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Old 02-11-2009, 10:28 AM
 
Location: Portsmouth Virginia
411 posts, read 849,893 times
Reputation: 185
Quote:
Originally Posted by weluvpa View Post
Kanjorski already talked about damming the river......Dams are not good for the river and I would hate to see the world class smallmouth fishing that the river provides disappear. The river is a huge natural resource for tourism, its just not promoted like the Delaware is. Which is a good and a bad thing for our area. More pressure on the river...Not good....More tourism dollars.......Good

Its a very fine line when the pressure out weighs the dollar......A line that is never paid attention to.

The Susquehanna in my mind is a nicer river then the Delaware and it see little traffic in comparison. Leave it alone or we will lose it. Protect it and maintain it and it will provide.
I am with Dan. One of the problems with our fisheries came from the damming of the rivers along the fall line on the East Coast. Anadromous fish like shad, stripped bass and the like are blocked from their spawning grounds. The reduced numbers of shad and herring affect the food web of the bays and oceans. Many of the dams have been removed here in Virginia and I think they are working on getting a means of moving fish back up into the Susquehanna at Holtwood Dam. Our tremendous energy demands could not be met even if we were to dam every river in every suitable spot. By the way, you can't just decide that any place would be a suitable spot. There needs to be a substantial drop in altitude or you need to dam the river valley and flood out everything..think Wallenpaupak.

I think a leaner approach would be better to make a business out of the river. Sell its appeal as a destination for boater, canoeist, kayakers, fishermen, ecotoursim.

 
Old 02-11-2009, 01:11 PM
 
Location: Prepperland
7,864 posts, read 4,175,200 times
Reputation: 3272
Quote:
Originally Posted by NEPA-x-pat View Post
Our tremendous energy demands could not be met even if we were to dam every river in every suitable spot.
No one solution purports to supply all the energy needed to replace the 13.6 million barrels of oil per day, imported into the USA. But every kilowatt helps!

And of all the alternatives to fossil fuel power sources, hydropower is most consistent.

Quote:
Originally Posted by NEPA-x-pat View Post
By the way, you can't just decide that any place would be a suitable spot.
Of course not. You choose dam sites to fulfill specifications.

See the TVA for reference. The navigable sections are made from LOW HEAD dams, with locks. The high head dams are on the tributaries, in the mountains. Controlling inflow of water is crucial in preventing future floods of the Susquehanna watershed.

"Small" dams of the TVA
Nottely Dam - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Blue Ridge Dam - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Fontana Dam - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


Quote:
Originally Posted by NEPA-x-pat View Post
I think a leaner approach would be better to make a business out of the river. Sell its appeal as a destination for boater, canoeist, kayakers, fishermen, ecotoursim.
Making a business out of the river IS part of the plan with engineering the Susquehanna. Once you remove the flooding risk, the levees can come down, and shoreline development (and wildlife reservations) can be established.

Water power is not just power from water, but what a ready supply of tame water represents: flood control, irrigation in times of drought, transportation, aquaculture, and habitat expansion.

The Susquehanna watershed represents a disproportionate number of decaying / dying communities, in contrast to other parts of the nation.
Reversing that trend requires a bold vision and a plan that offers long term benefits, far beyond the status quo.

Go check out the TVA, and imagine what the Susquehanna river might be like, if it was navigable from Clearfield to Unadilla to Corning to Raystown to the Chesapeake Bay. Imagine the opportunities.

I think you might also want to insure that access to the "Goodies" aren't limited. For example, stipulate that where riverfront development is allowed, reserve a portion for the locals who aren't rich nor politically connected.
One possibility - reserve 10% of the water front lots for time-share condominiums available for long term locals. For every ten years residency, you can buy a 2-week block, at a nominal price, from the SRA.
 
Old 02-11-2009, 01:48 PM
 
Location: Prepperland
7,864 posts, read 4,175,200 times
Reputation: 3272
This could be a riverside town on the Susquehanna ...
http://en.wikivisual.com/images/f/fd/Calder_and_hebble.jpg (broken link)
 
Old 02-11-2009, 01:52 PM
 
Location: Prepperland
7,864 posts, read 4,175,200 times
Reputation: 3272
Chinese version of a canal suburb
 
Old 02-11-2009, 01:58 PM
 
Location: Polish Hill, Pittsburgh, PA
26,225 posts, read 45,926,935 times
Reputation: 11059
Before any sort of large-scale recreational project like this should be considered, NEPA must collectively overcome the "Susquehanna = icky, lumpy, and brown" mindset. Pittston has a beautiful riverfront park that nobody uses. I think the upcoming completion of the larger-scale commons area in Wilkes-Barre will be more heavily-utilized because of the population density downtown, but even then many folks are just ignorant of what a huge asset this river is for our region.
 
Old 02-11-2009, 02:42 PM
 
Location: Prepperland
7,864 posts, read 4,175,200 times
Reputation: 3272
Quote:
Originally Posted by ScranBarre View Post
Before any sort of large-scale recreational project like this should be considered, NEPA must collectively overcome the "Susquehanna = icky, lumpy, and brown" mindset. Pittston has a beautiful riverfront park that nobody uses. I think the upcoming completion of the larger-scale commons area in Wilkes-Barre will be more heavily-utilized because of the population density downtown, but even then many folks are just ignorant of what a huge asset this river is for our region.
One benefit of a series of dams and lakes would be to improve water quality. By stabilizing the water level and eliminating the levees, a more natural river shore could be made. Wetlands, too.
 
Old 02-11-2009, 02:43 PM
 
Location: Drama Central
4,084 posts, read 5,690,457 times
Reputation: 1845
The Susquehanna river below the Lackawanna is icky and lumpy and thats the reality. Paul I'll take you on a paddle trip farther up stream and you would be amazed, two totally different worlds.
 
Old 02-11-2009, 05:31 PM
 
539 posts, read 149,927 times
Reputation: 138
Default Uncle George

Quote:
Originally Posted by W-B proud View Post
Buddy, you're preaching to the choir here. Do you think any of us enjoy being raped of over half our salaries in taxes? What do you propose we do about it? Our esteemed government spent trillions of dollars of our money to make sure the U.S.A can destroy the entire world many times over at a push of a few buttons. They can nuke Earth...what?... one thousand times over? How many millions of "sheeple" would we have to organize to fight that? Two billion people organizing with torches and pitchforks wouldn't even frighten our government that can technically destroy us all at will. The let's take back our government is a nice dream, but let's face it, we are powerless. Like I said earlier, we cannot even organize ten people to get outraged enough at our greedy, corrupt Luzerne County government too fight for thier rights by protesting this embarrassment, but I was at the hockey game the other night and it was almost sold out?! As long as people happily bend over and take it in the you know what, and don't even bat an eyebrow, they will continue to run ruffshot right over us. So let the unwashed masses continue to drink beer and listen to ROCK 107 and watch The Family Guy. Ignorance is bliss, and this country is overflowing with tens of millions of ignorant people (just the way our government wants us) that are totally oblivious to what is going on in the real world. Most people in America get more upset if thier football team loses a game, then the fact that our government just handed over our treasury and all our money to Goldman Sach's, Fanny Mae, Freddy Mack and the rest of thier greedy Wall St friends that are spending OUR money further enriching themselves, buying personal jets, going to fancy spas and resorts, giving themselves outrageous bonuses that equal more then any of us will make in a lifetime. But who cares... The 76ers are playing this weekend!. I hate to say it, but we almost deserve it. It's a shame but it is what it is. This country needs another Martin Luther King or someone. A leader that can organize millions of people to stand up against injustice and actually DO SOMETHING ABOUT WHAT IS HAPPENING TO OUR COUNTRY!!! Most people are much more content grumbling over it with friends at the local corner bar though.
George Carlin said it best a couple of years before he passed. "It's a Big Club, and you're not in it". Those that have are going to always try to keep it away from those that do not have.
 
Old 02-11-2009, 07:25 PM
 
Location: Northeastern Pa.
80 posts, read 138,406 times
Reputation: 63
I have got to give you credit for putting a lot into your OP, But.

Pipe dream indeed!
With the economic situation today you will never live long enough to see it happen. I can tell by your post and links that you donít spend much time on the river. on the Computer, but not on the river itself.

I DO. I am an avid kayaker and smallmouth fisherman and spend considerable time on our river.

[coal man,I am a Lot Road regular. We may have met]

I have paddled from above Towanda to Berwick and seen what she has to offer.
There is an enthusiasm in all the small towns along the river recently that is very heartening to see.
New community launch sites are being built river festivals are on the calendar for several towns .Camp sites are being put together in these little towns for sojourners to enjoy as they traverse down river.

Build a Dam? For what? To collect the acid mine water that would filter out naturally as it goes downstream?

NODAMNDams

Last edited by olbluesguy; 02-11-2009 at 07:40 PM..
 
Old 02-11-2009, 09:16 PM
 
Location: Prepperland
7,864 posts, read 4,175,200 times
Reputation: 3272
Quote:
Originally Posted by olbluesguy View Post
With the economic situation today you will never live long enough to see it happen.

I am an avid kayaker and smallmouth fisherman and spend considerable time on our river.

There is an enthusiasm in all the small towns along the river recently that is very heartening to see.
New community launch sites are being built river festivals are on the calendar for several towns .Camp sites are being put together in these little towns for sojourners to enjoy as they traverse down river.

Build a Dam? For what? To collect the acid mine water that would filter out naturally as it goes downstream?

NODAMNDams
In years past, when I lived in the Triple cities, I would take my Folbot on the Susquehanna and the tributaries in the area. So I may not live on the river, now, but I once did.

Not one dam - a series of low head dams and locks to facilitate shipping / boating from the Chesapeake to the practical limits - and high head dams on the tributaries in the mountains to prevent inrush of water and moderate the river level.

According to the reports on the Chesapeake, much of the pollution comes from the Susquehanna river. A series of dams would allow moderation of pollution, via wetlands and natural filtration, as well as allowing settlement of silt. That's a big win-win.

And for those who miss migratory fish - locks would certainly allow fish to migrate up and down stream. But fish ladders and other means should be included - belt and suspenders.

And all those small towns and their festivals would be that much more festive if they could tear down the levees, rebuild natural shores, establish parks and so forth.

This may be an ideal time to present such a grand dream as a long term economic stimulus package, too.
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