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There are two people on this thread who have consistently, repeatedly and intentionally been flagrantly dishonest in an attempt to wrongly paint whites as perpetual aggressors and non-whites as perpetual victims of whites. In their eyes, everything that is wrong in the world is the fault of whites.
Included in this race-baiting is the incendiary language of "lynching" - which is CLEARLY intended to conjure up feelings of racial animosity and perpetuate the myth that whites continue to victimize non-whites.
Since you answered first, let me ask you this...you obviously grasp what their concept/definition of the term conveys. Why argue it? Ignore the definition and argue the point behind it.
As for youre statement about some people wishing to cast whites as perpetual offenders/victimizers, again, this is a generalization. Both in the form of others who would believe such a foolish notion, and to you if you were to argue against any who disagree as if they do.
(follow me out here before disagreeing) My thoughts are that you can definitely see trend of warfare, disease and poverty. The trend seemed to be for the last 800 years wherever europeans moved to, the indigenious people ended up either subjugated, eliminated or of some lesser status than the europeans.
HERE is where this fits in: Its not a 'european'/white thing, its a human thing. Human beings have a tendency to oppress others they see as a threat, or as in possession of something those humans want (usually land). This has happened throughout history with all groups.
Yes, in western society, there is an unfortunate trend of racial discrimination and disparities. Not everyone supports it, and not everyone is targeted by it, but unfortunately everyone ends up as a victim of it. it creates disharmony between people. It is not something that will go away if we all ignore it or simply not talk about it. Likewise its not something that will go away if we go on the attack towards anyone with a small disagreement.
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Originally Posted by miu
And I will disagree with you and blame the underperformance of the children of poor minorities more on poor parenting than their "underfunded" school systems. You can lead a horse to water, but you can't force it to drink. And if a child, particularly a young teen, doesn't see the value of having a good education, then you can't make them want to learn, no matter how nice the school looks or how new their school books look. And their school buildings and books are trashed looking because the students keep vandalizing them
Kids at all schools, richest to poorest vandalize. When you have kids in poor neighborhoods learning to type on a typewriter and using 20 year old books, and kids in rich neighborhoods using brand new Macs with the newest books, it should not be surprising what results. You can have the best parents in the world (as many poor people do), but without the proper tools, the kids will not go anywhere. On the other hand, there are plenty of rich kids of average of lesser intellect who finish school moderately prepared for college.
I agree some kids have too many other things on their minds than school. When the schools are funded, built in the form of, and run like prisons, the kids will act like prisoners. Then again, the majority of poor kids just want to learn so that they wont be poor all their lives. You dont cut down the tree because a few of the apples on it rotted.
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Originally Posted by solytaire
I agree with this...However, I do not appreciate being falsely accused of saying things...there have been several instances in this thread where my words were either misconstrued, misinterpreted, altogether fabricated or a combo thereof. I am seeking clarity...period
Ive said it before and I will say it again: I could care less who wins...Whites, Blacks, Asians whoever...It doesnt matter, we will still all get to live with each other and we will all have to figure out how to get along....
however if we are expected to have a transparent dialogue about these race relations, I do not think it right to continue claiming that I have stated things that I have not.
This has already happened numerous times, and it is outright disingenuous...Further, at this point I am prepared to ignore anyone who does such.
Just incase you may have been thinking this, I was not accusing you of anything. That being said, if someone else is accusing you of something, its pointless to continue to argue anything further wastes your time. You made your point. As I mentioned to Omaha, you arent going to change anyones mind ones you clarified your position and they still disagree with you. Anyone who fails to see your logic after that either does not want to (therefore are aware of their own misposition on the topic), is simply is incapable. And you are not going to be able to teach anyone via the internet.
Does ANYBODY question what you mean when you say, "Would you please hand me a Kleenex?"? No. Absolutely not.
NOBODY doubts what it means when somebody claims that a person was "lynched." Nobody.
As I have already noted, NOBODY talks about White people being lynched. Ever. Why do you suppose that is? I'll give you a hint: Because people who want to perpetuate the "victim-hood of all non-whites myth" use the term "lynching" to conjure up images of innocent blacks being hanged to death by cowardly whites.
You know it. I know it. Everybody knows it.
I'd agree much of that is wrong. Italians, Jews, etc were also lynched. On occasion regular white people were lynched for vigilante reasons.
If you want to talk about Leo Frank or something that's fine. That doesn't really change that in per-capita terms blacks were the worst hit by lynching and that lynching doesn't have to involve hanging in the conventional sense.
On the more pleasant topic of music I think it is beneficial to education. Music can aid memory. In college I started "singing my class notes" to mostly instrumental music and I think it helped.
However I don't think it has to be classical music. I think that's a bit snooty. I generally found many things with a rhythm worked. The more dancy Celtic music worked pretty well for example. I'd imagine much African music would also work, but most of the African music I liked then was sung. (Although I did use vocal music on occasion. I remember getting complaints for loudly singing history notes to some of the more raucous Tori Amos songs. I graduated magna kum laude though)
Last edited by Thomas R.; 07-20-2009 at 01:42 AM..
Reason: oh for crying out loud, it's Latin!
When you have kids in poor neighborhoods learning to type on a typewriter and using 20 year old books, and kids in rich neighborhoods using brand new Macs with the newest books, it should not be surprising what results. You can have the best parents in the world (as many poor people do), but without the proper tools, the kids will not go anywhere. On the other hand, there are plenty of rich kids of average of lesser intellect who finish school moderately prepared for college.
I disagree. The biggest difference between a high school that performs poorly and one the performs well is the quality of the students. For example, the District of Columbia spends more per student than any other school district in the country yet continues to perform poorly.
If you swapped the entire student body from a poorly performing school in Washington DC with a well performing school in a nearby suburb the fortunes of each school would reverse. The DC school would begin to perform well and the suburban school would begin to perform poorly.
A 60-page review of the scientific evidence, some based on state-of-the-art magnetic resonance imaging (MRI) of brain size, has concluded that race differences in average IQ are largely genetic.
The lead article in the June 2005 issue of Psychology, Public Policy and Law, a journal of the American Psychological Association, examined 10 categories of research evidence from around the world to contrast "a hereditarian model (50% genetic-50% cultural) and a culture-only model (0% genetic-100% cultural).
snip
I don't buy into the idea IQ tests are biased because if it were so it should be possible to design a test that would be biased against whites.
How many years did slavery take place! Think about that. Now you tell me if you were degraded, beat down and had to watch your entire family go through the same thing for more than a couple of years, how would you feel. Also one of the slave masters tools were to keep the slaves ignorant. The Masters wouldnt let the slaves read. Another tool was to keep them fighting each other. Thats where all this black on black crime originated. They were taught and still are taught that the lighter your skin the prettier you are. All this and more is enough to mess up the mind sets of any color of people. Jews, Asians pass the color test, baby get a clue! Blacks, especially dark skinned didnt have a chance. So hate grew along with despair. You kick a dog long enough and you will get bit. Now America is on the recieving end of a mad dogs bite. To the ones that are strong and wise enough to know that two wrongs don't make it right, "bravo." But you must see that we are a people scrarred for how long, I don't know.
You paint your face a little browner and go out into society. You know,go to the places you usually frequent. And watch the ignorance begin. How ignorant is it to mistreat people because of their skin color! Oh yeah, you asked how do the others make it so much better than blacks, and hispanics. My answer is because of ignorant people that still use their old slave master tricks to keep them down under their foot. Do you remember this ryhme, "If your white, You are right. If you are black, get back." Now go paint your face and see the world from my eyes. Then you won't have to ask those same questions. Make sure to get some kinky hair for yourself also. That's another topic I want to address (another time).
Remember my brothers and sisters white and black, " Two wrongs won't make it right." But everyday strive to do better than what got done to you. Don't let them keep you down with ignorance. Get up, shake yourself off and take control of your life. This does'nt mean that everything is going to go your way. But we cant give up or in and expect to come out on top.
Kids at all schools, richest to poorest vandalize. When you have kids in poor neighborhoods learning to type on a typewriter and using 20 year old books, and kids in rich neighborhoods using brand new Macs with the newest books, it should not be surprising what results. You can have the best parents in the world (as many poor people do), but without the proper tools, the kids will not go anywhere. On the other hand, there are plenty of rich kids of average of lesser intellect who finish school moderately prepared for college.
Many generations of white and non-whites learned just fine with typewriters and 20 year old books, myself included. A keyboard is a keyboard, and actually a typewriter is better exercise for the fingers. As to 20 year old books, at a high school level it really doesn't matter. The literature classics like Shakespeare, Dickens and Austen are over a hundred years old and the words in them are not going to change with a new book edition. I even have 20 plus year old books on my personal bookshelves that I cherish a lot. Math is math. Biology is biology. And for a real computer keyboard, just go to any public library and use theirs. Or buy a used setup off of craigslist. My own computers are used off of craigslist in the $125 range. What doesn't help is their parents griping about a lack of Macs and brand new books and that's what makes their kids feel badly about going to the schools they go to.
I also grew up with the Metco programs in my public schools. A busload of black inner city kids were brought in to experience the suburban schooling experience. In my class, only one of them makes it to my class renunions. And when the rest of us ask how the other Metco student did in life, he refers to them as black trash and tells us not to think of them.
What black kids need is their parents and family motivating and helping them to study hard. And they need to be motivated when they are still babies in their cribs. Even Obama and Sotomeyor have stated publicly the importance of having a good education. Don't blame the lack of owning or having access to the new computers and newest book editions of school books for their lack of academic skills.
I'm not saying that kids should only listen and play classical music or implying to the child that classical music is the greatest, but it's a great way to teach order, discipline, precision, and good study habits. And what poor students generally need is more discipline and order in their lives. Jazz is great, but actually the rules for playing it are very sophisticated. A good improvisation still has rules and a underlying melody backbone. the great jazz players are quite gifted musically. Then blues and pop songs are more simplistic with their use of mainly 1-4-5 chords. Their is already a lot of good classical music teaching materials available. And even if a child isn't gifted musically, playing and listening to classical music is still has a profound learning development benefit.
Just because a child is black, doesn't mean that they should only be exposed to black music and black musical artists. And I would steer any young child away from listening to any music that has messages of sex and hate in its lyrics. And I'd rather the child first hear Shakespeare before rap music. The point is to raise well rounded children that turn into functioning well rounded and well integrated young adults.
A young brain needs to be challenged constantly in order to grow and develop. If the parents wait until their child enters kindergarten to worry about introducing academic skills into their lives, it's already too late.
Also, it's been observed that learning a second language is much easier when a child is young.
HERE is where this fits in: Its not a 'european'/white thing, its a human thing. Human beings have a tendency to oppress others they see as a threat, or as in possession of something those humans want (usually land). This has happened throughout history with all groups.
Interesting...
This is virtually word-for-word what I've said several times in previous posts.
I'd agree much of that is wrong. Italians, Jews, etc were also lynched. On occasion regular white people were lynched for vigilante reasons.
If you want to talk about Leo Frank or something that's fine. That doesn't really change that in per-capita terms blacks were the worst hit by lynching and that lynching doesn't have to involve hanging in the conventional sense.
You know, it's the weirdest thing. First of all, nobody ever refers back to "the lynching of Leo Frank." The only way anybody even hears of it is if you Google "white people lynched" of "jews lynched". Even then, if you look closely, it appears that he was hanged - which is what comes to mind for every American when the word "lynched" is used.
Moderator cut: image removed
Last edited by picmod; 01-10-2014 at 04:58 AM..
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