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Old 05-11-2009, 02:52 PM
 
Location: Victoria TX
42,668 posts, read 71,523,609 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tricky D View Post
Originally Posted by jtur88I would have no way of knowing if that would be true or not.
Not that it would matter to me.
Does it matter to you if there is a God or not? Or if He has a beard? Or if She shaves under Her arms? Which you would similarly have no way of knowing.
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Old 05-11-2009, 03:05 PM
 
Location: Under a bridge.
3,196 posts, read 4,715,448 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tricky D View Post
You could say that (human) life is a sexually transmitted disease.
Human life is a sexually transmitted disease? Really? This is perhaps one of the silliest things a person could ever say.
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Old 05-11-2009, 03:06 PM
 
Location: Under a bridge.
3,196 posts, read 4,715,448 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jtur88 View Post
Don't forget the right to bear arms.Those rights re not absolute. They are granted provisionally, .
As long as I remain alive this right is absolute.
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Old 05-11-2009, 03:14 PM
 
Location: Victoria TX
42,668 posts, read 71,523,609 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dcashley View Post
Human life is a sexually transmitted disease? Really? This is perhaps one of the silliest things a person could ever say.
How come you get to call virus life a disease, but not human life, which is doing a great deal more damage to this planet than viruses.
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Old 05-11-2009, 03:52 PM
 
Location: Under a bridge.
3,196 posts, read 4,715,448 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jtur88 View Post
How come you get to call virus life a disease, but not human life, which is doing a great deal more damage to this planet than viruses.
Don't ask me...ask Tricky D...Tricky is the one that posted the silly assertion. Tricky D also said that death is uncertain. I'm just trying to nail down the source of these propositions.
1. Live = virus, specifically STD.
2. Death = uncertainity.

Is est valde leviculus. (Latin: This is extremely silly.)
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Old 05-12-2009, 02:10 AM
 
Location: The Netherlands
8,567 posts, read 14,514,836 times
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Originally Posted by jtur88
Quote:
Does it matter to you if there is a God or not? Or if He has a beard? Or if She shaves under Her arms? Which you would similarly have no way of knowing.
No it doesn't matter to me at all.
In fact I really can't tell if I'm a theist or an atheist.


Originally Posted by dcashley
Quote:
Human life is a sexually transmitted disease? Really? This is perhaps one of the silliest things a person could ever say.
If ya quote me, then quote me correctly or don't quote me at all.
When you leave out the emoticons it appears that I 'wasn't saying it in jest.

FYI, to me human life behaves exactly like a virus (or a cancer);
we keep growing in places where we shouldn't be growing at all.

Quote:
2. Death = uncertainity.
I never claimed that people will not die. I wrote that every second we come closer to death.
We just don't know when we'll die.
What ya don't understand is that we are living and dying at the same time.
But because you see life and death as absolutes you probably will not agree that life and death is happening at the same time.
So not only do we live each second, we also die each second simply because each second brings us closer to our death.

BTW life = uncertainty too, simply because nothing in life is certain.
It is all a probability.
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Old 05-12-2009, 04:02 PM
 
Location: Prepperland
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Greatday View Post
I own my home and the land surrounding it.

I own that which is below the surface (fee simple absolute ownership)

I decide what I want to do with my home. Should one day I decide I want to "burn it down", that is my right and may do so without interference.

I decide if I want to purchase and own a new automobile - and it is my decision how big that vehicle will be.

I have the right to travel across this great land - anytime I wish to - for as long as I wish to.

I have the right to make money, lose money, or give money away

I have the right to my possessions

And this right is absolute.
If you are at risk of losing your property and liberty for failure to pay taxes or obey regulations (absent an injured party), you have no "right", only "privilege" granted by government.
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Old 05-12-2009, 04:10 PM
 
Location: Prepperland
13,115 posts, read 9,199,435 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dcashley View Post
Jet, you are way off topic. Please stick to THIS topic.
Idealistic youth who are indoctrinated to be ignorant of private property (absolutely owned by individuals) are incapable of saving this world.

Because you cannot enjoy sovereignty, freedom and liberty if your life is held hostage by a faceless state (or those who control that state).

If you do not believe your Creator endowed you with inalienable rights to life (and all harmless actions taken in support of that life), liberty (as in natural and personal liberty), and absolute ownership (dominion), then you have therefore embraced slavery and death.
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Old 05-12-2009, 04:33 PM
 
Location: Prepperland
13,115 posts, read 9,199,435 times
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Americans were born with the birthright of sovereignty - and promptly lose it by "voluntary" surrender to the Collective State.

In support, I offer the following reasons.

First Line of Reason


Genesis 26: And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.
27: So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them.
28: And God blessed them, and God said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth, and subdue it: and have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over every living thing that moveth upon the earth.
DOMINION - Generally accepted definition of "dominion" is perfect control in right of ownership. The word implies both title and possession and appears to require a complete retention of control over disposition. -Sovereignty; as the dominion of the seas or over a territory.
- - - Black's Law Dictionary, Sixth Ed., p.486

SOVEREIGN - "...Having undisputed right to make decisions and act accordingly".
New Webster's Dictionary And Thesaurus, p. 950.

SOVEREIGN - A person, body or state in which independent and supreme authority is vested...
Black's Law Dictionary Dictionary, Sixth Edition, p. 1395.

SOVEREIGNTY - ...By "Sovereignty", in its largest sense is meant supreme, absolute, uncontrollable power, the absolute right to govern.
Black's Law Dictionary Dictionary, Sixth Edition, p. 1396.
MAN, individually, is endowed by His Creator with the undisputed right to make decisions, and act. He has perfect control, possession and title to all the particular earth that he acquires by harmless and lawful means. He is a sovereign.

What changed, that one group of men can demand another to serve them?

Second Line of Reason

" We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness. --That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed..."
--- Declaration of Independence, 1776

" Natural liberty is the right which nature gives to all mankind, of disposing of their persons and property after the manner they judge most consonant to their happiness, on condition of their acting within the limits of the law of nature, and that they do not in any way abuse it to the prejudice of other men."
- - - Bouvier's Law Dictionary
NATURAL LIBERTY - The power of acting as one thinks fit, without any restraint or control, unless by the law of nature. The right which nature gives to all mankind of disposing of their persons and property after the manner in which they judge most consistent with their happiness, on condition of their acting within the limits of the law of nature, and so as not to interfere in the equal exercise of the same rights by other men. 1 Blackstone's Commentaries, 123,
- - - Black's Law Dictionary, Sixth edition, p.919
America's governments recognize that MAN has the natural liberty to act as he thinks fit, and as long as he doesn't injure another's rights (harmless action). Those who have not given consent, nor submitted themselves, are not objects nor subjects of government. But they are promised by servant government that their inalienable rights will be respected and protected.

What has changed, that men no longer have absolute freedom to think, decide, and act, but must comply with law that imposes prior restraint? What has changed that men are punished as criminals, when there is no damaged person or property?

Third Line of Reason

Where does Man exercise natural liberty (pursue happiness) ?
"PRIVATE PROPERTY - As protected from being taken for public uses, is such property as belongs absolutely to an individual, and of which he has the exclusive right of disposition. Property of a specific, fixed and tangible nature, capable of being in possession and transmitted to another, such as houses, lands, and chattels."
- - - Black's Law dictionary, sixth ed., p.1217

"OWNERSHIP - ... Ownership of property is either absolute or qualified. The ownership of property is absolute when a single person has the absolute dominion over it... The ownership is qualified when it is shared with one or more persons, when the time of enjoyment is deferred or limited, or when the use is restricted. "
- - -Black's Law dictionary, sixth ed., p. 1106
Within his domain of private property, man is free to act without prior restraint, or permission (license). Outside of his private property and dominion, a man is not sovereign, free, and independent of other men. He has no freedom to trespass upon the private property of other men.

From the Communist manifesto:
"In this sense, the theory of the Communists may be summed up in the single sentence: Abolition of private property."

Amendment V, US Constitution 1789
... nor shall private property be taken for public use, without just compensation.

"Private property" is protected by constitution, but abolished by communism and socialism. What has happened to absolute ownership of land and houses, that should be secure from being taken for public use without just compensation? Did we consent to the surrender of our private property rights?


Fourth Line of Reason

Liberty is more complex than freedom. Liberty is divided into four types.
LIBERTY. Freedom from restraint. The power of acting as one thinks fit, without any restraint or control, except from the laws of nature.
2. Liberty is divided into civil, natural, personal, and political.
6. Personal liberty is the independence of our actions of all other will than our own. Wolff, Ins. Nat. 77. It consists in the power of locomotion, of changing situation, or removing one's person to whatever place one's inclination may direct, without imprisonment or restraint, unless by due course of law. 1 Bl. Com. 134.
--- Bouvier's Dictionary
PERSONAL LIBERTY - The right or power of locomotion; of changing situation, or moving one's person to whatsoever place one's own inclination may direct, without imprisonment or restraint, unless by due course of law. 1 Bl. Comm. 125.
- - - Black's Law Dictionary, Sixth Ed., p. 919
TRAVEL - Within the meaning of a constitutional right to travel, means migration with intent to settle and abide.
- - - Black's Law Dictionary, Sixth Ed., p.1500
" Personal liberty, or the Right to enjoyment of life and liberty, is one of the fundamental or natural Rights, which has been protected by its inclusion as a guarantee in the various constitutions, which is not derived from, or dependent on, the U.S. Constitution, which may not be submitted to a vote and may not depend on the outcome of an election. It is one of the most sacred and valuable Rights, as sacred as the Right to private property...and is regarded as inalienable." 16 C.J.S., Constitutional Law, Sect.202, p.987.

" Personal liberty largely consists of the Right of locomotion to go where and when one pleases only so far restrained as the Rights of others may make it necessary for the welfare of all other citizens. The Right of the Citizen to travel upon the public highways and to transport his property thereon, by horsedrawn carriage, wagon, or automobile, is not a mere privilege which may be permitted or prohibited at will, but the common Right which he has under his Right to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness. Under this Constitutional guarantee one may, therefore, under normal conditions, travel at his inclination along the public highways or in public places, and while conducting himself in an orderly and decent manner, neither interfering with nor disturbing another's Rights, he will be protected, not only in his person, but in his safe conduct." II Am.Jur. (1st) Constitutional Law, Sect.329, p.1135.
A man's personal liberty is the right to move, outside of his own domain and situation, without restraint, unless he interferes in the equal exercise of the same rights by other men.

What has changed that man must now get permission (license) before he can travel upon public roads? Why must he register his vehicle with the State?

Fifth Line of Reason

Natural rights are superior to "human rights".
INHERENT POWERS - Those which are enjoyed by the possessors of natural right, without having been received from another. Such are the powers of a people to establish a form of government, of a father to control his children.
- - - Black's Law Dictionary, Sixth Ed., p. 1170

ABSOLUTE RIGHTS - ... which are such as appertain and belong to particular men, merely as individuals or single persons...

NATURAL RIGHTS - ... are the rights of life, liberty, privacy, and good reputation.
Black's Law Dictionary, Sixth Ed., p. 1324
Amendment IV
The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.
Amendment V
... nor shall private property be taken for public use, without just compensation.

Man's absolute rights, liberties, privacy, and reputation are not to be injured or violated without warrant, supported by a complaint by an injured party, who shall make said complaint under penalty of perjury for false accusation.

A man's private property shall not be taken for public use, without just compensation.

What empowers government to take our lands and houses, for failure to pay ad valorem taxes, and not pay us just compensation? What empowers the government to do unwarranted searches and seizures?

Sixth Line of Reason

Exercising government granted privileges and immunities may impose a loss of inalienable rights.
"The right of holding state office is a civil or political right, which may be surrendered to the government or to society in order to secure the protection of other rights ([State] Bill of Rights, art. 3), or the government may abridge or take away such rights for sufficient cause; for, though such rights may be considered natural rights (Bill of Rights, art. 2) yet they [political rights] are not of the class of natural rights which are held to be inalienable, like the rights of conscience (Bill of Rights, art. 4)"
- - Hale v. Everett, 53 N.H. 9 (N.H. 1868)
[Note: civil and political rights (liberties) are not in the same class of natural rights (inalienable), and surrender "other rights" when exercised. They are grants from government, and not endowed by our Creator.]

Those who exercise civil rights or civil liberties must apply for license (ask permission).
" Civil liberty is the power to do whatever is permitted by the constitution of the state and the laws of the land. It is no other than natural liberty, so far restrained by human laws, and no further, operating equally upon all the citizens, as is necessary and expedient for the general advantage of the public." 1 Black. Com. 125; Paley's Mor. Phil. B. 6, c.5; Swifts Syst. 12
--- Bouvier's Law Dictionary
LICENSE - A personal privilege to do some particular act or series of acts on land without possessing any estate or interest therein, and is ordinarily revocable at the will of the licensor and is not assignable... The permission by competent authority to do an act which, without such permission, would be illegal, a trespass, a tort, or otherwise not allowed. - - - Black's Law Dictionary
A sovereign man who is within his inherent rights regarding his domain and his right of travel is not violating the person or property of another, committing a tort, a trespass, or otherwise required to obtain prior permission from competent authority.

Everyone else must obtain permission from competent authority to travel, work, marry, own dogs, build their homes, engage in business, and so on.

In addition, those who submit, as citizens, accept the burdens and duties that come with that election.
TITLE 10 USC Sec. 311. Militia: composition and classes
(a) The militia of the United States consists of all able-bodied males at least 17 years of age and, ... under 45 years of age who are, ...citizens of the United States ...
Seventh Line of Reason

Exclusions, Exceptions, and Opponents
"CITIZEN - ... Citizens are members of a political community who, in their associative capacity, have established or submitted themselves to the dominion of government for the promotion of the general welfare and the protection of their individual as well as collective rights. "
- - - Black's Law Dictionary, Sixth Ed. p.244

"SUBJECT - One that owes allegiance to a sovereign and is governed by his laws.
...Men in free governments are subjects as well as citizens; as citizens they enjoy rights and franchises; as subjects they are bound to obey the laws. The term is little used, in this sense, in countries enjoying a republican form of government."
- - - Black's Law Dictionary, Sixth Edition, p. 1425
For proof that there are people who are not citizens, read Article IV :
"The better to secure and perpetuate mutual friendship and intercourse among the people of the different states in this union, the free inhabitants of each of these states, paupers, vagabonds and fugitives from Justice excepted, shall be entitled to all privileges and immunities of free citizens in the several states;...."
[Article IV of the Articles of Confederation (1777)]
(This clause may explain why few Americans are ever exposed to the Articles of Confederation. Young fresh minds might ask embarrassing questions in their "Social Studies".)

What is a pauper (one of the excepted classes)?
PAUPER - A person so poor that he must be supported at public expense.
Black's Law Dictionary, 6th ed, p. 1128
How poor is that?
INDIGENT - In a general sense, one who is needy and poor, or one who has not sufficient property to furnish him a living nor anyone able to support him to whom he is entitled to look for support. Term commonly used to refer to one's financial ability, and ordinarily indicates one who is destitute of means of comfortable subsistence so as to be in want. Powers v. State, 194 Kan. 820, 402 P.2d 328, 332.
- - - Black's Law Dictionary, Sixth Ed. p. 773
An indigent has no money nor property to support himself. But an indigent is not a pauper until he is supported by public charity.

What's so bad about pauperization?
"State code 124 Sections 6, and 7, authorizing the overseer of the poor to commit to the workhouse able-bodied persons, not having the means to support themselves, and who live a dissolute and vagrant life, and do not work sufficiently to support themselves, are not repugnant to the constitution, giving every man an inalienable right to defend his life and liberty."
[In re Nott, 11 Me. (2 Fairf.) 208. (Me. 1834)
In short, the State has the power to direct you to work in exchange for the charity you get. Sounds like legalized slavery, doesn't it? If you are a pauper, you are subject to the orders of the overseer..
"Act May 29, 1879, providing for the committal to the industrial school of dependent infant girls, who are beggars, wanderers, homeless, or without proper parental care, in no way violates the right of personal liberty, and is constitutional."
Ex parte Ferrier, 103 Ill. 367, 42 Am. Rep. 10 (Ill. 1882)
Remember the exclusions: pauper and vagabond?
"An act providing for the care and custody of the person and the estate of habitual drunkards is not unconstitutional, as depriving a citizen of the right to enjoy, control, and dispose of his property, and to make contracts."
Devin v. Scott, 34 Ind. 67 (Ind. 1870)
STATUS CRIME - A class of crime which consists not in proscribed action or inaction, but in the accused's having a certain personal condition or being a person of a specified character. And example of a status crime is vagrancy. Status crimes are constitutionally suspect.
Black's Law Dictionary, 6th ed, p. 1410
SOCIALISM - A political and economic theory advocating collective ownership of the means of production and control of distribution. It is based upon the belief that all, while contributing to the good of the community, are equally entitled to the care and protection which the community can provide.
--- Webster's dictionary
Socialism denies absolute ownership, private property, and therefore individual sovereignty. Social Security entitlements are synonymous with gifts (charity from the public treasury), and all participants are paupers at
law. Socialism imposes the obligation to work for the benefit of others (the collective).

A man who has no property, nor means of support, accepts or is eligible to accept charity from the public treasury is excepted from the privileges and immunities of the free citizens, and since he has no private property, has no inalienable rights and powers associated with sovereign status. As a voluntary pauper, he is object of and subject to the authority of government. And that authority predates the U.S. Constitution.

It is no coincidence that most States define the term "resident" to be synonymous with vagabond.

Why is a resident residing at a residence different from a free inhabitant dwelling at his domicile?
"RESIDENT - ...when used as a noun, means a dweller, habitant, or occupant; one who resides or dwells in a place for a period of more, or less duration... Resident has many meanings in law, largely determined by statutory context in which it is used."
- - - Black's Law Dictionary, Sixth Edition, p.1309

"INHABITANT -One who resides actually and permanently in a given place, and has his domicile there."
- - - Black's Law Dictionary, Sixth Edition, p.782

"DOMICILE - A person's legal home. That place where a man has his true, fixed, and permanent home and principal establishment, and to which whenever he is absent he has the intention of returning."
- - - Black's Law Dictionary, Sixth Edition, p.484

"RESIDENCE - Place where one actually lives ... Residence implies something more than physical presence and something less than domicile. The terms 'resident' and 'residence' have no precise legal meaning... [One can have many residences but only one domicile]
- - - Black's Law Dictionary, Sixth Edition, p.1308, 1309
A free inhabitant / American national / sovereign has a domicile (legal permanent home). A U.S. citizen / resident (transient) has a residence (less than a legal permanent home). A "legal residence" is not a legal home. Ergo, the government is empowered to restrict such transients, and require of them to seek permission, unlike the free people (non-residents).


Eighth Line of Reason

Condemnations of usury

Yahoo! Groups

Ezekiel 18:13 Hath given forth upon usury, and hath taken increase: shall he then live? he shall not live: he hath done all these abominations; he shall surely die; his blood shall be upon him.

USURY - Usury (from the Latin usus meaning "used") was defined originally as charging a fee for the use of money. This usually meant interest on loans, although charging a fee for changing money (as at a bureau de change) is included in the original meaning. After moderate-interest loans became an accepted part of the business world in the early modern age, the word has come to refer to the charging of unreasonable or relatively high rates of interest.
Usury - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

A man cannot support a claim of innocence, and expect protection from Providence, if he is a usurer. By scripture, he's self condemned, and his tormentor is not held liable. (Government really does "Trust in God"!)

Is it a coincidence that usurers will not contract with the unnumbered? No one who is lacking a social security number is allowed to open an interest bearing account in any Federal Reserve bank, nor open a stock account. Coincidentally, if one has no number (SSN/TIN), one cannot be held criminally liable for "willful failure to file". The Socialist individual income tax** was always voluntary, but few know how they volunteered.

(** The corporate income tax on earnings from usury and limited liability are uniform, and thus a constitutional excise tax. The graduated Socialist wage taxes - Social Security and the Individual Income taxes - are based upon compact, and are outside the purview of the constitution.)

=============

By these lines of reason, one should be able to come to the conclusion that America's heritage is sovereignty, freedom and independence of her people.

And that heritage was unwittingly lost, by voluntary participation in national socialism, compacts with usurers, and subjugation to servant government.

Without this knowledge, idealistic youth will be misled to submit to the will of their masters, and renounce their heritage, birthright, and endowment.
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Old 05-12-2009, 04:51 PM
 
Location: Under a bridge.
3,196 posts, read 4,715,448 times
Reputation: 976
Jet, you are off topic. (again.)
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