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Old 04-09-2009, 08:02 AM
 
Location: Victoria TX
42,668 posts, read 71,653,762 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Greatday View Post

When it comes to doing "official" business with the Governments (Fed, State, City, local), English will be used. When printing ballots and proposition information - it would be in English. When dealing with the Courts, all Court Documents will be in English.
. . . and, in addition to English, any office of any governmental agency may, at its option, choose to provide translations of documents in any other language which might be widely used by its clients. You've got no problem with me on that one. But I think we've already got that. Can you find me an official government document that is in a foreign language and NOT in English?

For example, on an international flight from Mexico City, it would still be legal for immigration landing cards, to be filled out in flight by arriving passengers, to ask the questions in both English and Spanish. OK? Instead of forcing the flight attendants to individually assist each of 200 passengers in filling out the cards.

Last edited by jtur88; 04-09-2009 at 08:12 AM..
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Old 04-09-2009, 08:59 AM
 
Location: Washington DC
5,915 posts, read 7,090,991 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Greatday View Post
Very polite comeback

When the issue of an "official" language is raised, many respond - incorrectly - as you did. NO ONE is suggesting an official "spoken" language. You are, will be welcome to speak whatever language you wish to -

When it comes to doing "official" business with the Governments (Fed, State, City, local), English will be used. When printing ballots and proposition information - it would be in English. When dealing with the Courts, all Court Documents will be in English.
It's not true today and I doubt it will ever be true. I don't doubt that a minority of the population would like to make that the law.
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Old 04-09-2009, 09:19 AM
 
Location: Pinal County, Arizona
25,107 posts, read 34,391,056 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rlchurch View Post
It's not true today and I doubt it will ever be true. I don't doubt that a minority of the population would like to make that the law.
All legal documents must be in English to be enforced TODAY. The "official" language of the Courts in the US today is ENGLISH.
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Old 04-09-2009, 10:50 AM
ECG
 
Location: In the minds of others
42,606 posts, read 2,467,517 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Redisca View Post
I am against having an official language. I think we are slowly getting bugged down in symbolism, and this is very alarming to me. This country won its independence, defended it, and flourished in its early days without an official language, official religion, or official culture (in fact, for a while, without a flag or a national anthem). Contrary to popular opinion, those are not the things that hold a country together. Legislating culture is one of the first indications of a declining society -- so I'd say we have to refrain from it for as long as we can.

I am also against having any "national languages". Partly, it's because of the reasons outlined above -- that we don't want to give so much importance to symbolism. Additionally, having several national languages seems to confer greater legitimacy on some groups than on others. This may work in a European country that is made up of what used to be separate medieval principalities where different languages were always spoken -- in Switzerland, for instance, speakers of Italian, German and French are indigenous, and making those languages "national" has nothing to do with being "civilized" and everything to do with how modern Switzerland's nationhood was negotiated in the first place. However, in a country of immigrants, like the US, adopting such a practice would have the effect of deeming certain ethnic groups less integrated than others merely on the basis of ethnicity. (By the way, for those who reflexively praise Europe for anything and everything it does, it would be a good idea to realize that the policy of having several "national languages" is actually exclusionary -- and thus symbolically discriminatory.) Also, having several national languages would create an administrative burden that I believe is unnecessary. Finally, while I don't believe we should spontaneously switch to Navajo or something, granting one or more European languages the official status of a "national language" would be an insult to Native Americans -- though of course, it would just be a drop in the bucket.

Assuming you are talking about consumer products manufactured by private companies, this actually means you WOULD outlaw other languages. Apart from the teensy-weensy little fact that this would violate the First Amendment, it would hurt business: after all, when companies inscribe their packaging in foreign language, it's because they target a specific market, and preventing them from doing so interferes with their marketing strategy. It would also hurt consumers: some of those boxes are initially destined for export elsewhere, but distributors get them on the cheap; make such packaging illegal, and kiss the discounts good-bye.

Finally, I wish native-born Americans were a little more sensitive to what it takes to integrate in another country. Speaking as a first-generation immigrant (legal, okay?), I have to say that immigrants need businesses and products in their native language to help them adapt here. Immigration takes a TREMENDOUS psychological toll on people. When I recall my life before immigrating, I feel like all those things happened to someone else or something I read in a book; I feel as if I did not exist before the age 13; and it's even harder for people who immigrate as adults. It's not easy -- I suppose not unlike living with retrograde amnesia. Even if you speak English and your family does too -- having access to cafes with menus in your language, and waiters who speak it, and stores, sales people, products, newspapers -- all that eases the shock of the transition. You guys take our integration for granted, so I would have you know it's no walk in the park. If you won't print voting ballots in 25 languages -- fine. But leave private companies that choose to do business in other languages alone. For many people, they are life savers.

"Best of the Best" Post I have read here on C-D...Agree with you 100%
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Old 04-09-2009, 11:03 AM
 
Location: Washington DC
5,915 posts, read 7,090,991 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Greatday View Post
All legal documents must be in English to be enforced TODAY. The "official" language of the Courts in the US today is ENGLISH.
Nonsense. Courts in the Southwest regularly deal with legal documents written is Spanish. They may have to be translated for the court to understand them, but the legal document can be any language at all.
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Old 04-09-2009, 11:06 AM
 
Location: Pinal County, Arizona
25,107 posts, read 34,391,056 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rlchurch View Post
Nonsense. Courts in the Southwest regularly deal with legal documents written is Spanish. They may have to be translated for the court to understand them, but the legal document can be any language at all.
Sorry to disappoint you but, the ENFORCEABLE documents are only in English. You are correct in that there are spanish / english translations but ONLY the English are entered into evidence. Court actions are transcribed ONLY in English
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Old 04-09-2009, 08:46 PM
 
30 posts, read 47,112 times
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I see this topic has tuned into a beast. Currently, there are 150,00 people coming here(U.S.) legally and 800,000 illegally every month. How many jobs were lost in the last quater alone? Dosn't leave much for people who were born here does it? And now those genuses in the white house are thinking about passing a bill that would help 12 million illegal immigrants(that we know are here, could be more) become citizens. You think there comin' here to pick agricultural products? If you think that you have a convoluted sense of reality. It not gonna' start hitting home until you can't find a job or lose the one you currently have. American dream, yea right!
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Old 04-10-2009, 09:20 AM
 
Location: Washington DC
5,915 posts, read 7,090,991 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Greatday View Post
Sorry to disappoint you but, the ENFORCEABLE documents are only in English. You are correct in that there are spanish / english translations but ONLY the English are entered into evidence. Court actions are transcribed ONLY in English
Certainly not true in Texas. I don't know about dogpatch. How about quoting the law that says enforceable contracts must be in English.
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Old 04-10-2009, 11:22 AM
 
Location: Victoria TX
42,668 posts, read 71,653,762 times
Reputation: 35885
A contract, in civil law, is enforceable, even if it is verbal, in any language. A contract is a binding agreement between two parties to perform certain specified considerations. If a person agrees to do something, he is bound by law to do it, regardless of how the contract is uttered.

Criminal justice is also a separate matter. Constitutional due process requires that a defendant have a full right to present evidence in his defense, and it would be a violation of the constitution to restrict a defendant to presenting evidence only in a language that he does not know. You cannot put a man in prison for no other reason than that he could not testify in English. Not in the America that I live in.

There is no country on earth that makes its official language so restrictive as to obstruct those two points.
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Old 04-10-2009, 11:47 AM
 
Location: Pinal County, Arizona
25,107 posts, read 34,391,056 times
Reputation: 4893
Quote:
Originally Posted by rlchurch View Post
Certainly not true in Texas. I don't know about dogpatch. How about quoting the law that says enforceable contracts must be in English.
Check out the UCC

Check out the Statute of Frauds

Check out case law - all jurisdictions
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