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Old 08-19-2009, 10:57 AM
 
4,529 posts, read 4,740,608 times
Reputation: 730

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Quote:
Originally Posted by jungeon View Post
I don't even buy that. Crazy people have the right to own guns. If the founding fathers never wanted crazy people aka people with demons to have guns they would have written any can own a gun except for cripple and crazy people but they did not. There were far more criminals back then and people got hanged for stealing bread. The founding fathers knew what they were doing and don't need liberals intruding in our lives. Criminals also have the right to own guns because they are the people most likely to encounter other criminals and need t defend themselves.
While we certainly have a right to own firearms, the g'ment still has the right to limit and legislate.

Local, State, and even Federal level g'ments can still mandate C&C licensing, registration, limits on caliber and magazine capacity, etc. Obtaining special permits even allows one to own military grade firearms as well.

BTW, criminals, those that haven't been convicted (yet) have every right as a citizen to legally obtain firearms and the neccessary registrations and licensing. The insane simply do not retain that right or several other rights (BTW, in that period of our history, the insane were thrown into bedlams and not allowed to roam free), nor do convicted criminals who, through their actions, have voluntarily given up many rights.

Just as there isn't any absolute "free speech", there is no absolute right to own whatever weapons you wish, whenever you wish. For example, you have no inherent right to preach on private property, whether political or religious, nor do you have an inherent right to carry a firearm on private property without the express permission of the property owner as well.

You also have no inherent right to carry a firearm on public property while in the presence of the POTUS, judges, congressmen, or other high profile public figures. While we have a right to own firearms, their safety trumps any right to carry in their presence.

 
Old 08-19-2009, 11:46 AM
 
Location: NW Nevada
13,340 posts, read 10,911,844 times
Reputation: 12290
Quote:
Originally Posted by AxisMundi View Post
While we certainly have a right to own firearms, the g'ment still has the right to limit and legislate.

Local, State, and even Federal level g'ments can still mandate C&C licensing, registration, limits on caliber and magazine capacity, etc. Obtaining special permits even allows one to own military grade firearms as well.

BTW, criminals, those that haven't been convicted (yet) have every right as a citizen to legally obtain firearms and the neccessary registrations and licensing. The insane simply do not retain that right or several other rights (BTW, in that period of our history, the insane were thrown into bedlams and not allowed to roam free), nor do convicted criminals who, through their actions, have voluntarily given up many rights.

Just as there isn't any absolute "free speech", there is no absolute right to own whatever weapons you wish, whenever you wish. For example, you have no inherent right to preach on private property, whether political or religious, nor do you have an inherent right to carry a firearm on private property without the express permission of the property owner as well.

You also have no inherent right to carry a firearm on public property while in the presence of the POTUS, judges, congressmen, or other high profile public figures. While we have a right to own firearms, their safety trumps any right to carry in their presence.
Kinda gettin' nitpicky here, but, I'm at my local store , or wherever, in public, some politician, judge, whatever, and their entourage pull up, I'm carrying my weapon, legally, on my CCW, what do I do? The 'visit' is unannounced, so who is in the wrong here? Judges, and many other politicians, frequent public places, is that a reason to deny CCW, or open carry, in ALL public places? Or, are we only talking about planned events, and important federal figures?
 
Old 08-19-2009, 12:14 PM
 
191 posts, read 713,416 times
Reputation: 183
There is a gun ban of sorts in England, and there is an epidemic of "yob" youth gangs attacking people with everything except guns. Bats, pipes, kicking with work boots, fists, etc. Recently they attacked someone with a python. How many news stories out of the UK end with a quote like, "Its not safe to go out on the town anymore." Now the violent crime rate in England is one of the worst in Europe. Want stats and sources - go ahead, Google it.

That gun ban didn't work out too well for England, and it wouldn't work for us, either.
 
Old 08-19-2009, 12:31 PM
 
Location: San Fernando Valley, CA
1,719 posts, read 6,031,228 times
Reputation: 781
I didn't read past the first post...no need to.

but if,

A) we take away all guns except for LEOs, we'd be in a whole heap of trouble.

B) we took ALL guns away from anyone living in America, we'd be Amerikstan by next week. Or North Koreamerika!

In conclusion, this idea is just a wet dream for some. Not realistic.
 
Old 08-19-2009, 12:41 PM
 
812 posts, read 2,079,711 times
Reputation: 467
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hungry For Cheese View Post
I didn't read past the first post...no need to.

but if,

A) we take away all guns except for LEOs, we'd be in a whole heap of trouble.

B) we took ALL guns away from anyone living in America, we'd be Amerikstan by next week. Or North Koreamerika!

In conclusion, this idea is just a wet dream for some. Not realistic.
lol. outsiders who hate americans actually prefer you keep your guns and shoot eachother.
 
Old 08-19-2009, 12:46 PM
 
Location: vagabond
2,631 posts, read 4,833,296 times
Reputation: 1300
Quote:
Originally Posted by leaana View Post
lol. outsiders who hate americans actually prefer you keep your guns and shoot eachother.
that desire would be perpetrated by the image that they get from hollywood and religiously believe, that america is one giant wild west shootout and that we all settle arguments and minor conflicts with two smoking barrels.

luckily for us, hollywood is not very accurate about almost anything.
 
Old 08-19-2009, 01:43 PM
 
Location: San Fernando Valley, CA
1,719 posts, read 6,031,228 times
Reputation: 781
Yeah I don't believe for one second that if we rid our guns, weapons like missles etc...that NK or someone else would not immediately come and tear us a new one...and/or take over.
 
Old 08-19-2009, 01:56 PM
 
1,310 posts, read 2,641,567 times
Reputation: 581
Quote:
Originally Posted by rarch View Post
Would a gun free USA be possible for the USA or just a ideal of pacifists, and religous types or would this mark the US becoming a moral and decent society if this were to occur
Its possible .... only if you can convince the bad guys to turn in their weapons ! Until that happens, the good guys need to level the playing field with them so ourselves and our families can be protected from people who have a very low opinion of anothers Life. Yes, if it were to occur, America would be on the road to moral recovery ; but then there are sooo many other moral issues plaguing this nation that its just never going to get out of the sewer vortex that its in. Have you noticed how it really started going downhill once God was no longer desired in american society, nor his absolute moral laws to live by (?) . A secular humanist society where 'morals' are relative to how one feels at any given time, isnt working too well is it ? America is completely and utterly lost and helpless and by the time your grandchildren are your age, it will have totally collapsed in on itself (unrestrained anarchy) .
 
Old 08-19-2009, 04:09 PM
 
4,529 posts, read 4,740,608 times
Reputation: 730
Quote:
Originally Posted by NVplumber View Post
Kinda gettin' nitpicky here, but, I'm at my local store , or wherever, in public, some politician, judge, whatever, and their entourage pull up, I'm carrying my weapon, legally, on my CCW, what do I do? The 'visit' is unannounced, so who is in the wrong here? Judges, and many other politicians, frequent public places, is that a reason to deny CCW, or open carry, in ALL public places? Or, are we only talking about planned events, and important federal figures?
Planned events, of course.
 
Old 08-19-2009, 04:23 PM
 
4,529 posts, read 4,740,608 times
Reputation: 730
There are a few things that anti-gun advocates can't seem to understand, IMHO...

One, it would take a Constitutional Convention to eliminate guns from this Nation, either to eliminatye or overide the Second Amendment. And that won't happen for two reasons, the first being no Politician will want to committ political suicide. Even those measures intended to eliminate gun ownership in a round-about manner, such as the Left's attempt to require micro-id's on every single round, ahve been shot down (pun), and shot down hard. The second is listed below.

Two, we are a gun culture. For the entire history of this Nation. From day one firearms ahve been an absolute neccessisty; putting food on the table, providing leather for clothing and utility, to defending from wild animals, to defend from brigands and robbers, and to defend from those people already here before us. As we expanded westward, those reasons for owning a firearm went with us.

No other Nation on the planet shares this type of history during a time when firearms were in common use.
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