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Old 07-17-2009, 04:52 PM
 
Location: Victoria TX
38,755 posts, read 39,267,653 times
Reputation: 28893

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Quote:
Originally Posted by GhostInTheShell View Post
if I harvest a deer, the way I see it the deer lived a fulfilling life until the moment I took it--and I know it wasn't caged or tortured. .
Ive heard of moose that literally kill themselves, running through the woods trying to get rid of blackflies swarming over their bodies. I once spent about ten minutes breathlessly running for cover from deerflies, and I can't imagine that for days or weeks. It's not all bambi dancing in the posies out there. Nobody calls a vet when your deer is suffering from some long, slow painful death. I bet when a predator catches your deer, instead of your 30-06, it's no fun at all. Have you ever had to track your own deer a mile of so after a shot that doesn't kill it instantly?
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Old 07-17-2009, 05:59 PM
 
Location: 125 Years Too Late...
6,729 posts, read 5,670,895 times
Reputation: 6430
Quote:
Originally Posted by jtur88 View Post
I once spent about ten minutes breathlessly running for cover from deerflies, and I can't imagine that for days or weeks.
Once in a while one or two of those evil little creatures set me in their sights while I jog or hike in the mountains. Even that is traumatic! I HATE those things.
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Old 07-17-2009, 06:41 PM
 
Location: Cloud Cuckoo Land
558 posts, read 503,127 times
Reputation: 214
Quote:
Originally Posted by jtur88 View Post
Ive heard of moose that literally kill themselves, running through the woods trying to get rid of blackflies swarming over their bodies. I once spent about ten minutes breathlessly running for cover from deerflies, and I can't imagine that for days or weeks. It's not all bambi dancing in the posies out there. Nobody calls a vet when your deer is suffering from some long, slow painful death. I bet when a predator catches your deer, instead of your 30-06, it's no fun at all. Have you ever had to track your own deer a mile of so after a shot that doesn't kill it instantly?
I don't find fault with people eating meat. It's the natural order of things. I find fault with people mistreating animals. I never suggested nature was all roses, but if we could give any moose a choice, I'm sure he'd choose freedom, black flies and possibly starvation over disease infested cages and stalls where he'd likely suffer every day until the day he died. Maybe I'm wrong, but I doubt it. Perhaps you could explain how you eating Whoppers is more virtuous than me eating venison.
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Old 07-17-2009, 07:32 PM
 
Location: NW Nevada
7,142 posts, read 5,235,890 times
Reputation: 4882
Quote:
Originally Posted by GhostInTheShell View Post
I don't find fault with people eating meat. It's the natural order of things. I find fault with people mistreating animals. I never suggested nature was all roses, but if we could give any moose a choice, I'm sure he'd choose freedom, black flies and possibly starvation over disease infested cages and stalls where he'd likely suffer every day until the day he died. Maybe I'm wrong, but I doubt it. Perhaps you could explain how you eating Whoppers is more virtuous than me eating venison.
Mmmm, backstrap on the grill, with my favorite seasoning rub, and a little Mountain Mahogany smoke for that twang. Or Elk sirloin, marinated and slow grilled with wet smoke, smothered in wild onions and sautee'd shrooms, with fresh garden greenbeans and tomatoes on the side. Meat and veggies, veggies and meat, (especially wild meat) thank God for lifestyle choices
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Old 07-17-2009, 08:43 PM
 
Location: Pinal County, Arizona
25,100 posts, read 24,540,520 times
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I LOVE Kobe beef!
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Old 07-18-2009, 11:00 AM
 
Location: Northern California
481 posts, read 156,175 times
Reputation: 245
What other sports use lethal weapons and produce wounds and lots of blood every time?

Quote:
Originally Posted by eevee View Post
a gun is a tool. just like a bow and arrow. just like a rock. just like a garden hoe. it just so happens that a gun is a very efficient tool. humans been using tools to survive for a very, very, very long time. hunting for meat is a natural and normal part of being human. it's more natural to hunt than to create massive produce farms.

you keep throwing out inflammatory words like "murder" and "blood sport" yet, I'll say again that those who live off the land, those who hunt and fish, are doing FAR more good in the world than those who live off of mass farmed produce that required large tracks of natural forest to be cut down. are YOU living off the land, only eating what you can find and forage w/ your own hands? or are you, like so many others, just popping down to the supermarket and picking up produce w/ little care that it was imported from half the world over in gas spewing vehicles, or that the farming of that produce caused acres of woods and forests to disappear and the animals that lived in them to die or be homeless?
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Old 07-18-2009, 11:03 AM
 
Location: Northern California
481 posts, read 156,175 times
Reputation: 245
Quote:
Originally Posted by GhostInTheShell View Post
I don't find fault with people eating meat. It's the natural order of things. I find fault with people mistreating animals. I never suggested nature was all roses, but if we could give any moose a choice, I'm sure he'd choose freedom, black flies and possibly starvation over disease infested cages and stalls where he'd likely suffer every day until the day he died. Maybe I'm wrong, but I doubt it. Perhaps you could explain how you eating Whoppers is more virtuous than me eating venison.
I dislike both, but I think Whoppers are more harmful.

If everyone stopped eating meat, there would be no starvation on the planet. It takes obscene amounts of grain and water to produce one pound of beef.
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Old 07-18-2009, 11:13 AM
 
Location: Victoria TX
38,755 posts, read 39,267,653 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Apples&Oranges View Post
What other sports use lethal weapons and produce wounds and lots of blood every time?
Boxing.
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Old 07-18-2009, 12:08 PM
 
Location: Northern California
481 posts, read 156,175 times
Reputation: 245
Quote:
Originally Posted by jtur88 View Post
Boxing.
Boxing gloves are not considered to be lethal weapons.

Try again.
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Old 07-18-2009, 01:13 PM
 
Location: NW Nevada
7,142 posts, read 5,235,890 times
Reputation: 4882
Quote:
Originally Posted by Apples&Oranges View Post
I dislike both, but I think Whoppers are more harmful.

If everyone stopped eating meat, there would be no starvation on the planet. It takes obscene amounts of grain and water to produce one pound of beef.
ooook, so, what do we do with the large numbers of meat animals out there? Let them starve, die, and rot in the sun? Buzzards have to eat to I guess. Wild game herds? Let them breed unchecked, or do we just encourage overpopulation of predators as well? If everyone stopped eating meat it would be an ecological disaster. The death associated with the consumption of meat offends some folks sensiblities, so they do not partake. It does not bother me. I raise meat animals, and I hunt. Cattle, hogs, chickens and such are not viewed as pets in my house. They are there for a specific purpose. We don't mistreat our animals, and our hunting is done properly. If we can't take the animal with one clean shot, we don't take the shot. We don't kill for pleasure. People are not going to stop eating meat and if we did it would cause things to come crashing down around our ears. Folks that want to stay away from eating meat, for whatever reason, are welcome to do so, and I have no problem with them. So long as they dont try and legislate that I do the same. Thus, balance can be acheived.
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