U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Great Debates
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 1.5 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Jump to a detailed profile or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Business Search - 14 Million verified businesses
Search for:  near: 
 
 
Old 07-11-2009, 06:08 PM
 
Location: I think my user name clarifies that.
8,294 posts, read 13,835,902 times
Reputation: 3654
Quote:
Originally Posted by culturedmom View Post
My real issue with your question is why you think that it is "culturally acceptable" for Mexicans to drink and drive? According to FBI Crime Reports of 2006, 88.4% of people arrested for DUI were classified as White.
I say that because I worked closely with, and knew many of them. They would say the same thing: Technically, it is illegal to drive drunk in Mexico. But on a practical level, that law is not enforced, so it's as though the law doesn't exist. If you study Mexican/Hispanic culture, it is very common for countries to have laws, but not enforce them, and as a result the laws are treated as though they don't exist.


And I'm not surprised at the percentage of DUIs that are White - even though I could probably cry "RACISM!" about that comment.
Quick reply to this message

 
Old 07-11-2009, 06:15 PM
miu
 
Location: MA/NH
12,956 posts, read 21,525,631 times
Reputation: 10082
Quote:
Originally Posted by culturedmom View Post
I have worked in retail, so I understand the issue of shoplifting. However, I disgaree that stereotyping is due to repeat negative experience, but more due to perpetuating the ideas that come from a very narrow view of a group of people based on a persons limited interaction with said group. And when I talk abotu perpetuation, I am talking not only through individuals but through the media and other facits of communication. For example, it is a fact that the majority of serial killers are White men. Something like 75%. But we don't look at every White man and think he is a serial killer. I'm not denying that in your store in your area the majority of those whome you caught shoplifting were "people of color who looked and acted a certain way", but how do you know the people you weren't watching, weren't shoplifting and just getting away with it?

As for PC, I don't believe in being PC. PC means thinking one way, but acting another in order to not offend. I agree 100% that being PC is crap. I would rather people really change the way they think and grow up thinking differently so acceptance is something real and not just a show.
But we did watch ALL the people that came into the store, even the white ones. And at least with the white customers, they were actually in the store for the purpose of shopping. So they were accepting of the attention we were giving them. On the other hand, of those people that didn't want us to pay any attention to them, they were also the ones that weren't serious about actually buying anything from the store that day or in the future. And that added to their defensive attitude. Even with just browsing, white shoppers didn't mind us talking to them or following them around as they browsed as they wanted information about what we had for sale.

Retail stores are there to sell, not to be some free form of entertainment for the public.
Quick reply to this message
 
Old 07-11-2009, 06:24 PM
 
Location: Obama playing field
716 posts, read 1,357,137 times
Reputation: 352
Quote:
Originally Posted by Omaha Rocks View Post
Of course you don't understand. It's partly because you're so busy looking for racism against blacks - both overt and covert - that you can't see the forest for the trees.

If a serial killer, who was caught, happened to be black - and the media made a 24-hour per day show if it for weeks, you'd be screaming racism. RACISM!!!!
But when a serial killer, who is caught, is a white Lutheran - and the media makes a 24-hour per day show if it for weeks, you don't see anything at all.


That alone is evidence that you're looking at a lot of life with blinders on. You're reading racism into things that aren't necessarily racist.
What a stupid & over exagerated misleading example you came out with, 24hr for weeks?? lmao..

Curious, how many serial killers have been black? far as i know, many of the serial killers have all been white.
Quick reply to this message
 
Old 07-11-2009, 06:26 PM
 
Location: Rogers, AR
481 posts, read 509,689 times
Reputation: 380
Quote:
Originally Posted by Omaha Rocks View Post
I say that because I worked closely with, and knew many of them. They would say the same thing: Technically, it is illegal to drive drunk in Mexico. But on a practical level, that law is not enforced, so it's as though the law doesn't exist. If you study Mexican/Hispanic culture, it is very common for countries to have laws, but not enforce them, and as a result the laws are treated as though they don't exist.


And I'm not surprised at the percentage of DUIs that are White - even though I could probably cry "RACISM!" about that comment.
Well first I'm not sure I have to study Hispanic culture since I am Hispanic. Cuban-American to be precise. And I don't buy that if you asked any of your co-workers if it is an atribute of Mexican culture to drink and drive, that they would agree. I don't know, maybe all your co-workers are drunks. But the issue is you took a small grup of people you come in contact with and made a cultural observation. A generalization if you will. That to em is wrong. No matter how many of your co-workers drink and drive and HAPPEN to be Mexican.

But, let's give you the benefit of the doubt and say your theory on legal differences in Mexico vs America are true. That again is not a cultural atribute.

And no the fact that 88.4% of people arested for DUI happen to be White is not racist unless I go around thinking that it is a part of Caucasian American culture to drink and drive adn thus expect every White perosn I see to drive drunk. Now if the only interraction I had with White people was during my college years at UF, well then maybe I might think that. But I know enough to know that I can't just look at one subsample and generalize to the whole, cause it is just not true.
Quick reply to this message
 
Old 07-11-2009, 06:29 PM
 
Location: 30-40N 90-100W
13,856 posts, read 13,191,751 times
Reputation: 6447
Quote:
Originally Posted by Omaha Rocks View Post
Of course you don't understand. It's partly because you're so busy looking for racism against blacks - both overt and covert - that you can't see the forest for the trees.

If a serial killer, who was caught, happened to be black - and the media made a 24-hour per day show if it for weeks, you'd be screaming racism. RACISM!!!!

But when a serial killer, who is caught, is a white Lutheran - and the media makes a 24-hour per day show if it for weeks, you don't see anything at all.
But is the media making a big deal of him being white? Are they polling the "white community", or the Lutherans for this case, to see how they feel about it? How he represents us or doesn't.

I think blacks make a bigger deal because the media is traditionally more proned to connect everything a black person does to all black people. When O. J. Simpson was arrested there was lots of "how do black people feel about this?" When a black celebrity dies there's lots of "what's the black community's reaction?" Whenever a Black Republican comes about there's lots of questions about what this says of blacks or doesn't.

In my case I'd concede there's a mitigating factor in that blacks do respond differently than any other group, including Hispanics, in polls and that blacks are one of the most solidly "one party" groups in politics. White Evangelicals are similar in being vastly Republican and they do get some of the same thing. Still it can feel irritating whether you're black or white Evangelical, but at least being Evangelical is a matter of choice.
Quick reply to this message
 
Old 07-11-2009, 06:35 PM
 
Location: Rogers, AR
481 posts, read 509,689 times
Reputation: 380
BTW, Omaha Rock, I just wnated to give you props for actually debating your side and not getting all personal and attacking me just cause we disagree. I've only been on this board for a short time and it seems quite common for some people to start attacking each other.
Quick reply to this message
 
Old 07-11-2009, 06:46 PM
 
Location: Victoria TX
38,741 posts, read 36,469,190 times
Reputation: 28647
Wikipedia List of serial killers by country - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia lists 123 Serial Killers in the United States. I would welcome someone's diligent scholarship of determine how many of them were white.

A black serial killer in Harlem or Gary or Watts, who killed a dozen people, would probably not even have an investigation file on him, nor would anybody link his victims, presuming anybody paid any attention to his victims in the first place. So we have no way of knowing how many black serial killers have killed numbers of black victims. How many black Natalee Holloways have had full length feature films made about them?
Quick reply to this message
 
Old 07-11-2009, 07:07 PM
 
Location: Rogers, AR
481 posts, read 509,689 times
Reputation: 380
Quote:
Originally Posted by jtur88 View Post
Wikipedia List of serial killers by country - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia lists 123 Serial Killers in the United States. I would welcome someone's diligent scholarship of determine how many of them were white.

A black serial killer in Harlem or Gary or Watts, who killed a dozen people, would probably not even have an investigation file on him, nor would anybody link his victims, presuming anybody paid any attention to his victims in the first place. So we have no way of knowing how many black serial killers have killed numbers of black victims. How many black Natalee Holloways have had full length feature films made about them?
Well from my understanding, the definition of a serial killer is one who kills multiple people over a specific period of time and does so for the purpose of psychological gratification. It's not just about number of people killed, but the psychological factor that is key. That means mobsters who kill lots of people and gangs and the like are not considered serial killers. Therefore, most of the killings that happen in Black urban areas like you described, probably wouldn't be considered serial.

That said I do agree completely with the lack of attention that crimes whose victims are people of color get less press coverage. One only has to look at the amount of kidnapping and lost child cases that are on the media to see that White children are more likely to get coverage then chidren of color. ever heard of Alexis Patterson? Probably not. But everyone has heard of Elizabeth Smart. Both girls went missing around the same time.

BTW, I got my statistic on White serial killers from an article from the associated press that quotes a renowned criminologist Eric Kickey.

Quote:
"According to criminologist Eric Hickey, who has assembled the most extensive database on demography of serial murder states that, 88% of serial killers are male, 85% are Caucasian, and the average age when they claim their first victim is usually around 28.5.
Quick reply to this message
 
Old 07-11-2009, 07:30 PM
 
Location: I think my user name clarifies that.
8,294 posts, read 13,835,902 times
Reputation: 3654
Quote:
Originally Posted by GracieJJ View Post
What a stupid & over exagerated misleading example you came out with, 24hr for weeks?? lmao..

Curious, how many serial killers have been black? far as i know, many of the serial killers have all been white.
What a stupid & over exagerated misleading post. LMOA!Is everything you say both inflammatory and ignorant?


From 1945 to 2004, 22% of serial killers in America were black. When you note that blacks comprise roughly 13% of the population of the United States, you begin to see something troubling - specifically that a black American male is twice as likely to be a serial killer as a white American male. Unless, of course, you're a blind, angry racist...

Or maybe I should scream and cry about people being a SEXIST, because the claim is that serial killers are men!
Quick reply to this message
 
Old 07-11-2009, 07:44 PM
 
Location: I think my user name clarifies that.
8,294 posts, read 13,835,902 times
Reputation: 3654
Quote:
Originally Posted by culturedmom View Post

Again, I would think a police would question group of young kids running out of a convenience store at 2:00 am when the store owner has often complained of criminal activity. The race of the individuals should have nothing to do with it. Suspicious activity is suspicious activity.

It just seesm in each of your examples, race is not the issue and should not be the issue for action on behalf of the officer. Racial profiling means solely looking at the persons race as reason to question them. Neither of your stories fit that definition.
You're right. Race is not the issue.

But here's the problem: Too many people make it THE issue, and use racism as an excuse for their own behavior.

I live in North Omaha - a black part of the city. Virtually all my neighbors are black (And, by the way, they are absolutely FANTASTIC people. I couldn't be happier!). But in the poorer part of North Omaha - which is also primarily black - there are some serious problems with gangs, drugs and violence. Virtually all the young people involved are black.

So... Is the gang & drug violence a race problem in parts of North Omaha, or is it something else? And if it's something else, why do some blacks always scream about "racial profiling" when there's a major law enforcement crack-down that results in the arrests of a large number of black males?


It's not as simple as just race...
Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


 
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:
Over $84,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Great Debates

All times are GMT -6.

2005-2014, Advameg, Inc.

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25 - Top