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Old 11-21-2008, 07:04 PM
 
Location: Not where you ever lived
11,544 posts, read 25,075,396 times
Reputation: 6183

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There is in my opinion, a underlying ugly current in this country that is below the surface that threatens to erupt into another Civil War. It is fueled by TV and raido enterrtainors who masquerade as truthful while their rehetoric is couched to enflame passions. We are not red, blue, left, right, liberal, neo-con, left wing, right wing, racist, bigoted poor ignorant Christians, Jews, Muslims, Mexicans, blacks, gays, white, supremist, skinhead, ignorant, red-neck, Kikes, dagos, etc,, We are AMERICANS. Most of our ancestors did NOT look like us.

Our country is in big trouble. The "Trickle Down Economics" practiced the last eight years stopped working six weeks ago.The unemployed and underemployed is reaching the level of the 1930s when the stock market crashed and Uncle Sam was forced to open bread lines and food kitchens.
We cannot afford to listen to mean spirited talking heads for they are dangerous. These people have enough money to weather any economic storm. Most us do not. We do not have Donald Trump, Warren Buffet, Rupert Murdoch or T. Boone Pickens to bail us out or pick us up. We have no one but each other..

WE THE PEOPLE have to pick ourselves up and help each other and weather this mess together. . Volunteer. Help at a food bank, at a nursing home. Do what you can to help those who are less fortunate than you. We have to keep nursing homes, hospitals and flop houses openl winter is here. We have to take care of pets. and babies and children for they are our future and they are the innocents. It's cold and they are hungry. Not everyone lives in sunny californnia or on a beach in florida.

Help stop the rhetoric. Don't play into it. It's gonna get worse before ti gets better. There has been no president in American history that ever walked into an encomic meltdown of this proportionn while we were fighting two wars. WE HAVE TO HELP OURSEVES AND EACH OTHER.
It isn't going to go away and there is a large possibility we may lose pensions, medical care and maybe even SSI or SS before it is over.

My spouse and I are old and probably won't live long enough to see the end of this. but there are millions of children who might if we all help each other. But to do this we have to stop the devisive rhetoric and moderate the tone. We have to stop the rhetoric.

Let's start by closing this thread. We don't need to talk about the Klan or any other hate group.
We have plenty of problems to solve and other ways to feel better than this.
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Old 11-21-2008, 09:39 PM
 
Location: Aiken S.C
765 posts, read 1,680,569 times
Reputation: 388
Quote:
Originally Posted by linicx View Post
There is in my opinion, a underlying ugly current in this country that is below the surface that threatens to erupt into another Civil War. It is fueled by TV and raido enterrtainors who masquerade as truthful while their rehetoric is couched to enflame passions. We are not red, blue, left, right, liberal, neo-con, left wing, right wing, racist, bigoted poor ignorant Christians, Jews, Muslims, Mexicans, blacks, gays, white, supremist, skinhead, ignorant, red-neck, Kikes, dagos, etc,, We are AMERICANS. Most of our ancestors did NOT look like us.

Our country is in big trouble. The "Trickle Down Economics" practiced the last eight years stopped working six weeks ago.The unemployed and underemployed is reaching the level of the 1930s when the stock market crashed and Uncle Sam was forced to open bread lines and food kitchens.
We cannot afford to listen to mean spirited talking heads for they are dangerous. These people have enough money to weather any economic storm. Most us do not. We do not have Donald Trump, Warren Buffet, Rupert Murdoch or T. Boone Pickens to bail us out or pick us up. We have no one but each other..

WE THE PEOPLE have to pick ourselves up and help each other and weather this mess together. . Volunteer. Help at a food bank, at a nursing home. Do what you can to help those who are less fortunate than you. We have to keep nursing homes, hospitals and flop houses openl winter is here. We have to take care of pets. and babies and children for they are our future and they are the innocents. It's cold and they are hungry. Not everyone lives in sunny californnia or on a beach in florida.

Help stop the rhetoric. Don't play into it. It's gonna get worse before ti gets better. There has been no president in American history that ever walked into an encomic meltdown of this proportionn while we were fighting two wars. WE HAVE TO HELP OURSEVES AND EACH OTHER.
It isn't going to go away and there is a large possibility we may lose pensions, medical care and maybe even SSI or SS before it is over.

My spouse and I are old and probably won't live long enough to see the end of this. but there are millions of children who might if we all help each other. But to do this we have to stop the devisive rhetoric and moderate the tone. We have to stop the rhetoric.

Let's start by closing this thread. We don't need to talk about the Klan or any other hate group.
We have plenty of problems to solve and other ways to feel better than this.
With all due respect this is a debate forum and if it upsets you maybe it's not for you.
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Old 11-21-2008, 10:40 PM
 
48,519 posts, read 81,013,914 times
Reputation: 17978
Looking at that is like loking at a story on left wing hate groups and is that persons view. It seem that reagan has alot of threats and two attempts on national televison. Hasn't been anything like that since the 60's.So its just a comment;altho I think there are always alot of threats neither I or the person are aware of because we are not in a position to know.
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Old 11-22-2008, 03:47 AM
 
12,870 posts, read 12,772,010 times
Reputation: 4446
Quote:
Originally Posted by linicx View Post
There is in my opinion, a underlying ugly current in this country that is below the surface that threatens to erupt into another Civil War. It is fueled by TV and raido enterrtainors who masquerade as truthful while their rehetoric is couched to enflame passions. We are not red, blue, left, right, liberal, neo-con, left wing, right wing, racist, bigoted poor ignorant Christians, Jews, Muslims, Mexicans, blacks, gays, white, supremist, skinhead, ignorant, red-neck, Kikes, dagos, etc,, We are AMERICANS. Most of our ancestors did NOT look like us.

Our country is in big trouble. The "Trickle Down Economics" practiced the last eight years stopped working six weeks ago.The unemployed and underemployed is reaching the level of the 1930s when the stock market crashed and Uncle Sam was forced to open bread lines and food kitchens.
We cannot afford to listen to mean spirited talking heads for they are dangerous. These people have enough money to weather any economic storm. Most us do not. We do not have Donald Trump, Warren Buffet, Rupert Murdoch or T. Boone Pickens to bail us out or pick us up. We have no one but each other..

WE THE PEOPLE have to pick ourselves up and help each other and weather this mess together. . Volunteer. Help at a food bank, at a nursing home. Do what you can to help those who are less fortunate than you. We have to keep nursing homes, hospitals and flop houses openl winter is here. We have to take care of pets. and babies and children for they are our future and they are the innocents. It's cold and they are hungry. Not everyone lives in sunny californnia or on a beach in florida.

Help stop the rhetoric. Don't play into it. It's gonna get worse before ti gets better. There has been no president in American history that ever walked into an encomic meltdown of this proportionn while we were fighting two wars. WE HAVE TO HELP OURSEVES AND EACH OTHER.
It isn't going to go away and there is a large possibility we may lose pensions, medical care and maybe even SSI or SS before it is over.

My spouse and I are old and probably won't live long enough to see the end of this. but there are millions of children who might if we all help each other. But to do this we have to stop the devisive rhetoric and moderate the tone. We have to stop the rhetoric.

Let's start by closing this thread. We don't need to talk about the Klan or any other hate group.
We have plenty of problems to solve and other ways to feel better than this.
i suppose "we the people" are going to be united by pulling money from one group to give to another. will the middle class be outraged when they pull money from them to give to the "poor", working or not? what happened to the idea of the whole country working together instead of taking from each other? we don't have a very good game plan for unity in the future.
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Old 11-22-2008, 07:20 AM
 
Location: Aiken S.C
765 posts, read 1,680,569 times
Reputation: 388
Quote:
Originally Posted by floridasandy View Post
i suppose "we the people" are going to be united by pulling money from one group to give to another. will the middle class be outraged when they pull money from them to give to the "poor", working or not? what happened to the idea of the whole country working together instead of taking from each other? we don't have a very good game plan for unity in the future.
The money you speak of is coming from the wealthy to benefit the middle class and the poor did you bother to read the plan??? Or is this what you were told to think?
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Old 11-23-2008, 08:42 PM
 
Location: On the "Left Coast", somewhere in "the Land of Fruits & Nuts"
8,367 posts, read 8,269,291 times
Reputation: 5901
Quote:
Originally Posted by cap1717 View Post
had a story on right - wing hate groups, (KKK, skinheads, and a bunch of others that are not "household words") The comentator said that there are always a bunch of "death threats" against the winning candidate, after every election, but that the number of threats this year is, in his words, unprecidented.
Please discuss your views on (organized) hate groups. . . are these ALL right wing groups? Are any of them, that you know of, "liberal"?
Dunno that all hate groups are necessarily right wing groups, but research has been done on the motivations underlying right wingers, most notably by Psychologist Robert Altemeyer, who identified a personality type he labeled as Right-wing authoritarianism (RWA).

And he found that all right wing personality types shared certain qualities:
Authoritarian submission — a high degree of submission to the authorities who are perceived to be established and legitimate in the society in which one lives.
Authoritarian aggression — a general aggressiveness, directed against various persons, that is perceived to be sanctioned by established authorities.
Conventionalism — a high degree of adherence to the social conventions that are perceived to be endorsed by society and its established authorities. (Source: Altemeyer, 1996, Chapter 1)

He also noted that the "right-wing" in right-wing authoritarianism does not refer to someone's politics but to his personality. It means the person has a strong need to submit to those he considers the established authorities in society. Thus, "right-wing authoritarians show little preference in general for any political party," but their prevalence in the Republican party reflects that they are simply less likely to rise in the Democratic party. Or in other words, the Republican party is simply a more hospitable environment for this type of personality. Right-wing Authoritarianism
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Old 11-24-2008, 04:59 AM
 
Location: Phoenix, AZ
3,088 posts, read 4,543,187 times
Reputation: 1598
Quote:
Originally Posted by mateo45 View Post
Dunno that all hate groups are necessarily right wing groups, but research has been done on the motivations underlying right wingers, most notably by Psychologist Robert Altemeyer, who identified a personality type he labeled as Right-wing authoritarianism (RWA).

And he found that all right wing personality types shared certain qualities:
Authoritarian submission a high degree of submission to the authorities who are perceived to be established and legitimate in the society in which one lives.
Authoritarian aggression a general aggressiveness, directed against various persons, that is perceived to be sanctioned by established authorities.
Conventionalism a high degree of adherence to the social conventions that are perceived to be endorsed by society and its established authorities. (Source: Altemeyer, 1996, Chapter 1)

He also noted that the "right-wing" in right-wing authoritarianism does not refer to someone's politics but to his personality. It means the person has a strong need to submit to those he considers the established authorities in society. Thus, "right-wing authoritarians show little preference in general for any political party," but their prevalence in the Republican party reflects that they are simply less likely to rise in the Democratic party. Or in other words, the Republican party is simply a more hospitable environment for this type of personality. Right-wing Authoritarianism
Interesting post, Mateo, thanks.

To those who cite ACLU, Peta, etc. as "left wing" hate groups. . . you're kidding, right? ACLU protects the civil liberties of ALL AMERICANS, the fact that you may personally disagree that all should have civil liberties does not make them a hate group! Peta, very strange folk, I agree, but they do not kill people! Property damage is a criminal activity, for sure, but I am talking about "plotting assasination", not throwing paint!
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Old 11-24-2008, 09:42 AM
 
Location: Somewhere out there
9,616 posts, read 11,062,995 times
Reputation: 3717
Default NPR and right-wing groups....

Regarding the info on "Authoritarian Submission" as an identifiable personality "tag": interesting! As an alternate to this hypothesis, I have personally observed, in Kanada at least, a vast preference by the left-thinking BSMs (Bleating Sheeple-Masses) to just obey whatever the government blats out. I will note, with sad but sincere admiration, the exception of those Canadians who still try to sustain some semblance of original British "pluck", self-determinationism, and intellectual independance. But in my mind, based on a lot of observation, it's the lefties in Western society who are more prone to just go with whatever the authorities say.

There is a tendency with NPR to, of course, steer their articles to the left, anti-right. It can be as simple as the inflective tone in a sentence, a joke at the expense of the Rep party or a generalized dig at the lame-duck Bush Admin. Wonder what would happen if they were to purposefully try to paint Bush in the best possible light? Highlight, say, his good environmental legislation, or his wife's educational directives towards reading, etc. Of course we're left to come to our own supposedly enlightened conclusions as well-informed Americans, but in reality, we're all led by the nose. Does that bother anyone else?

I feel that to bad-mouth right-wingers through associating them with extremist groups is to purposely feed the fires of bias. As noted by several posters above, there's plenty of extremists supporting socialist or lefty causes. Perhaps however those guys are presented as somehow good, a sort of Robin Hood activism?

I wonder what NPR's stance will be on Schummer's toxic Fairness Doctrine legislation? PS: I listen to NPR a lot. It's very much like Kanada's CBC in providing a lot of v. interesting topics and perspectives, but like the CBC, they are government sponsored and won't bite the left hand that feeds them. It's just up to us to sort out the wheat from the chaff.
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Old 11-24-2008, 09:57 AM
 
Location: Somewhere out there
9,616 posts, read 11,062,995 times
Reputation: 3717
Thumbs down This is bothersome!

Quote:
Originally Posted by linicx View Post
But to do this we have to stop the devisive rhetoric and moderate the tone. We have to stop the rhetoric.

Let's start by closing this thread. We don't need to talk about the Klan or any other hate group.

We have plenty of problems to solve and other ways to feel better than this.
Well linicx, I appreciate your idea of moderating our rancor, but, truthfully, the opportunity to openly discuss our differences of opinion is one of the key components of our society that makes it truly great. Not rhetorically great, but "ugly-warts-and-all" great. Yes, some, or all, of us get a bit wingy from time to time on these forums, but again, what's the alternative. I for one have learned a lot over the past couple of months involvement on C-D. This is my first exposure to open forums, and while I ranted at first without too much "pre-think" I now try at least a bit to carefully consider the debater's alternate perspective.

Your call to silence such dialog is, frankly, a bit scary. If you personally don't see the value, perhaps you should just sign off and not read anything here except the Gardening threads? I'm not trying to insult you, sir, but this is the Great Debates forum, even has its own special rules given the potential for hot topics.

That's also what makes it so valuable. I even imagine our fellow tax-paying government employees and citizens carefully watching these controversial posts. (Hi guys! Love yah!).

The Greeks and Romans learned a long time ago the value of open debate, esp. about controversial issues. Such debate seems to always lead to improvements in the quality of the fabric of our society. Absence of such discussions is far more damaging. I hope you see my point.

Last edited by rifleman; 11-24-2008 at 09:59 AM.. Reason: typos
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Old 11-24-2008, 11:25 AM
 
Location: Not where you ever lived
11,544 posts, read 25,075,396 times
Reputation: 6183
Quote:
Originally Posted by rifleman View Post

Your call to silence such dialog is, frankly, a bit scary. If you personally don't see the value, perhaps you should just sign off and not read anything here except the Gardening threads? I'm not trying to insult you, sir, but this is the Great Debates forum, even has its own special rules given the potential for hot topics.
Yes, I do see your point and actually do agree to some extent, but I don't think you see mine. Society can have a Great Debate and even enter into social intercourse in polite society. My objection is not the content or the meat on the bone. We can not have a real debate if all we do is use labels to fan the flame of division and hate.
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