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Old 08-01-2011, 07:36 PM
 
11,896 posts, read 14,364,183 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Spades View Post
I encourage all interested in this topic to read "Mobility" by Joseph Giglio, and read up on the Reason Foundations findings. As someone who worked in the tolling industry for several years I believe that is provides a better solution for transportation than high speed rail. Instead of high speed rail maybe but some rapid transit bus's that run up and down the tolled lanes, like they do in Minnesota. Either way, the infrastructure in this country is declining and there has to be something done to rebuild it. The government does not want to and can't afford to put out all the funds and risk associated with new transportation projects, so the way is through Public Private Partnerships(P3)'s.
That was one option propose to rescue the trans-Hudson tunnel, but Gov. Christie refused to consider it and just killed the project.
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Old 08-02-2011, 11:47 AM
 
Location: On the Rails in Northern NJ
12,381 posts, read 22,628,466 times
Reputation: 4504
Quote:
Originally Posted by pvande55 View Post
That was one option propose to rescue the trans-Hudson tunnel, but Gov. Christie refused to consider it and just killed the project.
If we used PPP's , we could probably speed up all our projects and build more....but for some reason politicians are afraid of them...
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Old 08-02-2011, 09:56 PM
 
48,519 posts, read 81,030,761 times
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I have no probelm with local or state governament paying for a rail system if they want and the taxpayers there willing to pay for it.As a side note China is now building a innner state highway system that will in a few years surpass out wnn and its already the largest market for automobiles in the world and growing.Basciually no such massive projects as high speed rail without private funding are going anywhere with this deficit problem we have. States and local government will be in coming years be more responsible for more and more cost that federal government is funding now.
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Old 08-02-2011, 11:29 PM
 
Location: Fairfax County, VA
3,718 posts, read 4,594,074 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nexis4Jersey View Post
If we used PPP's , we could probably speed up all our projects and build more....but for some reason politicians are afraid of them...
What are PPP's?
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Old 08-03-2011, 06:29 AM
 
Location: North Beach, MD on the Chesapeake
32,112 posts, read 39,184,670 times
Reputation: 40552
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joke Insurance View Post
What are PPP's?

Public-Private Partnerships where the government, at whatever level, partners with the private sector to build a project.

The ones I'm famliar with have invariably been a disaster, the costs are underestimated and the benefits are overestimated, with the result that the Public part ends up paying for the whole thing because the government is the guarantor of the bonds used to finance the project.

Just in my County there was a golf course project that went this way, with input also from a MD entity set up for this type of project. The County was the guarantor and after several years of covering operating cost shortfalls to the tune of several million dollars, with deficits stretching as far as the eye could see, the County Commissioners just said screw it and bought out the other partners. The facility is at least breaking even now.

The above is how many, if not most, of these types of projects end up. In this area the Dulles Toll Road and VA Rail Express are both in the same boat-losing money year after year with the government having to make up the shortfall.
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Old 08-03-2011, 08:08 AM
 
Location: somewhere in the woods
16,886 posts, read 12,541,451 times
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I am not for or against this at all, just not on the federal dime.
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Old 08-04-2011, 07:50 PM
 
Location: Fairfax County, VA
3,718 posts, read 4,594,074 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by North Beach Person View Post
The above is how many, if not most, of these types of projects end up. In this area the Dulles Toll Road and VA Rail Express are both in the same boat-losing money year after year with the government having to make up the shortfall.
Are you certain about VRE?

Quote:
Originally Posted by monkeywrenching View Post
I am not for or against this at all, just not on the federal dime.


^ that's all that I gotta say.
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Old 08-04-2011, 08:02 PM
 
Location: North Beach, MD on the Chesapeake
32,112 posts, read 39,184,670 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joke Insurance View Post
Are you certain about VRE?


http://www.vre.org/about/Financial_s...l_Stm_2009.pdf
Go to page 8-2009 was the latest I could find, net operating loss just under $25M.
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Old 08-04-2011, 09:31 PM
 
Location: On the Rails in Northern NJ
12,381 posts, read 22,628,466 times
Reputation: 4504
Quote:
Originally Posted by North Beach Person View Post
http://www.vre.org/about/Financial_s...l_Stm_2009.pdf
Go to page 8-2009 was the latest I could find, net operating loss just under $25M.
Ridership could be higher and the operating loss lower if they expanded and added more trains...
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Old 08-05-2011, 04:06 AM
 
645 posts, read 1,068,189 times
Reputation: 1764
Quote:
Originally Posted by texdav View Post
I have no probelm with local or state governament paying for a rail system if they want and the taxpayers there willing to pay for it.As a side note China is now building a innner state highway system that will in a few years surpass out wnn and its already the largest market for automobiles in the world and growing.Basciually no such massive projects as high speed rail without private funding are going anywhere with this deficit problem we have. States and local government will be in coming years be more responsible for more and more cost that federal government is funding now.
I’ve been aware of China’s expansion for several years now. The first thing I thought of five years ago was this, “Wow! In just a few short years, China’s going to be using more oil than we are. Imagine what that’s going to do to the price of oil and competition for it…”

Am I the only person alarmed by this? If we don’t soon adopt a form of electrified rail and trolleys, we’re going to get caught flatfooted when oil and gas becomes too expensive.

Unfortunately, the love affair with cars, urban sprawl, and huge shopping malls in the middle of nowhere are still all the rage. Hence, the average person could care less about rail. Even under our current transportation system, imagine if the Feds mandated that consumer goods must be transported by rail, and only local distribution would be able to use trucks. Sure it would kill the trucking industry, but it would remove a lot of truck congestion from the interstates. The states would obviously be against it because they’d lose money on fuel tax, road tax, and all sorts of revenues and workers that go behind servicing trucks, the roads they use, and regulating them.

It’s like many have already pointed out. The only time people will consider rail of any type is when it becomes too expensive to own a car.
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