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I think this is all doom and gloom coming from our current generation. Every generation has talked about the fall of humanity from one thing or another. Overpopulation, food shortage, global cooling, global warming, WWIII, etc. It keeps us sharp, on our toes, and innovating. To fall complacent is to die. Right now we are on and environmental "state of fear" about our actions and our actions are in an effort to secure energy. Before this world ends of our actions, we will learn out to extract energy in ways that are non-intrusive and with limitless energy, war will be obsolete (at least our brand of war, we'll find something else to fight over). Geo-thermal, oceanwave-mechanical, nuclear fusion, list goes on of (for the time being) limitless energy potentials.
Back to the OP, when one of these has been realized, the world economy will drastically alter. When energy is no longer a concern, many industries will to altered forever and we will have to find something else that is limited to fight over and make new doom and gloom predictions of.
Can you point to some 'real' limitless energy systems? I don't know of any.
Can you point to some 'real' limitless energy systems? I don't know of any.
Technically, nothing is limitless, but to get into that would be to start discussing proton decay theory and way off subject.
Geo-thermal Energy-This energy is obtained by running pipes into the earth and running water (pressurized) through them, the water heats up (does not boil due to pressure), this water is piped back up to the surface where it transfers it's heat to other water boiling it, we used the steam to turn turbines/generator and we get energy. The problem being the depth at which we need to pipe this water is too far currently to make it exothermic (net increase in energy). Iceland has 70% geo-thermal due to a thin crust at their geographic location. Mechanical technological advances needed to use everywhere.
Wind-Limitless but not reliable.
Solar-Limitless but not reliable.
Oceanwave Mech.-Places a series of pontoons in the ocean jointed together. As the swells move them up and down, the mechanical energy created can be converted to electrical. Low efficiencies, not much power output, unreliable.
Nuclear Fusion-Fuses the most abundant element on the planet (H) to form He. Large energy output. Draw backs are the amounts of energy needed to cause fusion. Materials technology advancement needed as currently there is no way to contain the neutron bombardment of the surrounding containment and neutron bombardment causes elemental sputtering (kills the fusion reaction) and embrittlement (structual safety issues).
Location: planet octupulous is nearing earths atmosphere
13,621 posts, read 12,731,507 times
Reputation: 20050
Quote:
Originally Posted by WalterK
I think this is all doom and gloom coming from our current generation. Every generation has talked about the fall of humanity from one thing or another. Overpopulation, food shortage, global cooling, global warming, WWIII, etc. It keeps us sharp, on our toes, and innovating. To fall complacent is to die. Right now we are on and environmental "state of fear" about our actions and our actions are in an effort to secure energy. Before this world ends of our actions, we will learn out to extract energy in ways that are non-intrusive and with limitless energy, war will be obsolete (at least our brand of war, we'll find something else to fight over). Geo-thermal, oceanwave-mechanical, nuclear fusion, list goes on of (for the time being) limitless energy potentials.
Back to the OP, when one of these has been realized, the world economy will drastically alter. When energy is no longer a concern, many industries will to altered forever and we will have to find something else that is limited to fight over and make new doom and gloom predictions of.
hypothedical, let's just say that human's came up with a perpetual motion method for generating energy.. we humans would overpopulate even faster than we are now, we would strip the resources faster and cheaper than ever before!!!! energy is not the only factor for a sound sustainable future..everything has a limit.
Strip what resources? You just cited a hypothedical situation where we obtained limitless energy. The only resources we need worry about using up are the ones to create energy. We wouldn't have to worry about air quality, no polluting releases to make any form of energy, we would have limitless energy to treat our water, we would have the energy to pipe water anywhere to grow food in the middle of the desert if we chose to. Given your hypothetical situation, I'm pretty sure I can come up with a hypothetical solution to anything.
With regards to the economy though, not sure how having unlimited "anything here" would fit in to a capitalistic system. Would probably need socialism or outright communism.
Location: planet octupulous is nearing earths atmosphere
13,621 posts, read 12,731,507 times
Reputation: 20050
Quote:
Originally Posted by WalterK
Strip what resources? You just cited a hypothedical situation where we obtained limitless energy. The only resources we need worry about using up are the ones to create energy. We wouldn't have to worry about air quality, no polluting releases to make any form of energy, we would have limitless energy to treat our water, we would have the energy to pipe water anywhere to grow food in the middle of the desert if we chose to. Given your hypothetical situation, I'm pretty sure I can come up with a hypothetical solution to anything.
With regards to the economy though, not sure how having unlimited "anything here" would fit in to a capitalistic system. Would probably need socialism or outright communism.
with cheap ulimited energy we will strip the forest, jungles, oceans> faster than what we are already doing it!!!!you can only put so many people on planet earth.
I don't see your reasoning, the reason we strip forests and jungles currently is poverty. They strip forest for energy (which is now unlimited, no need) and jungles to clear for farmland to raise cattle, but people are moving to cities and the rainforests are actually in a state of expansion right now.(Tropical rainforests are regrowing. Now what? | Green Business | Reuters)
With limitless energy, more and more people could move to cities as that's is where the free power would be piped, so jungles and rainforests no longer in danger.
As for the oceans, the only thing I've ever heard is that in someplaces they are overfished. Once again, poverty stricken countries do the over fishing as more developed countries have tighter (or any) regulation.
As for pop. size, I took three years of biology and we discussed multiple times about Earths max. capacity being somewhere near 24 billion, I suspect with unlimited energy that number could be expanded.
As for the oceans, the only thing I've ever heard is that in someplaces they are overfished. Once again, poverty stricken countries do the over fishing as more developed countries have tighter (or any) regulation.
.
Overfishing was done by developed countries, using modern high-tech equipment and processing. The Russian and Canadian factory trawlers sucked every single cod fish out of the Grand Banks in a couple of decades. It was Japan that illegally overfished Tuna.
Location: planet octupulous is nearing earths atmosphere
13,621 posts, read 12,731,507 times
Reputation: 20050
Quote:
Originally Posted by WalterK
I don't see your reasoning, the reason we strip forests and jungles currently is poverty. They strip forest for energy (which is now unlimited, no need) and jungles to clear for farmland to raise cattle, but people are moving to cities and the rainforests are actually in a state of expansion right now.(Tropical rainforests are regrowing. Now what? | Green Business | Reuters)
With limitless energy, more and more people could move to cities as that's is where the free power would be piped, so jungles and rainforests no longer in danger.
As for the oceans, the only thing I've ever heard is that in someplaces they are overfished. Once again, poverty stricken countries do the over fishing as more developed countries have tighter (or any) regulation.
As for pop. size, I took three years of biology and we discussed multiple times about Earths max. capacity being somewhere near 24 billion, I suspect with unlimited energy that number could be expanded.
it's the other way around the wealthy countries are stripping the poor countries of their resources!!! not just fish,, >>> do you know any poor people buying gold>> hardwoods like mahogany>> teak >>snakewood just to name a few examples.
even if we solve the energy crisis, we still have to get rid of greed, hate,
and stupidity>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
i can't imagine planet earth with more than 24 billion. should we wait till the turds hit the fans!!!! or should we start to really change our ways now and try to buy time to solve the complex systems that govern our everyday existance on a finite planet
I think to achieve sustainable economies would require a whole new paradigm of putting people ahead of profits, replacing capitalism with humanitarianism and to change our standard of living from consumerism back to a simple craftsman/agrarian existence.
Personally, I think this would be good thing...just might happen if we run out of fossil fuels...
What do we really need to sustain life? Shelter, food, air, water, friendship/love...chocolate...
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