunned quite a bit.

It wasn't too long ago that women were deemed inferior in similar ways. That all turned out to be a pile of hooey. I have no reason to suspect that it's the same case for minorities.
 
Old 02-27-2009, 10:10 PM
 
Location: Ohio
1,008 posts, read 640,290 times
Reputation: 250
Quote:
Originally Posted by Braunwyn View Post
I did a quick google on Rushton and IIRC, I've come across him before. I do not believe in such physiological differences, in the way of intelligence, between the races (be clear, societal races). I have no reason to buy into it. From what I've been reading, Rushton has been shunned quite a bit.

It wasn't too long ago that women were deemed inferior in similar ways. That all turned out to be a pile of hooey. I have no reason to suspect that it's the same case for minorities.

Because "experts" say it is hooey, it surely must be hooey, right?


Sex and intelligence-

Men are more intelligent than women, claims new study | Mail Online


Dr Paul Irwing: 'There are twice as many men as women with an IQ of 120-plus' - Higher, Education - The Independent (http://education.independent.co.uk/higher/article2024763.ece - broken link)

American Renaissance News: Dr Paul Irwing: ‘There Are Twice As Many Men As Women With An IQ Of 120-Plus’ (http://www.amren.com/mtnews/archives/2006/11/dr_paul_irwing.php - broken link)



Race and intelligence-

http://news.independent.co.uk/sci_te...cle3067222.ece

Celebrated scientist attacked for race comments: "All our social policies are based on the fact that their intelligence is the same as ours - whereas all the testing says not really"
 
Old 02-27-2009, 10:51 PM
 
19,081 posts, read 21,198,868 times
Reputation: 13392
Quote:
Originally Posted by OhioUberAlles View Post
Because "experts" say it is hooey, it surely must be hooey, right?
First of all, my unemployed inspiring kangaroo killing non-friend, lets start with your sources. I will help you along due to my limited reading on the joke that is Rushton. Well before that, it's always the undereducated, unsuccessful males that attempt to glean some sense of self-worth because their own lives are...um...lack luster on the intelligence front. Or are you saying that I'm more of a man than you are? Surely that cannot be a comfortable position for you.
Any way....

Yes, Rushton...the last stop for the desperate. Now, I know that you won't be able to keep up but, I'll post any way.

Criticism of motivation and funding

"Popular science commentator David Suzuki spoke out against Rushton's racial theories in a live televised debate (1989) at the University of Western Ontario. "There will always be Rushtons in science," Suzuki said "and we must always be prepared to root them out!"."

Criticism of methodology

"Steven Cronshaw and colleagues wrote in a paper for the International Journal of Selection and Assessment in 2006 that psychologists need to critically examine the science employed in Rushton's race-realist research. Through a re-analysis of the validity criteria for test bias using data reported in the Rushton et al. paper, they assert that the testing methods were in fact biased against Black Africans."

Criticism of scholarly conduct

Bla...Bla...Bla...
J. Philippe Rushton - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

It seems that we have a quack on our hands. Now, this may play in nicely with a layman, but the sci community is taking issues with your little quack.

Oh noes!

Quote:
Dr Paul Irwing: 'There are twice as many men as women with an IQ of 120-plus' - Higher, Education - The Independent (http://education.independent.co.uk/higher/article2024763.ece - broken link)
Maybe the brits need to eat their wheaties.

The Irvine study should always be included in gender debates.

"While there are essentially no disparities in general intelligence between the sexes, a UC Irvine study has found significant differences in brain areas where males and females manifest their intelligence."
Today@UCI: Press Releases:

Here I'm quoting myself from another forum.

"Regardless of which measure of gender equality they used, Sapienza and her colleagues found that improved social conditions for women were related to improved math performance by girls. For example, the math gender gap almost disappeared in Sweden (GGI = 0.81), while girls scored nearly 23 points below boys in math in Turkey (GGI = 0.59). Not only did average girls scores improve as equality improved, but the number of girls reaching the highest levels of performance also increased. In Iceland, for example, there were 117 girls for every 100 boys among the top 1 percent of math students.

We establish that in some countries the gender gap in math disappears."

...

Having linked social structures to the math gender gap from country to country, Sapienza wonders whether this result rules out biological influences entirely. The answer is no. The biological hypothesis suggests that an average boy would score higher in mathematics than in reading, while for girls the reverse is true. This pattern does not change in more gender equal societies hinting that some aspects of academic performance may be innately different between boys and girls.
Sapienza and colleagues found that boys, regardless of the country and social environment in which they live, typically do better in math than in reading. Similarly, girls are usually better in reading than in math, regardless of the degree of gender equality in their society. As a result, in more gender equal societies, girls will gain an absolute advantage relative to boys.

Some evidence of the influence of biology can be gained by looking at mathematics sub-scores. Previous research had shown that boys advantage over girls in math is most pronounced in geometry (e.g., Pythagorean theorem), while the gap is narrowest in arithmetic (e.g., 1+2=3). But no matter how much girls narrow the gender gaps in geometry and arithmetic in more gender-equal countries, boys always score higher in geometry than arithmetic, while the opposite is observed for girls. So the between gender differences in a single disciplinereading or mathcertainly appear to be influenced by social features, but the within gender differences between reading and math, and between arithmetic and geometry, appear to be much more stable across environments, suggesting possible biological roots."
http://insight.kellogg.northwestern....er_gap_bridged

Quote:
American Renaissance News: Dr Paul Irwing: ‘There Are Twice As Many Men As Women With An IQ Of 120-Plus’ (http://www.amren.com/mtnews/archives/2006/11/dr_paul_irwing.php - broken link)
And then you cite the same article twice. Good job. But, American Renaissance is special because it's a WN/racist org.

Quote:
Celebrated scientist attacked for race comments: "All our social policies are based on the fact that their intelligence is the same as ours - whereas all the testing says not really"
The key here is that you are not included in the 'our'. Although, I, a woman (egads!) am. That's the real kicker. You can be a racist, and you can be a sexist, but none of that is going to change a darn thing for you.

You're not smarter becaue you're white. You're not smarter because you have gnads. You're life is proof of that. Your attempts to bring the rest of us down to your level only has value on internet posting boards, which isn't much.
 
Old 02-27-2009, 10:55 PM
 
Location: The Shires
2,257 posts, read 1,722,489 times
Reputation: 1050
There's no such thing as "reverse racism"...just racism, which is never excusable.
 
Old 02-27-2009, 10:59 PM
 
Location: Ohio
1,008 posts, read 640,290 times
Reputation: 250
Quote:
Originally Posted by Braunwyn View Post
First of all, my unemployed inspiring kangaroo killing non-friend, lets start with your sources. I will help you along due to my limited reading on the joke that is Rushton. Well before that, it's always the undereducated, unsuccessful males that attempt to glean some sense of self-worth because their own lives are...um...lack luster on the intelligence front. Or are you saying that I'm more of a man than you are? Surely that cannot be a comfortable position for you.
Any way....

A White man without a job who is trying to find work (in any field, even not specifically related to his degree) and is considering radical and creative/unique ideas gets scorn and contempt from you, while a Black man without a job, who is content to have things stay that way, would probably receive your assistance in getting on welfare and various other programs. I'm not going to get into an IQ/GPA pi--ing contest, suffice to say if there wasn't a nationwide aversion to right-wing/conservative Christian White males who aren't ashamed of what they are, I would easily have a corporate job by now.

You're a liberal elitist living in lily White suburban Massachusetts. You wouldn't last a day in the real world. How about we go to Johannesburg at 11 pm at night, start at one side of the city and walk towards the other end of the city. We'll see which of us makes it to the other side. The only rules are that you can only take what is on your person or what you can carry with you, and you have to walk, no vehicles. Would you be game for that? How about the same rules only this time we walk from the South Africa/Zimbabwe border, through Zimbabwe, to Zambia. Are you confident you would make it to the other side?


I believe you meant to say aspiring instead of inspiring. I don't inspire to kill kangaroos, I aspire to do so.
 
Old 02-27-2009, 11:19 PM
 
19,081 posts, read 21,198,868 times
Reputation: 13392
Quote:
Originally Posted by OhioUberAlles View Post
A White man without job who is trying to find work and is considering radical and creative/unique ideas gets scorn and contempt from you, while a Black man without a job, who is content to have things stay that way, would probably receive your assistance in getting on welfare and various other programs.
I post all those links and quotes and this is what I get?

Lets be clear here. I tend to be a bit too conservative on some issues (that is the issue I need to work on). I don't care what your color is. I'm of the mind that all people on any kind of welfare should sacrifice their ability to procreate. My conservative father has aligned me with a libertarian dictator. So no, the 'give minorities a free welfare card' doesn't fly with me.

And as far as you being a white man trying to do this or that. Look, if you had an ounce of humility, I would address it. At the end of the day, if you're going to be throwing stones...the same stones I could throw at you, than that doesn't make a lick of sense. You're going to try and pass along the crap that men are more intelligent than women even though I run circles around you in every way that matters. And yet, you have some sense of entitlement that you should be given a free pass because you're white and male? No way.

Quote:
You're a liberal elitist living in lily White suburban Massachusetts.

Born and raised in northern Jersey lol. I've been to Ohio several times in my life. I've driven through it more. Sorry, NYC, Newark, Jersey, et al, has enough diversity to match that of Ohio.

Quote:
You wouldn't last a day in the real world. How about we go to Johannesburg at 11 pm at night, start at one side of the city and walk towards the other end of the city. We'll see which of us makes it to the other side. The only rules are that you can only take what is on your person or what you can carry with you, and you have to walk, no vehicles. Would you be game for that?

See above I had a Jersey state t-shirt some time ago stating "only the strong survive". Yep.

Quote:
How about the same rules only this time we walk from the South Africa/Zimbabwe border, through Zimbabwe, to Zambia. Are you confident you would make it to the other side?

From the crap that men bring, of all races and creeds, no way. Man on woman violence is a fact of reality. Women always have to be aware. We have to keep ourselves safe. But, I don't buy into the ridiculous idea that it's racially oriented. No way.

Quote:
I believe you meant to say aspiring instead of inspiring. I don't inspire to kill kangaroos, I aspire to do so.
Ok, you aspire to kill. I get it. Although, I fail to see how this desire of yours differentiates you from those you take issue with (IRT violence).
 
Old 02-27-2009, 11:24 PM
 
Location: Ohio
1,008 posts, read 640,290 times
Reputation: 250
Quote:
Originally Posted by Braunwyn View Post
I post all those links and quotes and this is what I get?

Lets be clear here. I tend to be a bit too conservative on some issues (that is the issue I need to work on). I don't care what your color is. I'm of the mind that all people on any kind of welfare should sacrifice their ability to procreate. My conservative father has aligned me with a libertarian dictator. So no, the 'give minorities a free welfare card' doesn't fly with me.

And as far as you being a white man trying to do this or that. Look, if you had an ounce of humility, I would address it. At the end of the day, if you're going to be throwing stones...the same stones I could throw at you, than that doesn't make a lick of sense. You're going to try and pass along the crap that men are more intelligent than women even though I run circles around you in every way that matters. And yet, you have some sense of entitlement that you should be given a free pass because you're white and male? No way.


Born and raised in northern Jersey lol. I've been to Ohio several times in my life. I've driven through it more. Sorry, NYC, Newark, Jersey, et al, has enough diversity to match that of Ohio.


See above I had a Jersey state t-shirt some time ago stating "only the strong survive". Yep.


From the crap that men bring, of all races and creeds, no way. Man on woman violence is a fact of reality. Women always have to be aware. We have to keep ourselves safe. But, I don't buy into the ridiculous idea that it's racially oriented. No way.


Ok, you aspire to kill. I get it. Although, I fail to see how this desire of your differentiates you from those you take issue with (IRT violence).
Would you rather walk through Kentucky or Somalia?


As for your links and studies, I dispute the validity and objectivity of such studies. They set out wanting to prove something and then they arrived at what they wanted to prove. Rushton set out wanting to find out if there was any racial component to intelligence and physical development and he found that it follows the pattern of the rK strategy.

I've read COUNTLESS works/articles where people say race and intelligence have nothing to do with each other. The difference between you and I in regards to research is that I've also read Rushton, extensively, as well as other scientists of similar views, so I've studied both sides of the argument. Heck, I was raised in a society and spent twelve years in a public school system that DEMANDS a near religious adherence to the idea that race and intelligence have nothing to do with each other. After studying the evidence and considering the issue, I've made my decision as to which argument has validity.
 
Old 02-27-2009, 11:35 PM
 
Location: Ohio
1,008 posts, read 640,290 times
Reputation: 250
Quote:
Originally Posted by Braunwyn View Post

From the crap that men bring, of all races and creeds, no way. Man on woman violence is a fact of reality. Women always have to be aware. We have to keep ourselves safe. But, I don't buy into the ridiculous idea that it's racially oriented. No way.

According to the Department of Justice-

In the United States in 2005, 37,460 white females were sexually assaulted or raped by a black man, while between zero and ten black women were sexually assaulted or raped by a white man.


These are reported rapes, if you believe the idea that only 10 percent of rapes are reported, this means that approximately 370,000 White women are raped by Black men, while approximately 0-100 Black women are raped by White men in the USA.

Likewise you can look at prison rape and see a similar dynamic. There are ongoing lawsuits right now with White inmates demanding segregated accommodations since they are tired of being subjected to anal rape by Black inmates.


You're more likely to be raped by a Black stranger than anybody else. After that, I'd have to speculate probably a person of the same race (in your case White) who is at least on somewhat familiar terms with you. Although again, as I said, the second part is speculation, I have no specific facts/data on that. However, there are mountains of data on the first part, about the racial nature of rape.
 
Old 02-27-2009, 11:37 PM
 
Location: The Shires
2,257 posts, read 1,722,489 times
Reputation: 1050
Quote:
Originally Posted by OhioUberAlles View Post
According to the Department of Justice-

In the United States in 2005, 37,460 white females were sexually assaulted or raped by a black man, while between zero and ten black women were sexually assaulted or raped by a white man.


These are reported rapes, if you believe the idea that only 10 percent of rapes are reported, this means that approximately 370,000 White women are raped by Black men, while approximately 0-100 Black women are raped by White men in the USA.

Likewise you can look at prison rape and see a similar dynamic. There are ongoing lawsuits right now with White inmates demanding segregated accommodations since they are tired of being subjected to anal rape by Black inmates.


You're more likely to be raped by a Black stranger than anybody else. After that, I'd have to speculate probably a person of the same race (in your case White) who is at least on somewhat familiar terms with you. Although again, as I said, the second part is speculation, I have no specific facts/data on that. However, there are mountains of data on the first part, about the racial nature of rape.
That's nothing to do with race, per se....black people in the US are far more impoverished (always have been). I don't believe that race has anything to do with one's inclination to go out and commit the disgusting act of rape.
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